Discus stressed from water change

[LoGeek]

I am very confused and would appreciate some help!

My discus are stressed out after every water change. Turning dark and hiding for an hour or so.

They are 12 juveniles from Stendker in a 30 gallon bare bottom tank. I change 50% of the water a day. The water is being aged in a polypropylene barrel with heater an circulation (same temp as discus tank).

The tap water is low in monochloramine but I add Seachem Prime to the barrel right before pumping it to the tank. I wipe down the barrel once a week.

They eat from my hand and are not panicing or being afraid of the hose. But after every water change they hide behind a sponge filter, all of them very dark.

What am I doing wrong or missing?

[bluelagoon]

For one thing your grow out tank is way too small.Probably a cycling issue.Try twice a day WC's.

[Akili]

Any idea what the polypropylene barrel was used for when you got it? Always a good idea to get a food grade one.

[LoGeek]

I'm planning on getting a larger tank as they grow. According to Stendkers website my tank is good for small juveniles (Juwel Lido 120).

Cycling issue? Sounds interesting.

I've used the tank for shrimps before getting discus. 3 weeks prior to buying my discus I filled it with a hydrogen peroxide solution, including the internal filter, for 24h. Then 100% water change and started the filter and let it run. Added Tetra SafeStart a couple of days prior to introducing the discus.

I've now kept the discus for about two weeks.

I did not clean the filter media prior to the hydrogen peroxide treatment. Maybe now it's full of dead stuff and spitting out ammonia? But wouldn't the discus love the w/c in that case? Should I take the media out and clean it in aquarium water? I also added an air driven sponge filter a couple of days ago.

I've noticed that the pH drops to 6.9 in the tank between daily water changes. As I do 50% change with aerated water with pH 7.3 the pH swings are not huge.

The aging barrel comes straight from the store so nothing has been in it. I just rinsed it with water prior to using it. It's not food grade here in Sweden, but then pretty much nothing other than stainless steel is over here. It's this one:
http://www.nisbets.co.uk/curver-wast...Detail.raction

Thanks for help, and excuse my english. It's not my first language...

[LoGeek]

I should also add that one discus has stopped eating now and is hiding with one fin clamped. It's constantly dark.

The rest of them are dark and hiding after water change, but a couple oh hours later they are begging for food when they see me.

[LoGeek]

Ok, my first reply never showed up so I'll try again.

According to Stendkers website my Juwel Lido 120l is suitable for 12 juveniles. I'm however thinking of moving them to a bigger one when they grow. Am I misinformed?

A cycling problem? Sounds interesting.

The tank has been used for shrimp. I filled it with hydrogen peroxide solution for 24h to disinfect it (including the internal filter). Then 100% w/c and let the filter run for 3 weeks before introducing discus. I added Tetra Safestart a couple of days prior to the discus.

I did not clean the filter media prior to the hydrogen peroxide treatment. Mistake? Is it now full of dead stuff polluting the water? But shouldn't the fish appreciate the w/c if that was the case?

Should I remove the filter media and clean it in aquarium water? I also added an air driven sponge filter some days ago.

The barrel is not food grade but pretty much nothing except stainless steel is over here in Sweden. It's this one:

http://www.nisbets.co.uk/curver-wast...Detail.raction

Thanks for help and excuse my english - it'snot my first language...

[LoGeek]

I have come to think of something. When picking up my fish at arrival from Germany they were packed many in the same bags. So at my LFS they had to repack them. I noticed that they filled my bags with water from their own discus aquarium. I'm worried that this contaminated my newly disinfected aquarium in some way... Any thoughts?

[Akili]

I have come to think of something. When picking up my fish at arrival from Germany they were packed many in the same bags. So at my LFS they had to repack them. I noticed that they filled my bags with water from their own discus aquarium. I'm worried that this contaminated my newly disinfected aquarium in some way... Any thoughts?

When fish are sick they do turn dark and gain their color back when they recover from treatment and that's not in your case.You have mentioned that they are only are dark for about an hour after a water changes which indicates that it could be in the water or water changing procedure.It is difficult to tell if they were cross contamination by your local fish store's water at this point.

[LoGeek]

When fish are sick they do turn dark and gain their color back when they recover from treatment and that's not in your case.You have mentioned that they are only are dark for about an hour after a water changes which indicates that it could be in the water or water changing procedure.It is difficult to tell if they were cross contamination by your local fish store's water at this point.

I guess you're right about that. Only one is constantly dark and hiding and it has been moved to QT. The rest of them look nice and eat well during feeding.

[Filip]

Logeek , after your second post the issues you are experiencing starting to get a little more clear here .

First problem IMO is an overstocked tank .
With all do respect for Mr. Stendkers carrier , success and work in the discus world I think that the tank stocking info that he provide on his site is way too optimistic in reallity and leans more towards the commercial POV rather than to hobbyists interests . So you need to provide a bigger tank ASAP.

Second.Your small and overstocked tank is nowhere near cycled and on top of that it has dirty filter from your previous setup.
All this above comes down to ammonia and nitrite issues that you experience with your discus.

I would clean the filter thoroughly and start changing rather 100% daily for a start IIWY.

As to why they feel worse immediately after a water change . Ammonia and nirtrites present in the water lowers down your PH down to 6.9 and your aged water is 7.3 .That immediate Change of PH bothers them until they accommodate to it , and after that they feel happy because of the fresh an clean water .

It all comes down to dirty water .
Get a bigger tank and start changing much more water .

[Ryan925]

Logeek , after your second post the issues you are experiencing starting to get a little more clear here .

First problem IMO is an overstocked tank .
With all do respect for Mr. Stendkers carrier , success and work in the discus world I think that the tank stocking info that he provide on his site is way too optimistic in reallity and leans more towards the commercial POV rather than to hobbyists interests . So you need to provide a bigger tank ASAP.

Second.Your small and overstocked tank is nowhere near cycled and on top of that it has dirty filter from your previous setup.
All this above comes down to ammonia and nitrite issues that you experience with your discus.

I would clean the filter thoroughly and start changing rather 100% daily for a start IIWY.

As to why they feel worse immediately after a water change . Ammonia and nirtrites present in the water lowers down your PH down to 6.9 and your aged water is 7.3 .That immediate Change of PH bothers them until they accommodate to it , and after that they feel happy because of the fresh an clean water .

It all comes down to dirty water .
Get a bigger tank and start changing much more water .

I would say you see the same answer for the majority of issues posted here. Wc wc wc. Why? Cuz it works. It's amazing what lots of fresh clean water can do. For discus being such sensitive fish I also see that they can be quite resilient if you provide them lots of clean water.

I just recently did a substrate change. After moving fish back I had issues with my turq. He had obvious equilibrium problems. Had significant fin burns of tail and pectoral fins as well as some slight burns to tip of dorsal. He also ended up with some spider webs on sides due to some scratches I believe. I was so worried cuz he looked so bad we shy and not eating. Daily large WCs had him back to eating and normal behavior in a couple days. In a week's time he has completely recovered. Fins healed and looking great.

[LoGeek]

Logeek , after your second post the issues you are experiencing starting to get a little more clear here .

First problem IMO is an overstocked tank .
With all do respect for Mr. Stendkers carrier , success and work in the discus world I think that the tank stocking info that he provide on his site is way too optimistic in reallity and leans more towards the commercial POV rather than to hobbyists interests . So you need to provide a bigger tank ASAP.

Second.Your small and overstocked tank is nowhere near cycled and on top of that it has dirty filter from your previous setup.
All this above comes down to ammonia and nitrite issues that you experience with your discus.

I would clean the filter thoroughly and start changing rather 100% daily for a start IIWY.

As to why they feel worse immediately after a water change . Ammonia and nirtrites present in the water lowers down your PH down to 6.9 and your aged water is 7.3 .That immediate Change of PH bothers them until they accommodate to it , and after that they feel happy because of the fresh an clean water .

It all comes down to dirty water .
Get a bigger tank and start changing much more water .

Ok, thanks for the reply. You are probably right. I've noticed algae on the glass in spite of daily w/c. I'll start looking for a larger tank. 60 gallon?

In the meantime I'll start out by cleaning the entire filter and doing frequent w/c.

[LoGeek]

I would say you see the same answer for the majority of issues posted here. Wc wc wc. Why? Cuz it works. It's amazing what lots of fresh clean water can do. For discus being such sensitive fish I also see that they can be quite resilient if you provide them lots of clean water.

I just recently did a substrate change. After moving fish back I had issues with my turq. He had obvious equilibrium problems. Had significant fin burns of tail and pectoral fins as well as some slight burns to tip of dorsal. He also ended up with some spider webs on sides due to some scratches I believe. I was so worried cuz he looked so bad we shy and not eating. Daily large WCs had him back to eating and normal behavior in a couple days. In a week's time he has completely recovered. Fins healed and looking great.

Thanks. Back to basics then - more water changes!

[Phillydubs]

That's rather odd that the fish store took out and rebadged the fish and used tank wayer you say ...?

You saw them go to another tank remove water and add it to a bag and out the fish in...?

[LoGeek]

That's rather odd that the fish store took out and rebadged the fish and used tank wayer you say ...?

You saw them go to another tank remove water and add it to a bag and out the fish in...?

I had ordered some different strains. Some, like my two pigeon bloods, came from Stendker packed five in the same bag. So they took a new bag with water from their own tank and put my two pigeon bloods in.