Help! Dead Discus

[Clawhammer]

Pretty sure Curing silicone gives off acetic acid.. It may be damaging their gill.

Oh no! The bottle said 24 hours and aquarium safe. It was hard, so I decided to go forward. It was actually just about 24 hours before the fish swam in water that had been through the sump. Do I need to remove the sump now? It has been in the tank for 48 hours... would it be cured?

[brewmaster15]

Eric to be safe I would disconnect it.... let it cure a few more days.

I would also add salt to the tank...1 tablespoon per 5 gals ..it will help with the gills.

Still check with your water company when they open... but that sumps a logical cause

[jmf3460]

do you have another tank you can pull the fish to with water that hasn't run through the sump?? a brute trash can anything??

[Second Hand Pat]

Or take the sump offline and do a large water change.

[Clawhammer]

I just took the sump offline and did a 100% waterchange, added salt. They are still dark and breathing heavy, although they seemed to perk up at the beginning of the waterchange. I am going to get them some privacy for 30 minutes and see if their looks improve. Will there be any residual toxins? Should I do another large WC later tonight?

If you saw my sump thread, I actually have my canisters inline. I am now going to go drain the canister and hook them back up directly to the tank (ugh) and drain my sump. I am going to let it sit for a few days then fire things back up. What do you guys think?

Can't believe I killed my favorite fish... The tube says aquarium safe and even has a silhouette of a discus on it

[brewmaster15]

You should be okay as far as water changes.. if there was a toxin leaching from the silicon and it burned the gills you may not see immediate improvement... also dont feed them anymore for the next day or so. The gills are where fish excrete alot of ammonia...if they are impaired... that ammonia has no where to go...meaning more stress.

If this is from the silicone, its a real bummer Eric. I always wait a few days when I seal a tank. In general, Cure time can be variable with silicone. Usually the set time is around 24 hours but curing can take much longer.

[Filip]

I'm very sorry about your loss Eric and I can completely relate to how you feel right now .
Less than a month ago I have lost all my 6 grown ups underestimating the huge bioload in my 20 g QT .

I can't guess the reason for your water toxicity , I would just trust Al at this point , but all I can say is that mine expressed the exact same behaviour shown on your videos before they died , one by one in less than a 10 hour period.Discus remain Calm and skittish , and one by one starting swimming listlessly and off balance with sudden quick and uncoordinated movements.All of them darkened with both fins clamped .

According to Al it was a Nitrite toxicity aka Brown blood disease and the symptoms were pretty similar like on this videos.

Do everything you can to save the rest of your gorgheous looking stock . I'll keep my fingers crossed for you Eric .

[Clawhammer]

Thanks Al. I am pretty sure you pinpointed the problem, and probably just in time. I turned off the lights, drained and hooked my canisters back up directly, the fish are looking much more normal. 10-4 on the feeding. I really want to thank you for jumping in, I think I got the sump offline just in time. I will be warning people on the forums about the risks of improper curing of silicone for the rest of my life.

Filip, appreciate the moral support, I feel terrible right now. Reading your story was helpful, your description of their behavior was dead on. I am keeping my fingers crossed too, but I am hopeful. Its been 5 hours since a loss and the fish look more energetic and have lightened up.

[Clawhammer]

... also dont feed them anymore for the next day or so. The gills are where fish excrete alot of ammonia...if they are impaired... that ammonia has no where to go...meaning more stress.(

I am thinking this is why my two biggest fish died today, they were the ones that ate the most yesterday. Probably died from Ammonia toxicity because they couldn't excrete it through their gills.

[Clawhammer]

Just wanted to upload this as a thank you to everyone who supported me today.. Seriously, kept me from losing it. Special thanks to Al again, this is the second time your advice has saved my fish. I think there should be a forum rule that states once you weigh in with a final thought, the thread should just be closed!

Its a sad day, but I believe they are on their way to recovery

[Second Hand Pat]

Really happy things are working out Eric. Al is super helpful in these situations. He has saved my fish a time or two.
Pat

[jmf3460]

are they looking better this morning Eric??

[Clawhammer]

Good morning Jacklyn, yes, things are still looking up this morning. Just completing a large WC to ensure all traces of acetic acid are out of the water. There have been no additional deaths since disconnecting the sump. Due to the rapid nature of the deaths yesterday, I am not completely breathing easy yet, but I am optimistic that the remaining discus are on the mend.

Thanks again for quickly jumping in yesterday!

[jmf3460]

I'm glad to hear that things are looking up Eric. What I really hope is that other people are reading this thread and can learn from this. If we do determine that the sealant was the sole determinant than we need to put something out there about your brand of sealant so that others don't make the same mistake.

[Clawhammer]

I'm glad to hear that things are looking up Eric. What I really hope is that other people are reading this thread and can learn from this. If we do determine that the sealant was the sole determinant than we need to put something out there about your brand of sealant so that others don't make the same mistake.

Yes! The idea that this thread could help prevent someone else from going through this makes me feel better about the situation. I did a lot of research, but never came across a warning about the silicone. I only siliconed in one thing, grating to hold my poret foam, so I didn't do much research on baffles or using the silicone.

Here is the product I used, DAP All-Purpose Adhesive Sealant 100% Silicone. The instructions give a flat 24 hour cure time. I started setting up the new arrangement after about 20 hours of cure time, but did not get water into the sump until about 25-26 hours. Regardless, what is haunting me, is that I did detect a slight vinegar smell still after 20 hours, I should have know better. Regardless, this tube has a picture of a fish on it, and it should be much more specific about the risks and cure time for aquarium applications.

download.jpgpACE3-1189037enh-z7.jpg

I do now believe with confidence the silicone was definitely the issue based on the symptoms and how they have reacted since taking the sump offline.