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Thread: Dehumidifier users please read....

  1. #1
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Dehumidifier users please read....

    Hi all,
    Over the years its been asked on SD and many other websites about using water from your dehumidifier in your tanks. I was always skeptical my concern being metals contaminating the water from the condenser coils. Concerns others have had includes, mold and bacteria, aerosols etc. I have never seen any hard evidence of any of this so I read on and on. Apparantly this water is used by kilifish keepers and guppy keepers as well pleco breeders . Its also use in planted tanks, I read that even Tom Barr used it in his . Some of the concerns people raised seemed just ridiculous to me.

    One thing that caught my eye though was repeated reports that people tested their dehumidifier water for ammonia and some found it. Aside from wondering why anyone would test it in the first place , I got curious....real curious. There should not be ammonia in it. Its basically distilled water. Atmospheric moisture condenses on the coils and drips off. I have a dehumidifier, I tested my tds and its 10-13 ppm total. Its pretty much RO water. I havent tested ammonia in many years so I will need to buy a kit.

    This is where you all come in. I am really darn curious how many of you guys have ammonia in your dehumidifier water. This thread isn't about raising Discus in this water, though I honestly may try,,,, its more academic. it just intrigues the heck out of me how some people are detecting significant Ammonia levels in their dehumidifier water....4-8 ppms in some cases.

    So if anyone out there has a dehumidifier and an ammonia test kit ( nitrites/nitrates would be great also ) and could run a test for me I would be very interested. Please post results here.


    al
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 05-12-2017 at 10:13 AM.
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    Registered Member Bizarro252's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Hi Al,
    I do not have a dehumidifier (I did at one time when I lived in a partially submerged lower section of a house in college lol) but your post got me interested.

    I took a look around because the first thing that I thought of was cleaning products, but besides Windex I dont think many people use ammonia in their house...

    Some other things that popped up are pet waste from thinks like litter boxes, decaying plant material, and just being released from neighboring farmland. The biggest one I would like to know is if these same people that had high ammonia readings had cats...

    https://www.dhs.wisconsin.gov/public.../p0/p00810.pdf

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    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Quote Originally Posted by Bizarro252 View Post
    Hi Al,
    I do not have a dehumidifier (I did at one time when I lived in a partially submerged lower section of a house in college lol) but your post got me interested.

    I took a look around because the first thing that I thought of was cleaning products, but besides Windex I dont think many people use ammonia in their house...

    Some other things that popped up are pet waste from thinks like litter boxes, decaying plant material, and just being released from neighboring farmland. The biggest one I would like to know is if these same people that had high ammonia readings had cats...

    https://www.dhs.wisconsin.gov/public.../p0/p00810.pdf
    not all had cats, which confused the issue more.. Litter boxes were the first thought I had too . I have 2 cats and a litter box near the dehumidifier so I will be very interested in my test results.



    The other thing I am researching is if there is some innate affinity by atmospheric ammonia Products and the condenser coils when moisture is involved. I can't believe that the ammonia in the air would just diffuse into the water container...concentration wise that make zero sense or we would see it in our RO water storage units. I can see a plausible scenario though where some condensing coils metals act as a chemical substrate for the ammonia in the air. Since there is air flow thru the dehumidifier, I can see that it would act to concentrate ammonia on the coil.. which the water drip off of could then transport to the storage tank or water line out. This would also help explain what some people have it others don't ...maybe its a function of the material of the coils or even age of the coils (aluminum oxidizes)

    Pretty wild hypothesis ..I know. But its why this intrigues me ..

    al
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    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    well my wild hypothesis may not be too wild ..at least as far as aluminum coils and ammonia..

    Aluminum and ammonia are highly reactive... so much so high end aluminum racing bikes often have warning labels on them telling you to keep the bike away from ammonia....very interesting. They even use it on seat posts that get stuck to dissolve away the Aluminum oxide...its that reactive! And thats an anodized ( i would guess) bike frame....can't imagine how reactive on bare aluminum coils.


    hmmmmmm..... now I am really curious.
    al
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 05-13-2017 at 09:28 AM.
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Quote Originally Posted by brewmaster15 View Post
    Aluminum and ammonia are highly reactive... so much so high end aluminum racing bikes often have warning labels on them telling you to keep the bike away from ammonia....very interesting.
    So aluminum is reactive to aluminum?
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 05-13-2017 at 09:28 AM.

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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Quote Originally Posted by pitdogg2 View Post
    So aluminum is reactive to aluminum?

    Nope... Brew is reactive to not proofing his posts when multi tasking... My bad... Aluminum is reactive to Ammonia

    Thanks!

    al
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....


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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Interesting read...Thanks!
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    I really would not have believed this if I hadn't done the experiment myself. I bought an ammonia test kit today to test my dehumidifier reservoir for ammonia. To make sure there was little chance of contamination I collected Dehumidifier waste water into a Brute garbage pail over the last few days. The pail had been sterilized and covered loosely. I then tested my well water...right from the tap and in my aging barrels ( also Brute)


    well water...zero ammonia, even in barrels that store water the same room as the dehumidifier..


    storage Tap.jpg


    and the Dehumidifier water....


    dehumidifier.jpg


    I can't believe how much ammonia is in the Dehumidifier Water ...



    al
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 05-15-2017 at 02:44 PM.
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    Registered Member nc0gnet0's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    I had the same results.
    Ex-President-North American Discus Association-NADA
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    I would test mine, but there is no need for dehumidifiers in this part of the country. If anything we would like more humidity.

    There is some good stuff in this paper on volatized ammonia in the atmosphere. My guess is that you are collecting ammonium from the air when you condense the water.

    https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp126-c6.pdf

    Natural sources of ammonia emissions to the atmosphere are volcanic eruptions, forest fires, and the decomposition of nitrogenous compounds arising from microbially-fixed nitrogen (Galbally 1985; Hegg et al. 1987; National Science Foundation 1999). Excreta from household pets, wild animals, and humans are also contributing sources (Asman and Drukker 1988; Buijsman et al. 1987; Crutzen 1983).
    ...
    In the atmosphere, ammonia can exist in its gaseous state, be dissolved in rain, the water of fog, or clouds, or be found as ammonium in particulates and aerosols.
    ...
    The reaction of atmospheric ammonia with acidic substances in the air results in the formation of ammonium aerosols that can subsequently be removed from the atmosphere by dry or wet deposition. In general, dry deposition processes predominate where there are high amounts of NH3 emissions; where NH3 emissions are lower, wet deposition of particulate NH4+ predominates (Asman et al. 1998).

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    Moderator Team LizStreithorst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Astounding, No wonder my fish told me that they didn't like it!
    Mama Bear

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Quote Originally Posted by DJW View Post
    I would test mine, but there is no need for dehumidifiers in this part of the country. If anything we would like more humidity.

    There is some good stuff in this paper on volatized ammonia in the atmosphere. My guess is that you are collecting ammonium from the air when you condense the water.

    https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp126-c6.pdf

    Natural sources of ammonia emissions to the atmosphere are volcanic eruptions, forest fires, and the decomposition of nitrogenous compounds arising from microbially-fixed nitrogen (Galbally 1985; Hegg et al. 1987; National Science Foundation 1999). Excreta from household pets, wild animals, and humans are also contributing sources (Asman and Drukker 1988; Buijsman et al. 1987; Crutzen 1983).
    ...
    In the atmosphere, ammonia can exist in its gaseous state, be dissolved in rain, the water of fog, or clouds, or be found as ammonium in particulates and aerosols.
    ...
    The reaction of atmospheric ammonia with acidic substances in the air results in the formation of ammonium aerosols that can subsequently be removed from the atmosphere by dry or wet deposition. In general, dry deposition processes predominate where there are high amounts of NH3 emissions; where NH3 emissions are lower, wet deposition of particulate NH4+ predominates (Asman et al. 1998).
    Hmmmm... interesting and may be onto something Dan.


    Rick made a comment to me in as we discussed this... kind of funny. Looks like a great way to maintain Biofilters when theres no fish...Who needs to add ammonia,...Dehumidifier water instead!

    al
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    Registered Member Jenene's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    Do I win anything Al? Mine seems to be off the charts. Yikes! Dehumidifier.jpg
    "You can't trust water: Even a straight stick turns crooked in it." -W.C.Fields

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    Default Re: Dehumidifier users please read....

    wow urs is even cycling!

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