Laying on Bottom - Sick?

[brewmaster15]

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That box does 75gal..i think...not expensive.

[Clawhammer]

Thanks Al, definitely affordable as far as medicating discus in a 120 gallon tank goes... Plus, unlike nitrofurazone, it is great to cook with.

I had 75% of what I needed already in stock

[Phillydubs]

Any progress ?

[Clawhammer]

The Silver PB has been laying in the same spot for some time and I would be shocked if he made it, but I have never been through this before. The other nine OG fish are all very stressed and hiding / dark / clamped, although they seem to not have gotten worse for a few hours. The four new ones seem slightly stressed, as you would expect from a PP treatment.

This thread should serve as a caution to use a hero fish, especially when combining discus from different regions of the world. A two month QT seems to have been effective at showing the new fish could handle my tank pathogens, but it did not test the effect on my OG stock.

[Filip]

What a bummer Eric . Im hoping for the best for your fish . The notorious Asian vs European discus "thing" again.

Just curious Eric .What do you have for meds. In your tank right now ? PP and salt combined together ?
What's your PP dosage ?
Are there any better news till this moment ?

[Clawhammer]

What a bummer Eric . Im hoping for the best for your fish . The notorious Asian vs European discus "thing" again.

Just curious Eric .What do you have for meds. In your tank right now ? PP and salt combined together ?
What's your PP dosage ?
Are there any better news till this moment ?

Hi Filip. Currently I have 1 tbsp per gallon of salt and PP in the tank. I was advised by Kenny to go on color, and aim for a slight pink color for 24 hours. We knew this was not possbile because of the recent water change w/ Prime. So the guidance was to add a small amount at a time so there was some active in the tank until the water took on a brown/orange hue instead of just yellow. I had to add small amounts about 10 times to get to this point. I added approx .25 to .5 ppm per dose.

I went to sleep last night expecting to wake up to a tank full of dead discus. All the discus were black, slimy, hiding in some weird places, breathing heavy. 3 were laying on the bottom and the silver pb I thought was actually dead. However, when I woke up this morning they were all swimming about except the silver pg, who was still in that divot in the log, but breathing much better and more responsive to my presence. It is a marked improvement from yesterday.

I added another approx 1 ppm of PP to get a light pink hue, I think all the prime is spent because the color is pretty stable. The plan is to treat with PP for another 6-8 hours w/ a light pink hue and then do a 90 % wc, and continuing with the salt treatment for a few days. If the disease persists or comes back, I will then use kanamycin.

[Second Hand Pat]

Eric, that is great news. I would not have thought that mixing PP with salt would be a good thing but it is working for you. Super glad to hear things are looking up with the fish. That is great news.
Pat

[Clawhammer]

Thanks Pat, I am not sure if they are out of the woods yet, but definitely moving in the right direction. They are acting more stressed now that I am adding PP to the tank again.

I also just noticed that quite a few have a clamped gill, which is cause for concern.

I don't see much slime coat sloughing at this point, which is an improvement

[Ryan925]

Glad to see some progression here.

Keep us posted

[Clawhammer]

Eric,
This does sound like what can happen when you mix stock from different suppliers. Kenny's suggestion of pp is a good first line of defense here as it will oxidize bacteria and thats most likely the cause... large water changes can also help. In many cases this kind of bacterial issue resolves itself in a few days but it sounds like yours are hard hit. Id follow up the pp bath with Salt as Pat suggested ...go with 1 tablespoon per 1 gal water and maintain that for several days. Furan2 can also be used if you want as Pat suggested but since you have kanamycin, you can go with that. When or if to use the antibiotic is your call. Its hard to say if the pp and salt alone will do the trick.

Hth,
Al

Hi Al. I actually do have nitrofurazone on hand. Jehmco does not carry furan-2 anymore and referred me to the nitrofurazone. Should I still use Kanamycin, or is nitrofurazone preferable?

[Ryan925]

Hi Al. I actually do have nitrofurazone on hand. Jehmco does not carry furan-2 anymore and referred me to the nitrofurazone. Should I still use Kanamycin, or is nitrofurazone preferable?

You should be able to find furan 2 at pet smart

[Clawhammer]

You should be able to find furan 2 at pet smart

Yes, I will buy it if it is a better treatment, although I believe nitrofurazone is practically the same stuff, or the major component of furan-2. It turns the water yellow in the same way. I have a tonne of Nitrofurazone (100 grams)

[brewmaster15]

Eric, The Nitrofurazone is a decent med by itself.... but what makes furan 2 so useful is the combination of it with the Furazlidone. Since you have Nitro....I'd suggest picking up some Furazlidone from Jehmco.. The used to sell the two combined as bi-furan. .. The 3rd ingredient is meth Blue which Jehmco also sells..


I think given the way the fish are reacting and that you arent still neutralizing the PP with Safe...I'd stop the PP... a typical PP bath is 4 hours where the PP is active and thats a measured 2 ppm. You could do more harm than good at this point as least in the long term.

al

[Clawhammer]

Hi Al. I neutralized the PP and did a 80% WC (all aged water). Upon viewing them through clear water, they are still looking pretty rough. Here are some pics, there are four piled at the bottom. Any additional guidance will be helpful..

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[brewmaster15]

Definitely keep the salt in there Eric. I think Time and clean water will be your best friend here but you may want to try the antibiotic too. Its a hard call as in many cases the fish come around on their own in a few days.

al