Crazy dude

[MarkGSmith]

DISEASE QUESTIONNAIRE


Problem

1. Please explain the problems with your fish. When did you notice the problems and did anything unusual happen that you think started them?

Four days ago one of the Discus had a random shooting around the tank crashing into things episode. he has done it maybe once a day since. Everything else is normal and he feeds/swims without problem. There is nothing spooking him either.

2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds).

No other symptoms, just a 10 second lunacy spell.


3. What medications/ treatments have you already tried and what were the results. Include dosage and duration of treatment.

I added Epsom salt at 1 tablespoon per 10G 3 days ago for 24hrs. Last night I added Kusuri at the recommended dose. (Flubedazole I think).



Tank/Water

4. Tank size and ages, numbers and sizes of fish.

320L tank, 48x18x24 inches. 5 Discus total and 9 black neons.
The Discus I have had for 6 weeks, all 3-3.5 inches. They have grown about an inch in the time I've had them.


5. Water change regime (What percentage and how often).

I change a minimum of 60% daily. The last three days I've been doing 2 changes per day.


6. How long has tank been running? Is it bare bottom? If you have substrate, what type and how deep is it?

Tank has been running for 3 months, it is bare bottom.


7. Do you age your water? If you do for how long and what is the ph swing.

No real swing in PH, 7.5 from tap. TDS is 90. I age the water for 24hrs with aeration and add Prime to it about an hour before change. If I do 2 changes per day its aged for 12 hours.

8. Parameters and water source;

Note: Water Parameters are important in diagnosing problems within a tank. If you don't own test kits for the following information, you can purchase them, test your parameters and post this info as soon as possible.


- temp _____30c

- ph _____7.4

- ammonia reading ____0

- nitrite reading ____0

- nitrate reading ____5-10ppm

What type of water or combinations of water sources do you use? If it is an RO/tap/well water mix, please list percentages in the mix.

- well water ____

- municipal water ____yes

- RO water ____


9. Any new fish, plants or inverts added recently.

No


10. Please tell us what you feed your fish and how often. This can be critical information for solving the problem so be as specific as you can.

I feed a mixture of Blackworm(freeze dried), NLS grow, frozen brineshrimp & bloodworm with spirulina and garlic. Some frozen discus cubes BH based. I thaw the frozen stuff before feeding.


11. Include any pictures or videos you have which shows the symptoms. If you can't add them to this post, please provide a link to them.

[Phillydubs]

Weird... Any reason for the twice a day changes? Do you notice this issue when you do that or did it start around the double dip in changes?

Have you tested the water after only the 12 hour age as opposed to the 24 hr? Is something off there maybe?

The only thing that comes to my mind in reading your questionnaire (thank you for doing so) is something with the extra WC. I know its way more common in wilds, but some have said, that too big large or frequent changes can have a negative effect or bring on "whirling" like behavior which it seems you are experiencing or seeing. Have you tried to take a day off or give them a break and lower feedings a bit and see how he behaves?

[MarkGSmith]

I test the water at all stages, OCD! Theres never been a problem there and I'm sure its not a water issue now. I just started doubling up the changes after the first time the Kobalt exhibited this behaviour because I was trying to be proactive....panicking!

Since I got them I've been deliberately loud and in there face when it comes to feeding and they come to greet me whenever I'm doing anything now, getting in the way looking for food when I'm hoovering the tank etc.

I think from what I read around the net that I am gonna have to use Prazi but I can't get any for a week. thanks for the help.

[MarkGSmith]

Its still doing the same. it seems to be after feeding...does not matter which food. All the others are OK still.
Any pointers please?
I find a lot of this happening whilst searching but no real answers.
Thanks.

[LizStreithorst]

I think that he has fish epilepsy or something else affecting his brain. It doesn't sound contagious but it does sound like it will get worse over time. Hope I'm wrong.

[MarkGSmith]

Well he is still the same but now he has a couple of injuries from swimming into things at mad speed. A big scrape on his head and a scratch down one side. He has darkened a little not surprisingly but will still feed. Wish I had an answer.
To try to prevent further injury and stop unsettling the other healthy fish I've moved him into a 65L plastic storage box but I'm wondering how long I keep this up? I can find many similiar tales but none with a positive outcome and direction.
Its kinda frustrating, I half wish it was a water prob or something that I could react to.

[LizStreithorst]

I know that you don't want to do it but I believe that you should euthanize him now. You know that it he's not going to get better. It will be easier on you in the long run emotionally. When you decide to do the deed post again. Different people like different methods.

[MarkGSmith]

Well that is the inevitable outcome but I'm waiting for a microscope to arrive. I planned and read for a long time to have these fish so I will do my best to get an answer. If i do find anything I'll post back of course. Thanks.

[MarkGSmith]

I did not euthanise the guy int the end as he was not hurting himself anymore, a couple of days ago I found some Koi general tonic in my cupboard. just in date so worth a shot. Well blow me down with a feather duster, he seems ok now!
Don't know if its the tonic or just time but I'm pleased because he is well pretty!
BTW the tonic contains Bronopol, Copper, Formaldehyde and silver.
I'd still like to know what exactly the cause was and whether it was the tonic that fixed it but that may not be possible.

[LizStreithorst]

I'm so happy for you. I didn't think the fish had a prayer.

[Phillydubs]

Did that scope ever come and did you get to take a peek at feces?

[LizStreithorst]

What makes you think that what caused this was due to something that could be seen in the poo, Phil? It sounded neurological to me.

[Kyla]

I had a discus that did the exact same thing for a couple months. I thought he would die, too but refused to take him out of the tank because there were no other visible symptoms and he was still eating well. Then one day he just stopped. He has never done it since.

[MarkGSmith]

Just an update to this for anyone with similiar silly fish. After a week back in the main tank he started doing it again so had to be put back into his padded cell. (plastic bin). I left him there until a couple of weeks ago and he is now back in the main tank bossing it! He is the smallest and a little stunted I think, probs due to me neglecting his padded cell. Here is a pic anyways:

IMG_20170824_213118.jpg

Maybe he'll have a spurt maybe no...love them all anyways!

[Filip]

I had similar whirling experiences in the past.
Here are some links from my experiences and what have worked for me :

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showth...rling+symptoms


http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showth...rling+symptoms