Setting up my first discus tank

[irigi]

Hello! My name is Jan, I am from Czech Republic (Europe) and I am in the hobby around two years. Ever since the beginning, I am dreaming about keeping discus. I read lot of stuff about the nitrification cycle, to cycle to tank before putting fish in, water changes, how to set up the tank, what is the proper amount of light, etc. I started with keeping neon tetras and corys in 30 gallon tank and later added Endler guppys. About 6 months ago, I bought 66 gallon tank (which is as far as I can go, unfortunately) and after cycling the tank, I bought glowlight tetras, blue and gold ram cihlids and later also gold gourami. (Not the best combination, actually, they fight the rams and some of the rams died, probably because of stress.)

I am thinking about moving ram cihlids and guaramis away from this tank and buying 4-5 discus, so that they would have the tank for themselves. (Maybe keep the tetras. Also, I do not want to combine discus with corys, because I am afraid that they dig in the substrate too much, which could make the water too dirty, even with the water changes.) It is a planted tank, btw.

I wanted to ask you few questions before I go buy the discus. I will be very grateful for your answers.

1) My tap water has the following parameters: total hardness: 6 GH, carbonate hardness 3 GH, pH 7.5, NO3: 25 mg/l. Do I need to treat my water somehow, or is it OK for discus? (reverse osmosis, nitrate filers, etc?)

2) In the aquarium, I have filter Bioflow 3.0 from Juwel. ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3de4L9dehzc ) I bought my tank as a set. They put this filter even to 33 gallon tanks, so I am a bit concerned it might not be enough - some of my ram cihlids are dying and even though it could be because of the guaramis, it might also be because of the filtration. Friend recommended me JBL e1501 external filter or similar ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoJrDuP2wf0 ). Should I upgrade? Will the JBL e1501 be enough?

Thank you!

[Paul Sabucchi]

Hi, I am relatively new to discus but have benefitred greatly from the advice on this forum. This is how I see it: in a 66 gal you can fit about 7 discus. Are you planning to buy young fish to grow out? If so I would keep it simple, leave the tank bare bottom and with just the internal filter (easy to clean/change floss and sponges as often as possible). Your water is ok except for NO3 so you will need at least a nitrate purifier to remove them before you use it for your tank. At least to start I would not add any other species of fish. Get all your fish all at once from the same origin, ideally directly from the breeder (got any good ones nearby? Can you get any from Piwowarsky in Germany?). It pays to buy quality. Change at least 50% water every day and give good food. Good luck and ciao from Italy

[bluelagoon]

The blue rams are sensitive to high nitrates as are discus.RO is the best way to go.

[Fishrfood]

Hi I am a discuss newb (I started a 55 gallon community-in early stages)

But I have kept fish for years so I am aware of the basics. First thing is first, your current water parameters: the pH is ok IFF (if and only if) the source of your fish is in similar conditions and if you can maintain the pH and hardness consistent. The nitrate is too high at 25. To me that means immediate water change. You have to develop a schedule to maintain it lower. I don't know if that means daily water changes or weekly, that depends on all the factors of your set up combined and can be determined by experimentation.

A good option for you may be as blue lagoon suggested.

I am very concerned about why your rams died. Did the gouramis constantly keep them in a corner? I hope they didn't suffer because of water quality.

Anyways, you mention you want to remove the corys. I would have to advise against that. The corys would actually eat uneatend bits of food that the discuss don't eat. The messy eaters are the discuss not the corys lol. The discuss spit their food out and some falls to the bottom. This is when the corys help to eat uneaten food.

You should vacuum the substrate lightly anyways. For discuss I checked the juwel 3 m and it does not look like a top quality filter. The heater has no number system to start. I also read that this filter allows neons to get trapped in the filter. I have a fluval 306 for my 55 gallon and for me it is just doing enough. But for a 66 gallon I would get more powerful filtration.

[darshan.more]

Hi Jan, How long is this 66G tank running? Your nitrate levels are too high. Also check for ammonia and Nitrite levels too. Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate have severe impact on Discus. Your PH can be ok if it is stable. Also if you are just starting with Discus its better to have bare bottom. This will help you to siphon out left out food. There are many who keep their discus in planted tank with substrate but will make things bit difficult to maintain to begin with. Your filter might not be enough for 66G you can counter that with regular water changes. This all depends on if you are buying adult discus or want to grow out juveniles.
Growing out juveniles can be fun

[Paul Sabucchi]

Guys irigi said his TAP water has 25mg/l nitrates not his tank water!

[irigi]

Thank you very much for your answers and for welcoming me to the forum!

The nitrate is too high at 25. To me that means immediate water change.

Your water is ok except for NO3 so you will need at least a nitrate purifier to remove them before you use it for your tank.

The blue rams are sensitive to high nitrates as are discus. RO is the best way to go.

This is what I was suspecting - the teritorial guaramis might have been a trigger, but the nitrates are probably the problem. It seems clear that if I want to keep discus, I will have to treat my tap water. I was planning to go with two 50% water changes per week. If I want to use reverse osmosis for such volumes of water, it will require some planning, as I live in a flat with not so much space. But let's see, maybe I will find a way. I was also considering some alternatives:

1) Condition water with nitrate minus, for example this one. However, from what they write, it does not directly remove NO3 from water. It just supports anaerobic denitrification in the substrate, so it is probably too slow for solving my problem and it would be quite surprising, if it can get nitrates under 20 mg/l. Do you have some good experience with some other water treatment of this kind? (Preferably if it can remove the nitrates before I put the water into the tank).

2) Colleague recommended me ionex filters for nitrate removal. Example is SZAT Clear Water. As I understand it, it is placed into filter and it should remove NH4, NO2 and NO3. It is "recharged" every 1-2 months by putting the medium into salt. Do you have experience with this solution in your discus tanks? (Perhaps I could try it out before buying discus, on my other aquarium - and if that does not work, I will have to go for RO.)

3) If I go for reverse osmosis, how do I need to treat the RO water? I probably need to add some salt, or discus buffer, otherwise there would be a risk of pH jumps. Can you recommend me any particular product you use? Or provide some link where it is explained?

Hi Jan, How long is this 66G tank running? Also check for ammonia and Nitrite levels too. Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate have severe impact on Discus. Your PH can be ok if it is stable.

Readings for ammonia and nitrite are zero in the tank. However, for sensitive fish, I am not sure if I can trust the tests - low concentrations would be harmful, but they can still show zero reading in the test. Maybe I should go for better filter "just in case".

The tank runs for 6 months now, so it should be well cycled, I hope.

[Ryan925]

Thank you very much for your answers and for welcoming me to the forum!





This is what I was suspecting - the teritorial guaramis might have been a trigger, but the nitrates are probably the problem. It seems clear that if I want to keep discus, I will have to treat my tap water. I was planning to go with two 50% water changes per week. If I want to use reverse osmosis for such volumes of water, it will require some planning, as I live in a flat with not so much space. But let's see, maybe I will find a way. I was also considering some alternatives:

1) Condition water with nitrate minus, for example this one. However, from what they write, it does not directly remove NO3 from water. It just supports anaerobic denitrification in the substrate, so it is probably too slow for solving my problem and it would be quite surprising, if it can get nitrates under 20 mg/l. Do you have some good experience with some other water treatment of this kind? (Preferably if it can remove the nitrates before I put the water into the tank).

2) Colleague recommended me ionex filters for nitrate removal. Example is SZAT Clear Water. As I understand it, it is placed into filter and it should remove NH4, NO2 and NO3. It is "recharged" every 1-2 months by putting the medium into salt. Do you have experience with this solution in your discus tanks? (Perhaps I could try it out before buying discus, on my other aquarium - and if that does not work, I will have to go for RO.)

3) If I go for reverse osmosis, how do I need to treat the RO water? I probably need to add some salt, or discus buffer, otherwise there would be a risk of pH jumps. Can you recommend me any particular product you use? Or provide some link where it is explained?




Readings for ammonia and nitrite are zero in the tank. However, for sensitive fish, I am not sure if I can trust the tests - low concentrations would be harmful, but they can still show zero reading in the test. Maybe I should go for better filter "just in case".

The tank runs for 6 months now, so it should be well cycled, I hope.

There was a recent thread with someone in a similar position. It is along the lines of your option 2. He used one of those nitrate resins to remove nitrate in an aging barrel prior to adding to the tank. If you use the search feature you should be able to find it or maybe someone can post a link.

R/O will definitely solve your problem and yes you would need to add back minerals. Many R/O users here can recommend the proper product for you. I have seen a few mentioned here.

Found it

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showth...itrate+removal

[gators111]

First off, Welcome to the wonderful world of discus, also known as the science water keeping. I did the apartment life with discus for 10 years with 55 gallon, a ~33 gallon water barrel, and an RO/DI unit. In one way, the compact space makes water changes a lot easier. You just gotta maximize your space. Since this is your first time, I would advise against going planted. That introduces a lot of variables that can make keeping discus a major pain. I would stick to either a bare bottom tank or one with a light coat of pool filter sand. Get a RO/DI unit such as this: https://airwaterice.com/reefkeepers-...rium-rodi.html. It's a big investment, but they last for years and have the added benefit of making great drinking water. I don't know much about your filter, but that JBL looks to be right. As for the rams, they'll be fine with discus. I don't know where you got your rams, but unless you got them from a breeder, they are probably from Asia and therefore aren't worth anything. I've seen rams in many a store, but when I went to a large breeder, they were as similar as an oscar is to a discus. So don't feel bad about your rams. IF you get a year out of them, you did well. Certain Cories will do well with them, they just have to able to handle 29-30C. And the gouramis will have to be removed, they'll pick at any young discus. Anyways, hope that helps. Also, do your research on here and scientific papers on aquaculture are invaluable. Good luck!

[Filip]

Hi Jan and welcome to Discus.

I would pick your second option and run SZAT Clearwater in your aging water tank (you can fit an 100 liter aging tank/ barrel under your tank in your cabinet ).
I haven't used SZAT my self yet but I have read many positive reviews about it on stripping nitrates from the water .People claim that its far more efficient than purigen and it keeps the water crystal clear.

Try starting with a minimalistic setup . Very thin layer of sand , less than 1 cm if you must , and a few potted plants and decor that should be ready for moving around tank while siphoning sand , which you must do pretty frequently with discus .

Good luck on your choice and please show us some fine discus in near future Jan .