What is a "Select Grade" and "A grade" discus?

[Larry Bugg]

I've been looking at Daca show discus from what I can see, 7 out of 10 discus have an egg/football shaped body with excellent fins and 3 out of 10 have very round bodies. I included a collage with some of the discus in the show with what I consider to be an egg shaped body. In 2017 show 2 winners had what I would consider egg shaped bodies with excellent fins and the rest were all extremely round. I including picture references of the 2 winners with egg bodies.

It would seem that judges do look at the whole body plus fins but when they award ribbons they prefer the more round bodied discus because only 2 discus that had egg shaped bodies were chosen as winners.

Lol, the person that told you earlier in this thread that they are judged round including the fins is a certified NADA judge.

[HappyFace]

[LizStreithorst]

What Wilie said

[HappyFace]

People who haven't been keeping discus very long might see a beautiful, round-bodied, show-winning discus and put all other discus up to that standard like I did. A lot of posts here talk about football-shaped discus being bad and only circle-shaped discus are good. That's why I made this post.

After receiving some great comments I did more research, not just looking at the show winner but also all the competitors. I posted picture examples here incase anyone else might be interested in this topic. I'm sure people who have been on this forum for 10-20 years have no need for this post.

[Larry Bugg]

When we refer to football shaped we are also talking about fins included, not just the body.

[zhuls1]

Hello Hiedi, if you are interested in quality, look at discus from international shows, the quality at the internationals are far better than that at most of the domestic shows. Like that picture I posted, it was from an international show. Also, shape will to some degree depend on strain. The best shaped strains are by far turqs, followed by blue diamonds. The reason for this it that they are far closer to wild discus genetically speaking. Throughout the years many of the newer strains have been heavily line bred and inbred, this enhances whatever feature they are focusing on, however it also exaggerates their faults too.

[HappyFace]

When we refer to football shaped we are also talking about fins included, not just the body.

Thank you Larry. I think maybe I've been a bit confused because a lot of the really bad quality discus look sort of look triangle and boomerang shaped to me but everyone calls them football's so I thought they were referring to just the body and that anything football shape is bad. I'm sorry for my confusion.

Hello Hiedi, if you are interested in quality, look at discus from international shows, the quality at the internationals are far better than that at most of the domestic shows. Like that picture I posted, it was from an international show. Also, shape will to some degree depend on strain. The best shaped strains are by far turqs, followed by blue diamonds. The reason for this it that they are far closer to wild discus genetically speaking. Throughout the years many of the newer strains have been heavily line bred and inbred, this enhances whatever feature they are focusing on, however it also exaggerates their faults too.

Thank you Zac. I will look at the international shows. That's interesting about the linebreeding and inbreeding. Makes sense.

[bluelagoon]

It distressed me to have a discus in my tank with an egg shaped body. They must be a circle to be in my tank. I'm not sure why it bothers me.

I have a koi with one fin that I adore, several others with badly torn and frayed fins but I still think they are gorgeous. My son has severe scoliosis and back hump but I think he couldn't be more beautiful. Not sure why I expect so much of my discus.

Hi,they even breed discus with spines that look like scoliosis,called bulldogs.A shame really,but some folks think they're awesome.

[Second Hand Pat]

I would like to add that you generally can not judge a discus from one picture. An odd angle can make a nice discus look "off". You really need to see a discus in person IMO.
Pat

[RogueDiscus]

Hi Larry,
Just playing devil's advocate here, but I think we're seeing more and more "nice" fish with round bodies, plus the fins. I can see how you'd like the dorsal, anal and tail fins to be generally round when combined, but how are the round bodies judged, and what about streamers? At this point, I tend to ask for round bodies plus fins.

[HappyFace]

Hi,they even breed discus with spines that look like scoliosis,called bulldogs.A shame really,but some folks think they're awesome.

Poor fish.

I would like to add that you generally can not judge a discus from one picture. An odd angle can make a nice discus look "off". You really need to see a discus in person IMO.
Pat

Thank you Pat. That's a very good point.

Hi Larry,
Just playing devil's advocate here, but I think we're seeing more and more "nice" fish with round bodies, plus the fins. I can see how you'd like the dorsal, anal and tail fins to be generally round when combined, but how are the round bodies judged, and what about streamers? At this point, I tend to ask for round bodies plus fins.

This is exactly what I did with my last batches of discus. I asked for a circular body without the fins, circular even when the fins are clamped. One of the sellers acted like they didn't understand what I meant.

[HappyFace]

Hello Hiedi, if you are interested in quality, look at discus from international shows, the quality at the internationals are far better than that at most of the domestic shows. Like that picture I posted, it was from an international show. Also, shape will to some degree depend on strain. The best shaped strains are by far turqs, followed by blue diamonds. The reason for this it that they are far closer to wild discus genetically speaking. Throughout the years many of the newer strains have been heavily line bred and inbred, this enhances whatever feature they are focusing on, however it also exaggerates their faults too.

The international shows should come with the warning "Viewer discretion advised. Watching may cause you to cull all your fish."

[zhuls1]

Hi,they even breed discus with spines that look like scoliosis,called bulldogs.A shame really,but some folks think they're awesome.

According to Andrew Soh's book discus the naked truth, These extremely high bodied strains are actually a deformity caused by a particular strain of bacteria. Basically, it's a harmful bacteria which is why it deforms the fish. Also, they do not breed true as it is not a strain as such, but simply a deformation. If you breed it, some may become very high bodied, but this is not genetic rather it is phenotypical, caused by the bacteria spread from the parents. Personally, I would avoid these strains.

[zhuls1]

The international shows should come with the warning "Viewer discretion advised. Watching may cause you to cull all your fish."

LOL, careful of what you watch... Maybe competitions of the 80s will be better than JK. If you look at books from the 80's, you'l see just how far discus have come since than. Big difference in show fish than as compared to what they look like now.

[bluelagoon]

According to Andrew Soh's book discus the naked truth, These extremely high bodied strains are actually a deformity caused by a particular strain of bacteria. Basically, it's a harmful bacteria which is why it deforms the fish. Also, they do not breed true as it is not a strain as such, but simply a deformation. If you breed it, some may become very high bodied, but this is not genetic rather it is phenotypical, caused by the bacteria spread from the parents. Personally, I would avoid these strains.

So,you're saying that these bulldogs when bred together,it is most likely they will not reproduce offspring with curved spines?