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Thread: Power bill

  1. #16
    Moderator Team Paul Sabucchi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    We all have to learn from each other and in a forum like this there is a place for "traditionalists" but there must also be room for mavericks without whom it risks becoming staid and boring, as long as the welfare of the fish is understood to always come first

  2. #17
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    Default Re: Power bill

    People are free to keep their tanks however they see fit however there is a world of a difference between surviving and thriving. A discus may "survive" being kept in sub optimal conditions but they wont "thrive" . Sooner or latter you will have health issues. .Any organism has a range it can tolerate for its environment... but as you move from the optimal range the organism gets more stressed out, becomes more prone to illness. Longevity decreases.They become sick more often and tend to die sooner than if kept more optimally. Its basic biology. If you want to know what a discus optimal range of temperature is look at the wild populations. Im sure they can survive at temps lower than that but there is a cost to the organism if you exceed the minimal range they need. Generally the range for discus is low to mid 80s.

    If the goal is to keep your fish alive a bit "survive" regardless of the stress it puts on them keep them at whatever temp you want and accept what happens. If the goal is to give them the parameters they need to "thrive" try to match as many of their natural habitats parameters as you can. Thats what.good husbandry is all about. Its a responsibility to care for your animals that allows them to thrive...not just survive a bit.
    Jmo.
    Al
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 08-06-2018 at 01:15 PM.
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  3. #18
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    Let's look that this from a logical perspective. Discus are considered a warm water fish. We know this from literature written by folks whom have gone to the Amazon and measured the temp along with other parameters in a variety of locations. Once the rain season starts the water cools, wild discus spawn and the cycle starts over again. So discus could be adapted to cooler temp for a short period of time. But what if the discus are subjected to cool water all the time. It certainly slows down the metabolism of the fish and also it's ability to react quickly to any disease or stress parameters. Pretty sure long term low temps will have a decidedly harmful effect on the fish.
    My two cents,
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  4. #19
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    Another point is we KNOW that domestic discus thrive at warm temps. They eat well, grow well and live a long time. Enough said.
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  5. #20
    Moderator Team Paul Sabucchi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    Again I agree with all of these arguments, as Al stated all organisms have an optimum of parameters to which I they are adapted, the more the environment deviates from these and the harder the compensatory mechanisms (process called homeostasis) have to work, but this will take it's toll both at general, organ and cellular level. It is also my very personal and unsubstantiated opinion that the concept of "wellness" for want of a better word is very important especially with those animal species that, being naturally a prey, have been naturally selected not to show signs of weakness or disease on pain of attracting predators; very often these species show signs of being unwell only once the problem has become very serious. For these reasons I think I owe my fish the effort to try keeping them in their sweet spot.

  6. #21
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    candymancan, not one single person has been rude to you in this forum, not one. Many have disagreed with you however and you can not seem to handle that. You are free to keep your discus however you choose. However we have to counter some of your advice simply because it does not reflect the best way discus should be kept. We have many new members who come to learn about keeping discus or who come to this forum because they bought sick discus and need help with them. We are here to get them off to the best start or help them recover the discus they have.

    We have tried to help you and honestly you do not want help. You have countered all the good advice given. Enough said!
    Pat
    Last edited by Second Hand Pat; 08-07-2018 at 07:48 AM.
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  7. #22
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    Apologies everyone. The Forum has a zero tolerance policy for vulgarity. Inflammatory posting is not welcome here.


    The offending post has been removed.

    al
    AquaticSuppliers.com Freeze Dried BlackWorms and other foods your Discus will Love!!!


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  8. #23
    Moderator Team LizStreithorst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    I'd been keeping an eye on this guy ever since he posted in his plague thread but it wasn't until this morning I went back and looked at his posts in other forums that I had missed. He seemed to have been itching for a fight for a while but nobody here took the bait, in fact the mods were very polite to him. He did the only think he had left to do...just went and hung himself. We don't need people like that here.
    Mama Bear

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    Default Re: Power bill

    Sorry if my thread started somthing . Thanks for all the help I took some advice and will be turning down the heat over time till I reach around 82to83 . I also wrapped My sumps 3 side and aging barrel in that silver insulating stuff I got of amazon. Ps this site is amazing with all the info and knowledge u guys have to offer can’t be beat. At the end of the day it’s all about the discus .

  10. #25
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    Default Re: Power bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Kfactor View Post
    Sorry if my thread started somthing .
    You didn't start anything other than to ask a legitimate question... Good for you!!! The only way to learn is to ask!

  11. #26
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    Default Re: Power bill

    Quote Originally Posted by jeep View Post
    You didn't start anything other than to ask a legitimate question... Good for you!!! The only way to learn is to ask!
    +1 .

    And I'm very glad if our answers helped you in any way . That's why we are here for , to help each other improving in the hobby and have fun while doing it .

  12. #27
    Moderator Team LizStreithorst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    This was in no way your fault. We had a troll. I'm not the only one who was watching him. He was sure to cross the line at some point. Unfortunately, he chose your thread to go ballistic in.
    Mama Bear

  13. #28
    Moderator Team Paul Sabucchi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Power bill

    Besides...nice change to think about colder seasons and having to heat up the water. Here with all the heaters off the tanks are between 84 and 84 .5F without cooling, which is fine and dandy if you are a discus but if you are most other kind of fish probably not so much. I have fans on most other tanks, on the bigger ones I usually put two 120mm pc fans. They can bring the water temperature down 6-7 Deg F, in the smaller ones 80mm fans and on the nanos I use aFan ones

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