ChicagoDiscus.com     Cafepress Store

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 51

Thread: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

  1. #31

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rolla P View Post
    With a light sprinkle of peppering of course.



    When I made this thread asking for a definition it wasn't based specifically on the debates I had seen here. More so the debate I had seen everywhere... First and foremost I have a lot of respect for everyone on both sides of this issue. Your thoughts and your postings really is a wealth of knowledge and part of the reason I can approach keeping this species with some confidence. That said, from the outside looking in stumbling across this debate can seem like a minefield. I genuinely didn't have a clue as to why there were opposing sides with some vehemently (again not here specifically but around the hobbyist sections of the web) saying it shouldn't even be considered.

    I hold my hand up super high and say that personally I'm nowhere near as experienced as some of you are when it comes to discus. But once the argument was been laid out in it's pure form I must admit to feeling some confidence. There are so many ways around the issue of dirt and detritus collecting and causing problems. From the type of plants used through to the aqua scape itself.

    Watching the Discus interact with the planted setup, watching them dance, play and swim in and among the plants isn't a sight I'd give up willingly. I have been video documenting the "journey" so to speak and will share that with you all in the next two weeks or so. I think a distinction should be made between those with knowledge in the planted tank arena those that don't. I mean, I'm far from a planted expert but on the other hand still experienced enough to attempt to build a planted tank around the species.
    Beautiful , that's what I,m talking about Dee

  2. #32

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dee1958 View Post
    Pat I'm not real techy but I will give it another shot. Dee


    Bazinga, my planted tank with fryDSCN0212.jpg[ATDSCN0219.jpgDSCN0215.jpgTACH]123950[/ATTACH]

  3. #33

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by slicksta View Post
    I'm always amazed at the bravado of those who feel free to exploit another species on the planet.
    It's bad enough what we do with our food supply but at least with that you can argue that the intent is nobile.
    But to do it for perceived beauty and perfection that has no basis in science is inexcusable

    You broke my heart Willie. . . You broke my heart. . .

    Attachment 123949
    I agree, and some people are forever NEWBIES

  4. #34
    Registered Member pastry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Charleston, SC
    Posts
    2,694

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    Dee, sorry sorry. I haven't read back through all the post but were those fry born in there? Can you keep this thread going as they grow and provide pictures? I did that on my tank for over a year ( original discs were not born in there but got them when they were as small as an inch... 3 from another sponsor were introduced at the same time and they were about 2.5 inches). Had one pair raise fry in tank successfully (successfully defined as reaching adult hood in tank... But bad WC regime during that time kept it from reaching any size... I was going through full time job, newborn kids, and masters program at night).
    -Elliot

  5. #35
    Registered Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    76
    Real Name
    Rich

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    Think the point some are missing is not that you can not get one fry to survive in a planted tank but that if you are even attempting to have fry, why would you not want as many of them to live as possible? When my fish lay eggs, I want all 100+ of them to survive, little difficult to observe and catch a problem of fry dying in one of the planted tanks posted. So it is more about what you want not what others think. If 1-2 of 100 fry is acceptable to you then that is your prerogative. Please lets not go with the AMAZON debate unless your willing to run your hose 24/7 in your planted discus tank then give the results.IMG_2116[1].jpg
    PS These are what I would consider fry.
    Thanks,
    Rich

  6. #36
    Registered Member slicksta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    1,047

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    And what may I ask are you doing with 100 fry?
    Are you culling all but the roundest largest fish?
    Or are you running your hose 24/7 to keep them all happy

  7. #37
    Registered Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    76
    Real Name
    Rich

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    I will see when I get them to a good size and go from there, I am not in a planted tank, nor comparing my tank to the Amazon so no need to run my hose 24/7, I do however vacuum after every feeding and do 1 water change a day. Pretty sure this thread was about planted tanks, not culling fish though!
    Thanks,
    Rich

  8. #38
    Registered Member slicksta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    1,047

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    And I don't believe anyone said that a planted tank was optimal for raising the most fry. But like you said, it depends what your desired end result is.
    If you're looking to only gain a few fish and let a more natural selection process take place then what's the problem with planted.
    If you're goal is to raise as many as possible then kill all that don't meet your standards... Then by all means, please proceed.

  9. #39
    Registered Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    76
    Real Name
    Rich

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    I agree, so don't know what your getting at. I am stating that one person needs and concerns don't work for what others that don't share their views are doing. So to say that they don't know why people preach they have to use BB and change water all the time when the Amazon has plant and doesn't change its water every day but discus live and breed there, or that they think they can grow fry in a planted tank and don't see why people say you cant. Well to me you cant, but that is because I want more than 1 to survive, to you they can cause you don't mind getting 1/100. what ever works for you. And by you I don't mean you(slicksta)

  10. #40
    Registered Member slicksta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    1,047

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    My current breeding pair are in a bb.
    And I'm not agreeing with the statements made by (banned)
    My point is that those that say bb is the ONLY way, are those that have a different perspective then me on fish keeping.

  11. #41
    Registered Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    76
    Real Name
    Rich

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    I agree, its not the only way, but I do believe that for newcomers it is the only way to know what you are doing wrong without having 100 other factors to think about(makes impossible to know what is affecting your fish). Then when you have experience knowing your discus fish, do what you like. Saves on the thousands of help sick fish posts! I believe we should get to know any species of fish we intend to keep, and what like to thrive. people just seem to get more upset when the fish cost a little more then they want all the help seeing what they are doing wrong. I admit I am guilty of some of the same things but have learned and changed some.
    Thanks
    Rich

  12. #42
    Registered Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    76
    Real Name
    Rich

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?


  13. #43
    Registered Member slicksta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    1,047

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    I can agree with that. .
    Nice group of fry there, good luck. . . though the parent is a little big eyed. My current male breeder is guilty of the same. lol :-D
    But my thoughts also lean towards letting natural selection have some role in what fish survive. If we let fish breed a little more the way we keep them then those that survive will be better suited.
    Again not advocating breeding fish that will survive in a swamp but a sterile environment can be counter productive in my view. I'm thinking a lower survival rate with less culling for perceived beauty may result in a more robust fish better suited for the environment in which we provide.
    If you read any of my other rants. . you'll realize I'm in the minority. . .so what the hell do I know.

  14. #44
    Registered Member pastry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Charleston, SC
    Posts
    2,694

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by mbruizer187 View Post
    Think the point some are missing is not that you can not get one fry to survive in a planted tank but that if you are even attempting to have fry, why would you not want as many of them to live as possible? When my fish lay eggs, I want all 100+ of them to survive, little difficult to observe and catch a problem of fry dying in one of the planted tanks posted. So it is more about what you want not what others think. If 1-2 of 100 fry is acceptable to you then that is your prerogative. Please lets not go with the AMAZON debate unless your willing to run your hose 24/7 in your planted discus tank then give the results.IMG_2116[1].jpg
    PS These are what I would consider fry.
    Thanks,
    Rich
    Rich, like someone pointed out, its what's the goal. I set the bar low so I'm never Dissapointed

    I don't want many to survive (only 1 or 2 if any) because my wife won't let me have another tank. So I understock my 150 in case 1 or 2 make it. Now, when that has happened it's been bad timing since my work life interfered and those few fish SUCKED in regards to development. I just leave my fish alone... however (guilty!)b when I see a pair spawn and try to raise fry I always root for them ... but I don't interfere (ok, I did once with a mesh net divider contraption).

    I just hate saying all that because newbies to discus may think, "Well hell, I can get by without BB. I've kept fish for years," but then they never learn how beautiful discus can be and see their full potential.

    So I'm with you, Rich, but I have my own intent while also realizing the implications. I only talked about my imperfections so may be someone who has an improvement discovery on substrate, planted, and Driftwood aquariums with discus might not be hesitant to share on here.
    -Elliot

  15. #45
    Homesteader RogueDiscus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    OR
    Posts
    3,130
    Real Name
    Steve

    Default Re: Can someone "define" the argument against planted tanks?

    "If we let fish breed a little more the way we keep them then those that survive will be better suited."

    How do we keep them? We keep the water clean, we cultivate beneficial bacteria cultures, we do our best to allow as many as possible to survive, but when deformities exist, we cull. We pick and choose desired traits from those that survive. I think the Amazon does the same. Even if someone chooses to cull more for a specific goal, to suggest that you can raise discus in a tank in a way that allows for more natural selection I think is wrong. If you're willing to accept 12 or less fish surviving from a spawn in a certain environment, go ahead. I have. You may get one or two nice fish. If you're trying to raise a quantity of healthy fish in tanks, I think folks have figured that out pretty well.

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Cafepress