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Thread: Advice ,freely given

  1. #1
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Advice ,freely given

    Its been a long time since I put up a thread here so I thought I would jot down some things that I have been thinking. Some of you may have noticed I had been absent for a a few months. These have been trying times for me with several very sick family members that I am caregiver for. I needed to step back the forum and other things to deal with this and come to terms with my new reality. In doing so I have had to also look at my use of time and my role in the hobby, and think about things hard. Still working on all that stuff, and still thinking so no resolution there yet...but ah thats life I guess.

    I have recently tried to take up some of my other things like the forum again and take my mind off things. While I was away I must have reset things because coming back made me see alot of things here that I was probably so used to I no longer thought about them. I started writing things down.. little notes to myself of things that I should post, suggestions, experiences. So here they are for your benefit or perhaps disagreement. They are my views and experiences..my thoughts and nothing more.

    1) People really do need to quarantine and should have a hospitol tank if they want to be in the aquarium hobby. We spend hundreds to thousands on our fish, filtration, food, electricity, water and time...and skimp on what allows us to properly keep our new and existing fish safe. Do not skip it, do not trust the seller to do it for you, do not do it for some fish like your discus but not for non-discus in the tank (many pathogens are not species specific). YOu will be happy if you follow this advice. If you don't you, well, thats going to be one of those regrets,

    2) Why must people make it so difficult? Yes there are many ways to successfully keep discus...at the basis though you just need decent filtration, good water quality( most easily achieved through water changes), good food, good healthy quarantined stock, appropriate temperature and some lighting. Put these together and Discus are not hard to keep and not hard to breed. If you want to spend thousands on various high tech lighting, filtration etc thats all well and good but you don't need it... you want it. Potential newcomers to the discus Hobby, take this to heart. Start with the basics, limit the parameters and build from there.

    3)
    Why is it that some keepers preach one thing but do another? Probably because we are humans and make mistakes , and have short term memories. When you are reading posted advice on the forum, there is a neat feature that allows you to read the back posts of member. Just view their profile and read the back posts. Use it.You can get a good feel if someone is legit or full of it. I might add that though this function is one of the forums great aspects, it is mostly lacking on Facebook and other social media, so take what you read there with a large grain of salt,

    4) If you see someone posting pictures of healthy fish, tanks of fry, spawn after spawn, sharing videos, and sharing what they do to achieve it odds are they know what they are doing and you should probably take notes. The proof is really in the pudding.. if a member talks about the recipe for the pudding but doesn't make it, find another recipe.

    5) Take it slow. Get your fish all at once where you can...same seller , same time...Resist the urge to go on a buying spree from several sellers when you get the bug. Discus from multiple sources more often than not have issues when mixed. Quarantine.Quarantine, Q................................................. ........................

    6)
    You aren't going to make money selling discus unless you really stink as an accountant and forget to take everything into account...The food, water, electricity, time all adds up. Most forget to consider the time aspect and time truly is money. I have seen so many sellers come and go, and very few make it more than a few years. Its hard work and customer loyalty is often as short lived as the list of new strains you carry. Even among hobbyists, if you spend some time thinking the costs...you might take up another hobby. Do it for the love and enjoyment of the fish.. As a recovering Discus addict that has fallen back on his old ways, I can attest to the costs everytime I get my electric bill!

    7) Foods.. Discus are picky eaters at times, Whats the best food? Ask 10 people and they will give you multiple answers ..Live Blackworms, freeze dried blackworms, Homemade Beefheart or seafood mix, Turkey Breast, salmon, Hikari Blood worms, tetra color bits, etc.. We have so many choices...which is best, which to use? We all have our favourites that we think is the best because our fish seem to really like them or they are economical or clean foods. Most all probably work ok to some degree. If you ask me, Of course I am going to say the Freeze Dried Australian Blackworms I sell and personally use... Thats a no brainer., shameless I know. But seriously how can a hobbyist know? Start by reading the label and comparing. If you can't pronounce the ingredients look them up. Look for good sources of protein and an a decent amount of fat.. Take some time understanding basic nutrition... Thats alot of work I know. Today we want it answered.. Alexa.. "whats the best discus food?" Alexa answers..."Freeze Dried Australian Blackworms,DUH!" okay so she probably won't have the answer unless she keeps discus or Jeff Bezos does. Heres a short cut to your answer, Don't just ask what food to feed, look at the results achieved feeding it.. Does this person have healthy fish? are they growing well? Do they Breed and fertilize eggs well? If so then odds are what they are feeding is probably adequate...
    Think about that "proof is in the Pudding" thing. oh and by the way.. "Which is Better ?" is a pointless question by itself. It depends on your goals and your particular situation and economics.

    8)
    Peoples fingers are undergoing evolution at a rapid pace and no longer are capable of typing and writing responses of any length. This has been linked to a shortening of attention span, and decrease in cognitive neuromotor skills. Its being studied by scientists at the NIH.. seriously, Im not joking. Its thought its caused by either preservatives in the food we eat, Video games, Amazon, Ebay, and Facebook. Conspiracy theorists also believe its part of a martian attack plan to subjugate humanity. Though theres compelling evidence for that, my Guess is we are getting a tad lazy and over stimulated by all the external stimuli in our lives.,,In any case.. People still read here , so at least the damage to humanity hasn't gone that far.


    I have more to add to this list, but its a start... Please do not be offended it by it.. its hardly worth it in the big scheme of things , however, I am sure there are some good nuggets of advice buried in this post somewhere.

    Al
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 09-19-2019 at 11:35 AM.
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    >>>>>I am a science guy.. show me the science minus the BS

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  2. #2
    Registered Member + MVP danotaylor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Well said...sorry my reply is so short

  3. #3
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Quote Originally Posted by danotaylor View Post
    Well said...sorry my reply is so short
    Lmao!
    AquaticSuppliers.com Freeze Dried BlackWorms and other foods your Discus will Love!!!


    >>>>>I am a science guy.. show me the science minus the BS

    Al Sabetta
    Simplydiscus LLC Owner
    Aquaticsuppliers.com


    I take Pics.. click here for my Flickr images

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    8) TLR



    9) Watch your fish, every day. With a hectic life schedules, water changes, regular feedings, multiple tanks it can be easy for us to miss the guy that is swimming with the pack but not getting his fair share of food. We only notice until it is too late and then we have a herculean effort to bring the fish back to health. It is difficult to do, I recently lost a discus due to this very thing, when I noticed I was already too late.

    9a) Medicate methodically. If you are doing 9 properly waiting to get an expert's opinion and starting with the appropriate medication is a much better way to go than just scattershot treating with meds.

  5. #5
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    James excellent points. Thank you for the add on!

    Al
    AquaticSuppliers.com Freeze Dried BlackWorms and other foods your Discus will Love!!!


    >>>>>I am a science guy.. show me the science minus the BS

    Al Sabetta
    Simplydiscus LLC Owner
    Aquaticsuppliers.com


    I take Pics.. click here for my Flickr images

  6. #6
    Administrator jeep's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Great post! This is a perfect example of why the forum is such an important resource and could never be replaced the likes of "social media".

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Much appreciation from here. I joined to tap into exactly this kind of wealth of experience. Taking the intimidating out of keeping Discus sounds good to me. �� Thanks for posting.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Absolutely well said. Al. Glad to see you posting Again.
    Tom.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Good post Al! I want to comment on your #7 above. I got 2" Flachen discus from Hans last Fall. Their main food is your worms. They are now large and beautiful and breeding. I also have a bare bottom tank, 3 large sponge filters, 2 good heaters and do at least 50% water change daily with tap water right out of the faucet,and add Safe. Nothing else special. No need for all the fancy stuff. Here is a pic from 2 mo. ago. They are larger and more beautiful now.

    Barb
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    Last edited by Disgirl; 09-19-2019 at 03:02 PM.


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  10. #10
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    They look wonderful, Barb. Hansie picked out some nice one for you and with your care they have grown out well.
    Mama Bear

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Hi Al,

    Firstly, hope everything is ok on your end with family etc. Thanks for taking the time to write this post.
    As a newcomer to discus I am so glad I followed the advice here, in particular switching to BB tank. At first I hated it, but now I actually love the look of a clean BB. Also now I see just how dirty the tank gets and couldn’t imagine having substrate now!
    I have definitely relearnt everything I thought I knew about fish keeping, mainly water!
    In my opinion, I think you have to go into a hobby with a certain expectation/reality regardless of what it is. For discus, I knew I would be spending thousands(which I have so far) and knew full well I could potentially lose every single one of them. I also knew it would take a lot of my spare time, as I am a self employed builder and have a family. I see it all the time on social media where someone buys 2-3 discus, puts them in a less than ideal setup and complains when they get sick?! If people only spent a bit more time researching about the animals they wanted to keep, it could save a lot of heartache, time and money. If you ask me, research is half the fun!
    I think it’s great that SD is still running strong as social media usually kills activity on forums, as answers are not instant and abundant.

    Anyway great work and hopefully after some time I can give back.
    Last edited by BrendanJ23; 09-19-2019 at 04:18 PM.

  12. #12
    Registered Member Shan_Evolved's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Great write up OP. I can tell you know your stuff from the pixels on my screen

    Maybe you can give me some advice? I have done a massive planted tank running co2 and EI dosing and was very successful this past year. I am moving and want to dab into discus next - but I won't start until January (after my move).

    I am located in Southern Virginia, so Hans Discus is only a 3-4hr drive. I am planning on getting a 55 gal to grow out 2.5" discus (I love the idea of growing them up), and a 55 gal barrel for water changes. I plan on keeping discus in either a 75g or a 125g (I haven't decided yet) once they get 4.5"+. But for growing out, I plan for a 55gal unless smaller is recommended? BB with food siphoning 10 mins after every feeding of course.

    I wish to get 12-16 discus and will commit to 3-5 feedings a day and daily 90% WC from my aged barrel. After they grow out, I will keep 8-10 of the ones I like to put into a bigger tank. For food I wanted to buy your Australian worms along with han's beefheart mix.

    Just some quick silly questions - do I need to do a fishless cycle for my tank even with 90% daily water changes? (I know this takes awhile as I've done it before.) Is it okay to get 12-14 2.5" juvies to start out with or should I get more? (I'm getting more so I can keep the most colorful rather be stuck with ones that don't color up just in case. Unless this is a bad idea and hans fish are ALL fine?)

    thanks for reading!

  13. #13
    Homesteader Filip's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Great read Al. This looks like a future " Stickie" to me , especially if people care to add up their most important discus keeping wisdoms , as James did .

  14. #14
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Quote Originally Posted by Shan_Evolved View Post
    Great write up OP. I can tell you know your stuff from the pixels on my screen

    Maybe you can give me some advice? I have done a massive planted tank running co2 and EI dosing and was very successful this past year. I am moving and want to dab into discus next - but I won't start until January (after my move).

    I am located in Southern Virginia, so Hans Discus is only a 3-4hr drive. I am planning on getting a 55 gal to grow out 2.5" discus (I love the idea of growing them up), and a 55 gal barrel for water changes. I plan on keeping discus in either a 75g or a 125g (I haven't decided yet) once they get 4.5"+. But for growing out, I plan for a 55gal unless smaller is recommended? BB with food siphoning 10 mins after every feeding of course.

    I wish to get 12-16 discus and will commit to 3-5 feedings a day and daily 90% WC from my aged barrel. After they grow out, I will keep 8-10 of the ones I like to put into a bigger tank. For food I wanted to buy your Australian worms along with han's beefheart mix.

    Just some quick silly questions - do I need to do a fishless cycle for my tank even with 90% daily water changes? (I know this takes awhile as I've done it before.) Is it okay to get 12-14 2.5" juvies to start out with or should I get more? (I'm getting more so I can keep the most colorful rather be stuck with ones that don't color up just in case. Unless this is a bad idea and hans fish are ALL fine?)

    thanks for reading!
    Welcome to the Hobby!

    Going with Hans is a good start here especially since youare close enough to hand pick the fish and pick his brain as well. He has a wealth of knowledge.

    I would go with the 125 .. the 75 is fine for a group of 10 -ish adults if you are on your waterchanges but thats a hatchery tank. If you want to enjoy them most give them swimming room.14-16 2.5 " fish in a 125 gal tank is great!

    Yes you can just do water changes and no cycle but honestly its a pain. Life throws us curves.. get busy and you may miss you wcs.. thats potentially a disaster in the making.

    Al
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 09-23-2019 at 04:01 PM.
    AquaticSuppliers.com Freeze Dried BlackWorms and other foods your Discus will Love!!!


    >>>>>I am a science guy.. show me the science minus the BS

    Al Sabetta
    Simplydiscus LLC Owner
    Aquaticsuppliers.com


    I take Pics.. click here for my Flickr images

  15. #15
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice ,freely given

    Quote Originally Posted by BrendanJ23 View Post
    Hi Al,

    Firstly, hope everything is ok on your end with family etc. Thanks for taking the time to write this post.
    As a newcomer to discus I am so glad I followed the advice here, in particular switching to BB tank. At first I hated it, but now I actually love the look of a clean BB. Also now I see just how dirty the tank gets and couldn’t imagine having substrate now!
    I have definitely relearnt everything I thought I knew about fish keeping, mainly water!
    In my opinion, I think you have to go into a hobby with a certain expectation/reality regardless of what it is. For discus, I knew I would be spending thousands(which I have so far) and knew full well I could potentially lose every single one of them. I also knew it would take a lot of my spare time, as I am a self employed builder and have a family. I see it all the time on social media where someone buys 2-3 discus, puts them in a less than ideal setup and complains when they get sick?! If people only spent a bit more time researching about the animals they wanted to keep, it could save a lot of heartache, time and money. If you ask me, research is half the fun!
    I think it’s great that SD is still running strong as social media usually kills activity on forums, as answers are not instant and abundant.

    Anyway great work and hopefully after some time I can give back.
    Thank you Brendan for your well wishes and thoughts.Hope to aee more posts from you!

    Al
    AquaticSuppliers.com Freeze Dried BlackWorms and other foods your Discus will Love!!!


    >>>>>I am a science guy.. show me the science minus the BS

    Al Sabetta
    Simplydiscus LLC Owner
    Aquaticsuppliers.com


    I take Pics.. click here for my Flickr images

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