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Thread: New Project

  1. #31
    Homesteader RogueDiscus's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    I've had several spawns with my rams, but they never get past a couple days free swimming. The parents give up or eat them. I haven't tried removing the parents yet, but if I decide to really try to raise some, that will be next.

  2. #32
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Quote Originally Posted by LizStreithorst View Post
    Congratulations Pat Husband. I envy you and am also a bit jealous of you. Why can you do it when I can't? I have to be doing something wrong but don't know what.
    Thanks Liz but only at step one. Lots of steps to go lol so I have not done it yet. I am sure your fish will be ready at some point.
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  3. #33
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Quote Originally Posted by RogueDiscus View Post
    I've had several spawns with my rams, but they never get past a couple days free swimming. The parents give up or eat them. I haven't tried removing the parents yet, but if I decide to really try to raise some, that will be next.
    What are you feeding the fry Steve? I had a conversation with Ryan and normal BBS is too big for the fry. He said to get the San Francisco Strain of BBS from Brine Shrimp Direct as this strain is small enough for the ram fry. Ryan also said if doing a water change that the water has to be the exact parameters of the tank water. Ram fry are very delicate.
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  4. #34
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    I was prepared when both pairs showed signs of spawning. Here videos of both pairs. The camcorder allowed me to get some nice detail.

    This pair is tending the eggs.


    I think this pair ate their eggs. Spawning site was in the middle of the tank.
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  5. #35
    Registered Member coralbandit's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Most rams will not be comfortable raising fry in large aquariums in my experience ..
    I have found in 5 and 10g tanks that they can be great parents as they worry less??
    Not to be heartless as my discus [2 separate pairs ] breed almost every or every other week and I have had zero success ,but it does my heart good to hear how hard you all think rams are !
    I wish all fish were as easy for me !
    I buy regular 90% hatch BBS eggs from brine shrimp direct[not the SF type] and have never had ram fry that did not eat them day 1 free swimming ...Without them I would not be anywhere with rams IMO ?I hatch 3 batches a day and feed them within hours of being hatched ,I never 'save' any ...I just make more new ..3 batches everyday for the last 3-4 years ….
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhFp68wjRUU
    ^^ My fish room tour by Richsfishes ^^
    Got rams ?

  6. #36
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Quote Originally Posted by coralbandit View Post
    Most rams will not be comfortable raising fry in large aquariums in my experience ..
    I have found in 5 and 10g tanks that they can be great parents as they worry less??
    Not to be heartless as my discus [2 separate pairs ] breed almost every or every other week and I have had zero success ,but it does my heart good to hear how hard you all think rams are !
    I wish all fish were as easy for me !
    I buy regular 90% hatch BBS eggs from brine shrimp direct[not the SF type] and have never had ram fry that did not eat them day 1 free swimming ...Without them I would not be anywhere with rams IMO ?I hatch 3 batches a day and feed them within hours of being hatched ,I never 'save' any ...I just make more new ..3 batches everyday for the last 3-4 years ….
    Hi Tom, I am sure you are correct with the rams but this group needed to be in a larger tank and they decided to spawn. I also figured they would. As to whether it is successful or not who knows. I have successfully raised wild discus fry and apisto fry so not a stranger to this. This morning the eggs were fertile. You could see the fry in the eggs (talk about cool).

    IMG_3748.jpg

    Tonight when I arrived home from Thanksgiving dinner with my daughter and family the eggs were gone. The pair were guarding the site so guessing the fry are squirreled away in a pit. I suspect tomorrow I will know more. I will report back in the morning.
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  7. #37
    Homesteader RogueDiscus's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Great egg pic, Pat!

  8. #38
    Registered Member coralbandit's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Moving the eggs/wigglers is a good sign ..Usually rams will move good eggs and wigglers to a new clean and safe spot .
    I hope you see a cloud of fry soon !
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhFp68wjRUU
    ^^ My fish room tour by Richsfishes ^^
    Got rams ?

  9. #39
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Quote Originally Posted by coralbandit View Post
    Moving the eggs/wigglers is a good sign ..Usually rams will move good eggs and wigglers to a new clean and safe spot .
    I hope you see a cloud of fry soon !
    Thanks Tom, so I have both the vineger eels and smaller BBS on order but doubt any of this arrives in time. I am assuming if there are fry, they would use up their egg sack by the third day after hatching. I have a wild idea to take some of the cubed FD blackworms and grind the cube into dust like I do for discus fry but grind it as fine as possible. I would soak a small portion of that in some warm water to totally hydrate it. I would then suck a small portion into a 10ml syringe, attach a bit of flexible airhose to the tip of the syringe with a length of rigid airhose to the other end of the flexible airhose. This little rig allows me to do some very precise targeted feeding while trying to not crowd the parents.
    Pat
    Last edited by Second Hand Pat; 11-29-2019 at 08:09 AM.
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  10. #40
    Moderator Team LizStreithorst's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    do you have plants in any of your tanks? I accidentally raised some Boesemani fry by just taking a big wad of java moss out of the pair's tank and putting it in another tank with no air and no heater. One day I glanced at that tank and noticed fish! They survived and grew eating nothing but the microorganisms on the java moss. It might at least tide you over until your stuff arrives.
    Mama Bear

  11. #41
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Quote Originally Posted by LizStreithorst View Post
    do you have plants in any of your tanks? I accidentally raised some Boesemani fry by just taking a big wad of java moss out of the pair's tank and putting it in another tank with no air and no heater. One day I glanced at that tank and noticed fish! They survived and grew eating nothing but the microorganisms on the java moss. It might at least tide you over until your stuff arrives.
    Interesting idea Liz. I do have some plants in my guppy bowl (yet, have a few guppies lol) which are free floating (Java Fern).
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  12. #42
    Moderator Team LizStreithorst's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    I'd weigh part of the java fern down close to the eggs so that when the babies hatch, it's right there for them.
    Mama Bear

  13. #43
    Registered Member coralbandit's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    There is definitely infusoria in mosses .I like subbwassertang as it doesn't clog as much ..Driftwood with algae is great also ..
    Any body here use Golden pearls ? They are the food I train rams from live to prepared with ..
    I start with 100 micron near end of week 1 free swimming .
    I sprinkle it on surface and then syringe in BBS and they mix .
    Golden pearls are known as one of if not the most buoyant of prepared foods so the time it dwells in the water column "tricks" the fish ..It can mimic live food especially when mixed in ..
    Kensfish carries Golden pearls and feed them to all my fish ..They are sized from 50 micron [too small IMO] all they way upto 800 -1000 micron ..
    I feed the 800 to my disc and adult rams .
    I think the dust of black worms may work .
    I really think when you can hatch BBS they will work .Your rams look good enough size to lay proper sized eggs ..
    On the Vinnegar eels I know a breeder in UK who starts dosing small amounts of vinegar eels onto the driftwood when the eggs turn to wigglers..
    He theorizes that one of the main reasons ram eat their fry is they fear a lack of suitable food and by showing the parents their is ample food they do better ..
    Sounds sort of silly ,but mind you I don't use VE I do feed my breeders live BBS[I hatch 3 batches everyday] so I make sure the parents know their is food on purpose now and have more pairs raising fry then ever before !
    Maybe more pairs now then I have ever had in all my previous years added up before this little addendum to my breeding efforts ..
    I hope you get to see fry swim with their parents ..It is the best part of fish keeping and breeding for me .
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhFp68wjRUU
    ^^ My fish room tour by Richsfishes ^^
    Got rams ?

  14. #44
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    Quote Originally Posted by coralbandit View Post
    There is definitely infusoria in mosses .I like subbwassertang as it doesn't clog as much ..Driftwood with algae is great also ..
    Any body here use Golden pearls ? They are the food I train rams from live to prepared with ..
    I start with 100 micron near end of week 1 free swimming .
    I sprinkle it on surface and then syringe in BBS and they mix .
    Golden pearls are known as one of if not the most buoyant of prepared foods so the time it dwells in the water column "tricks" the fish ..It can mimic live food especially when mixed in ..
    Kensfish carries Golden pearls and feed them to all my fish ..They are sized from 50 micron [too small IMO] all they way upto 800 -1000 micron ..
    I feed the 800 to my disc and adult rams .
    I think the dust of black worms may work .
    I really think when you can hatch BBS they will work .Your rams look good enough size to lay proper sized eggs ..
    On the Vinnegar eels I know a breeder in UK who starts dosing small amounts of vinegar eels onto the driftwood when the eggs turn to wigglers..
    He theorizes that one of the main reasons ram eat their fry is they fear a lack of suitable food and by showing the parents their is ample food they do better ..
    Sounds sort of silly ,but mind you I don't use VE I do feed my breeders live BBS[I hatch 3 batches everyday] so I make sure the parents know their is food on purpose now and have more pairs raising fry then ever before !
    Maybe more pairs now then I have ever had in all my previous years added up before this little addendum to my breeding efforts ..
    I hope you get to see fry swim with their parents ..It is the best part of fish keeping and breeding for me .
    Hi Tom, some nice hints here and I can definitely start up the hatchery and hatch some BBS for the adult rams. I feed the rams BBS which I was hatching BBS for the Cuipeua F1s (the rams were still small). Live BBS should be a excellent conditioning food for the adult rams. When you mix the golden pearls with the live BBS for the fry Tom what size are you using?

    So definitely do not have fry. Another couple has formed and taken over the breeding site. I like this new couple better as the hard rays are much better on this new male. Funny how the emphasis has switched from planted to breeding lol. Learning a lot, the fish are good teachers lol.
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  15. #45
    Registered Member coralbandit's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Project

    I start my fry at 100 micron .
    Kens fish food is really affordable so I get every size of Golden pearls and Grow meal .Over 4 sizes of each ..
    The affordability of Kens food is how my fish manage to eat Als Blackworms daily also !
    I think between the three foods I really have a winning combo ..

    You should find the pair you like best get them a 10g tank and place it right next to others so they can see each other ..
    That will be your best bet and most fun of all the learning ..
    I keep my pairs side by side in shotgun tanks with a white divider across the bottom half of tank for privacy ..
    I make them eat face to face and the behavior is outrageous ! They get mad when you feed the neighbor first ..Real mad !
    The spirit of competition kept in check works great for the flashy little fish ..
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhFp68wjRUU
    ^^ My fish room tour by Richsfishes ^^
    Got rams ?

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