Shan's First Discus Journey

[Iminit]

Shan is the sump going to be the only filtration? If your going to be using the sponges from your 75 also. You can use them for dead spots. Yes a pump can be used for 2 outputs. Part may be found on the site Francis sent you. For me it’s keep it simple . Because I like to have at least 2 filters running I use a power head with 2 sponges in chambers. The odyssea 350. This move 350g through the sponges. These I rinse when doing water changes. On eBay it’s about $20 shipped. I have this set up on the opposite side of my tank from the main output.

[LizStreithorst]

@Tom

Yeah I understand that idea - - but my anxiety over loss of cycle makes me feel better if I were to start a brand new cycle with fishless cycling method. It shouldn't take too long since I've done it enough times to get it down to a cycle. That and I also want to use ceramic rings as biomedia in my sump rather than rely on the sponges. From talking my understanding of sponges, unless you have the proper water and air flow pulling water through the actual sponges themselves, you are limiting your surface area for BB to grow. And with my shitty water and cleaning habits - I want to make sure that I have enough BB to keep everything in check. As well as drilling the tank to lower its value - I'm doing it because I have never dabbled in a sump before and I'm excited to do so, as well as increase the overall volume of water I have to 150 ish for my 14 discus + other smaller fish I plan on putting in it.


@Brian

I've reduced the water changes to every 2 days and my nitrites have fallen from rising up to 2ppm+ every 24hr to less than 1ppm every 48hr. So I know it's on it's way there. My fish are all still active and eating eagerly. I actually made my own batch of BH using BH, salmon, red spinach, vitamins, garlic, and banana. I accidently used way too much red lettuce and it turned out real green...The fish still gobble it up though so that's good. Just have random pieces of lettuce floating occasionally.


@Liz

That's awesome. Though I have seen 90's at my LFS but curious as to how wide your 90 is. My 125 is 6' long version

5 x 18" x19"

[Shan_Evolved]

Interesting dimensions for a 90. I never knew there were 5' tanks here in the US.

@Tom, I really don't wanna put any equipment into the 125 as that's the purpose of the sump - to hide everything. If I move the sponges, they will be in the sump to be used as media.

I still don't quite understand from my questions on the previous end of the page. Are you guys talking about the return that just splits off like a Y at the top?

[Iminit]

Both of my 125s are 5’. Shan you can add the y wherever you’d like. I’d put it in the sump and come from there with 2 hose to different parts of the tank. Remember the more connections the more chances of leaks. So in the sump keeps the water there.

For a pump I’m using a jebeo dct 4000 dc pump. This pump moves 1kh but I’ve got it set at around 800. Being dc it starts slowly and in about 30secs ramps up to full speed. Yes it’s a Chinese pump. But in reality most are made in China . I’m use 7/8 hose so I went with a smaller pump. If you use 3/4 or 1”pvc you could use a bigger pump and run it at a lower speed. These pumps are very quiet.

[FischAutoTechGarten]

I still don't quite understand from my questions on the previous end of the page. Are you guys talking about the return that just splits off like a Y at the top?

Shan, it's a question of perspective... one vessels inlet is another's return.... It's relative. So permit me to re-word....

I have 1 line suppling water to the Display tanks (Influent to the Display Tanks that comes from the Sump)..... Each Display Tank has 2 lines to return the water back to the Sump (Effluent of the Display Tanks that goes to the Sump). You want to be able to remove more water, faster, from your Aquarium than you can put in... to prevent spills... So that's why I have more lines exiting each tank than I have coming in.

I made the previous suggestion because i misunderstood your plumbing... I read it as two water lines coming into your 125... and only 1 leaving your 125... but I think you were actually stating the opposite. my mistake.. no worries...

That said... Iminit is giving you some good suggestions! I too keep my pump submerged in the sump.... potential water leaks.... stay in the water...

CO2ReactorAfterSump.jpg

Well, I have a 2-part Sump (one with all of the media.. the other with all of the equipment)... but you still get the idea...

[AquaticNerd]

Hi Shan,

My apologies for the confusion - my assumption was that you were going to follow typical drilling that I've seen for a 125 (6') tank, in that each corner is drilled and your inlet and outlet are typically near each other (see something similar to the Marineland Corner-Flo). With an overflow at one end, and the return at the other, you are helping your case in terms of water movement, but there is still the possibility of dead spots vertically - typically closest to the bottom of the aquarium. You see this a lot in marine and reef aquariums (such as the WWC method) where powerheads at placed near the bottom of the aquarium to keep movement flowing.

With that said, the choice is completely up to you. To address your questions. Returns from sumps typically have a product called Loc-Line for the returns. You can split one output into two using a Y fitting. I personally eliminate dead spots as much as possible, but that's just my own opinion.

[Shan_Evolved]

Where would the deadzones be in a simple configuration like this?

Low flow. 300-500gph turnoverrate.

tank1251.PNG

[AquaticNerd]

I'm not saying dead spots are bad - I'm simply stating that my preference is to reduce or eliminate them as much as possible. I'm by no means an expert in fluid flow or fluid dynamics, I just took a couple of those courses when I was in college for engineering.

If you think in terms of fluid dynamics, water takes the path of least resistance and flow easily dissipates in large bodies of water. There's a good video demonstrating flow by Bulk Reef Supply. Now take your diagram as an example - with 2 exits at the top of the tank, you're only drawing water in from the surface - therefore the majority of the water you are drawing in will come from the upper 3rd of your aquarium.

If you have a single return that simply discharges at the return circle, it will quickly spread out over the surface and very little will make it the full 6' distance of the aquarium, let alone the furthest point from the return - the bottom, leftmost section of the aquarium. Now say, instead of discharging it immediately, you add some Loc-Line with a nozzle tip on the end. This will greatly increase the velocity of the water coming out of the return. If you then point that nozzle directly at the front glass, it hits the front glass and dissipates from there. Some will make surface agitation while some will move downward and hit the bottom substrate (or glass). The remaining water will turn back in towards the return, and dissipate out.

A single return with a Y-fitting, which can direct water not only directly forward toward the surface and front glass, but also direct it downwards and toward the intake would greatly increase the internal water flow - reducing dead spots and still allowing for a single return hole. There's a research article that was made some time ago that looked at the effects of fluid flow on breeding fish. You can find that article here. There's some good diagrams that show how flow was affected.

[dnkn]

What kind of overflow plumbing are you planning Shan? Looking at your diagram with two "exit" holes, makes me think of my own experience. When I first drilled my 75G, I just punched one hole for an overflow, and couldn't believe how noisy a single sucking standpipe can be. If you've never used a sump, it might surprise you too.

I did a bunch of reading and talked to those with more experience, and ended up draining the tank and punching two more holes to make a bean animal overflow box. I know there are other setups that work ok using only two holes (i.e. herbie), but the bean animal really works great, it's almost silent, and it has redundancy. I'm a big fan. Especially since you're taking the tank in to have it drilled, you might want to consider three exit holes instead of two ...

[coralbandit]

Bean animal rules for the preferred extraction .
It is easy to hang an extra return over the tank compared to having to build a HOB overflow ..If you drill your returns lock line should be used IMO.
Most tanks now are tempered .I shattered a 75 2 years ago ..A $99 Aqueon and it was all tempered !
If your tank is drillable and you have not acquired all necessary equipment for the overflow look into Eshopp Eclipse skimmers .
They come with drill bit and offer several sizes .As mentioned you want more to be able to go out then can ever come in [prevent overflows ] so oversizing your skimmer is a good thing .
Like Tom I am Jeboa chinese DC pumps all the way also .. Here is the link to Jimbos sump he built .This is a sump made for fresh water not marine with all the baffles and overflows .One of the best sumps I have seen and what I use on my 75g paladarium .
https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/1...a-build-4.html

[Shan_Evolved]

My goal is to have enough water flow that I don't get dead spots but also not too much that my discus dislike it.

I used a polarized film and did the LCD screen test and verified my tank only has a tempered bottom; so the back is drillable.

I was planning on using a herbie style overflow with 1" bulkhead and a Y-loc line for the return.

I have already ordered the 45mm diamond bit to cut holes and will be ordering some test pieces of 1/4" Glass to practice on as well.


Now I have a question - in regarding my return Y-loc line, should this be a smaller hole than my exits? If I have a 1" bulkhead herbie, should I drill a 3/4" hole for the loc line return?

[coralbandit]

Usually the return is smaller since it is under pressure . You also don't just want too many big holes in your glass..They make the glass weaker and placement should be strongly considered ..Not to close to top edge or even when drilled clean it may crack to the edge if the space is too small ..
I would not worry so much about dead spots .It is a lot easier to vacuum waste out of 1 corner then a whole 6 foot tank ..And that IS what circulation pumps are for ..Jeboa makes digital circulators so it is not like you have to have an old school power head tidal wave ..I like the Jeboa Gyre pumps .They can keep my 180 flowing like a river or subtly stir my marine tank .
I kind of like a settling area and have something like that in one of my high flow sumps..Makes removing waste very easy..

[Shan_Evolved]

Alright. Thanks for the info. Learned a lot this weekend.

So far I will be getting a

-DC pump rated for 600gph.

-Linear length of 9"+ for DIY overflow box.

-Herbie style drain with 1" bulkhead with 6" height difference in emergency drain and normal with strainer

-3/4 bulkhead return with Y loc line with 1/8" holes drilled near the top facing down to break siphon

[Iminit]

Looking forward to pictures. I checked out the site Tom put up but don’t see where the pipes end up. Buy a dc motor that moves more water than what you need. Nice thing about these motors is you can adjust the output and run the motor at half speed. So cheaper to run and less strain on the motor. And if you want more flow just raise the output.

[Shan_Evolved]

Great Idea. Will do.