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Thread: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

  1. #1
    Registered Member Shan_Evolved's Avatar
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    Default Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    For those of you who haven't seen my Tank Journal, a quick TLDR: Noticed a fish not eating and ignoring all foods. Treated with epsom salt next day as well as changed tank temp from 86 to 88. Noticed white poop next morning and immediately got some genural cure API, and did a large WC but within 8 hours it died. This was 6 days ago.

    Been treating the tank with metro for 7 days now but recently ALL of the fish have gradually stopped eating ANYTHING I give them, be it hans BH, hans Flakes, Al's FDBW, or even bloodworm treats from LPS.

    I still notice white poop coming from random discus every morning.


    DETAILED -

    1. Please explain the problems with your fish. When did you notice the problems and did anything unusual happen that you think started them?

    See Above.

    2. Symptoms.

    Turning dark, white spot (see pic), white poop but most importantly they are not eating.

    3. What medications/ treatments have you already tried and what were the results. Include dosage and duration of treatment.

    Treated with General cure at their 250mg dosage first 4 days at 88F with a 90% WC every 2 days before redose. Moved on to JEHMCO metro and started dosing at 400mg with daily 90% WC On Wednesday 2/19 and have been doing this for 3 days so far. Will continue until 11 more days or otherwise recommended not to.

    Tank/Water

    4. Tank size and ages, numbers and sizes of fish.

    55 gallon standard, 14 left, 3-4 months old, 2.75-3.25". Haven't really measured in two weeks due to sickness.

    5. Water change regime (What percentage and how often).

    90% Daily PWC with epsom salt and 400mg metro treatment. Tank temp match to 92

    6. How long has tank been running? Is it bare bottom? If you have substrate, what type and how deep is it?

    Since December, Barebottom.

    7. Do you age your water? If you do for how long and what is the ph swing.

    Yes 24 hours.

    8. What type/brand water conditioner do you use? Do you add it to the tank or aging barrel? How much do you use?

    Prime, right before WC. 1 Capful 5ml

    9. Parameters and water source;

    Daily 90% WC with aged tap so negligible.

    What type of water or combinations of water sources do you use? If it is an RO/tap/well water mix, please list percentages in the mix.

    Aged tap


    10. Any new fish, plants or inverts added recently.

    No

    11. Please tell us what you feed your fish and how often. This can be critical information for solving the problem so be as specific as you can.

    They used to eat hans BH 2-3 times a day, FDBW midday, and cobalt hans flakes on a auto feeder on weekdays while im at work, but recently past 3 days they are showing no interest in any foods whatsoever. I even tried bloodworms from LPS and they just ignore everything. ALL of them.

    12. Include any pictures or videos you have which shows the symptoms. If you can't add them to this post, please provide a link to them.

    Right before this one died, that morning.

    metro1-2.jpg

    Fresh picture, noticed this white spot. ????

    metro2.jpg

    White poop as well.

    metro3.jpg

    Just a vid of how they seem.




    Reason I'm finally coming here is because all of them are ignoring food now. Worried.
    Amateur discuskeeper, Professional doofus

  2. #2
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Hi Shan, "400mg metro treatment" is this for the entire tank? If so please increase your dosage to 500mg per 10 gallons and redose every day for the entire tank volume after a 90% water change. Appears your tank temp is 92 so that is good.
    Pat
    Last edited by Second Hand Pat; 02-23-2020 at 11:31 AM. Reason: spelling
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  3. #3
    Registered Member + MVP danotaylor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Yes Pat, that was my immediate question as I read Shan's thread.
    Shan metro is only active for 8 hours in the water column/blood stream, and since you are not making headway at this point, I would dose twice a day at 12 hour intervals, the dose Pat recommended. Still with 1 daily water change.

  4. #4
    Moderator Team LizStreithorst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Do as Pat suggested. Also, I'm not sure you need the Epsom salts any more. I could be mistaken, though. And one more thing. There have been a few times that I didn't see the fish start getting better until after a day or two after treatment is finished.
    Mama Bear

  5. #5
    Registered Member Shan_Evolved's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Im dosing 400mg per 10 gal rule. If I up to every 12 hours, do I need 90% PWC every 12 hours too?
    Amateur discuskeeper, Professional doofus

  6. #6
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Quote Originally Posted by Shan_Evolved View Post
    Im dosing 400mg per 10 gal rule. If I up to every 12 hours, do I need 90% PWC every 12 hours too?
    Just one 90% WC a day Shan.
    Pat
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


  7. #7
    Registered Member Shan_Evolved's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Thank you guys. Will do this for another 12 days
    Amateur discuskeeper, Professional doofus

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    Administrator jeep's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    I agree. This is only day 3 so it's early. I would also remove the driftwood during this process.

    I'd really like to see your nitrite and nitrate levels. If this is hex, it usually doesn't hit an entire tank unless there is something influencing this, especially with your excellent maintenance routine.

  9. #9
    Silver Member Willie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    So metronidazole is used to treat for intestinal flukes. Not sure why epsom salt is needed.

    The medication always works. But think through what's going on. The intestine is infested and swells in response. Medication is applied and the flukes gradually die off. The healing process takes a while. In my experience, fish will not eat for 5 - 7 days after the medication is removed. Afterwards, feeding will resume.

    Willie
    At my age, everything is irritating.

  10. #10
    Registered Member Shan_Evolved's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Thanks for the responses. So my fish won't be eating for 12+ 5 to 7 days? Hmm. Ill follow all the advice and dose every 12h. I will test tap and tank real soon and post results
    Amateur discuskeeper, Professional doofus

  11. #11
    Moderator Team LizStreithorst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    I personally don't think that twice a day will help. But it won't hurt so if want to do 2X daily go ahead.
    Mama Bear

  12. #12
    Registered Member Shan_Evolved's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Test kit results show nothing funky. I am not going to dose epsom salt anymore. Just metro at 12 hrs + heat + patience..

    _________________

    Right before daily WC. (During metro + epsom salt.)

    PH - Ammo - NO2 - NO3


    87153947_636893463546517_6992385218074116096_n.jpg

    _____________

    PH of aging barrel

    87975814_2766043730115528_975564425006153728_n.jpg

    _____________

    Tap water

    87280702_510577129645796_4713413444114579456_n.jpg
    Amateur discuskeeper, Professional doofus

  13. #13
    Registered Member bluelagoon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Quote Originally Posted by LizStreithorst View Post
    Do as Pat suggested. Also, I'm not sure you need the Epsom salts any more. I could be mistaken, though. And one more thing. There have been a few times that I didn't see the fish start getting better until after a day or two after treatment is finished.
    I think you're on to the epsom salts for not eating. That'll make them puke and poop.

  14. #14
    Registered Member seanyuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    Read somewhere metronidazole is its solubility in water is very poor, in aquarium settings it has been suggested that it can precipitate out of solution within 6-8 hours. use of Magnesium sulphate (Epsom salt) in treating internal parasites in angel fish.

    https://vtechworks.lib.vt.edu/handle/10919/29907
    Grasshopper
    Francis

  15. #15
    Registered Member + MVP danotaylor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seems to be getting worse, getting worried

    It's therapeutic longevity (active half life) in the human blood stream is 8hrs, and why it is dosed every 8 hours for humans. This is why I dose minimum x 2/day and x 3 if my work schedule permits it. I realize it works for most people at x1/day, but my critical care nursing brain won't allow me dose it any less, LOL

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