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Thread: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

  1. #1
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Potassium Permanganate (PP)

    Potassium Permanganate (KMnO4) or PP for short, is one of the most useful of all medicines an aquarist can have in his/her fish medicine cabinet. PP is effective against external fungi, bacteria and parasites, including gill flukes. It is relatively safe and very effective. It can also be used as a sterilizer and an oxidizer of organic compounds.

    Whenever using PP it is always wise to have some Hydrogen Peroxide (H2O2) on hand to neutralize the PP in case of an emergency. Most dechlorinators will also neutralize PP.

    Some fish are sensitive to PP, for example some Lake Malawi cichlids, and these should be treated at a dose rate of 1mg/litre. For discus the standard dose rate is 2mg/litre for a minimum of four hours. Most cichlids will comfortably tolerate this dosage level. The fish keeper should at all times watch the reaction of their fish during treatment for signs of distress. Many fish, including discus, will clamp up and sit fairly still during treatment. This is normal behavior and to be expected, however the author has also seen his fish continue with territorial disputes and the like throughout! Many dosing schedules give their dosing in ppm or Parts Per Million, 1 ppm is the same as 1mg/litre.

    Before carrying out a PP treatment, or any treatment for that matter, it is advisable to wipe down all hard surfaces in the tank and to siphon out as much debris as possible, in the process performing a partial water change. This will reduce the organic payload both in the tank and in the water column and give a higher chance of treatment success.

    The safest way to dose PP is to do so in a tank with no substrate and very little decoration, plants and the like. PP works by oxidizing the organics in the tank and is indiscriminate, so will happily oxidize driftwood as well as any bugs we are trying to kill. PP can be used in planted tanks, though the author has had limited success using it this way.

    PP when dosed at a maximum of 2mg/litre or lower will have a minimal impact on a fully mature and well established bio filter. Bio filters that have been established for less than six months may be adversely affected so the fish keeper will need to monitor for ammonia after treatment and take the appropriate action if detected. Dosing rates higher than this will almost certainly have a negative impact on your bio filter.

    Over dosing with Potassium Permanganate will cause serious harm to your fish including burnt gills and damaged eyes. In some cases it will kill your fish. If you inadvertently overdose, neutralize with Hydrogen Peroxide and perform as large a water change as possible.

    The author strongly recommends the use of inexpensive gram scales. These can be bought from a variety of outlets including health food stores, chemists or pharmacies and from the internet. They are well worth the investment and any scale that weighs up to 50grams with a subdivision of a minimum of 0.1gram will suffice.

    A kitchen measuring teaspoon of the type used in cooking will, when gently tapped and leveled, hold approximately 7 grams of PP crystals.

    The first step in administering PP, or any medication, is to know the volume of water to be treated. This needs to be done as accurately as possible. We need to know the volume of water present not the total capacity of the tank!

    One effective way to use Potassium Permanganate is to make a stock solution. A stock solution is a concentrated mixture of PP at a known concentration.

    Volumes Measured in US Gallons

    1. Take a clean plastic bottle that holds 1 litre (1,000ml) such as a cola or lemonade bottle.

    2. Weigh out 75 grams of PP.

    3. Add this PP to the bottle, using a dry funnel or a funnel made from paper may help.

    4. Half fill with fairly hot water.

    5. Put the top on and close firmly.

    6. Shake vigorously until all the PP crystals have dissolved.

    7. Carefully open the bottle and top off to the 1 litre mark with cold water.

    8. Close the bottle and store in a cool dark place away from children.

    Dosing:

    1 drop per gallon of this stock solution will give 1mg/litre or 1ppm dose rate.
    2 drops per gallon of this stock solution will give 2mg/litre or 2ppm dose rate.
    3 drops per gallon of this stock solution will give 3mg/litre or 3ppm dose rate.
    4 drops per gallon of this stock solution will give 4mg/litre or 4ppm dose rate. 20 drops is equivalent to 1 millilitre of stock solution and will treat 10 US Gallons at 2mg/litre or 2ppm dose rate.

    The color of the water should remain purple or pinkish for a minimum of four hours. If it turns brown or yellowish before this time it indicates the organic load is too high. Some fish keepers will add further known doses of PP to maintain the purple color, which is relatively safe up to a maximum total dose of 6mg/litre. However the author prefers to stop the treatment using a very small amount of Hydrogen Peroxide (see below), clean the tank and do a partial water change and repeat the treatment the next day.

    Always ensure that there is adequate aeration in the tank during treatment, PP will use up oxygen in the water during treatment. Running an air stone or pointing the outlet of the filter at the surface are two ways to achieve this.

    Neutralizing using Hydrogen peroxide (H2O2)

    To neutralize any Potassium Permanganate treatment with Hydrogen Peroxide (H2O2) carefully add 5mils or 1 teaspoon of 6% by volume H2O2 to the aquarium and gently stir the water to mix. If after a few minutes the water has remained with any color to it then repeat the dose. The water will go clear when the PP has been neutralized. Care must be taken when using Hydrogen Peroxide as it can also cause harm to the fish and the bio filter so patience is key when using. If you use a higher concentrate of H2O2 add smaller amounts each time, using a pipette makes this much easier.

    A water change should be carried out as soon as is practical after treatment.
    Your discus are talking to you....are you listening


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    Registered Member seanyuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Great information.
    Grasshopper
    Francis

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    Registered Member bluelagoon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Thanks Pat. I've never used PP but now that Canada has restricted antibiotics. That is good info to know. I've been getting away with just clean water for the past few years. I will get some to have on hand.

  4. #4
    Registered Member seanyuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    I get my pure potassium permanganate at Save On pharmacy counter...order today and pick up the next day.HTH


    Quote Originally Posted by bluelagoon View Post
    Thanks Pat. I've never used PP but now that Canada has restricted antibiotics. That is good info to know. I've been getting away with just clean water for the past few years. I will get some to have on hand.
    Grasshopper
    Francis

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    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Quote Originally Posted by seanyuki View Post
    Great information.
    Thanks Francis

    Quote Originally Posted by bluelagoon View Post
    Thanks Pat. I've never used PP but now that Canada has restricted antibiotics. That is good info to know. I've been getting away with just clean water for the past few years. I will get some to have on hand.
    I hope you do not need to use it Mervin. I have not used PP since my early discus keeping days but I still have a stock solution.
    Pat
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    Registered Member jonnoya's Avatar
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    Question Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Quote Originally Posted by Second Hand Pat View Post
    Potassium Permanganate (PP)

    Great explanation on how to use PP Pat !
    I have a question though. I have a lot of problems with my Discus eggs. After 38-48 hrs they all get fungus on them, even the fertilized ones. I know they were fertilized coz I saw some wigglers the other day.
    I use (soft) rainwater with following parameters: PH=6-7, TDS < 100.

    Unfortunately I can't get Methylene Blue in my area to handle this fungus. Therefore I like to know if I can use a minimum amount of PP to achieve the same goal.

    Can you please let me know if this is a viable option and if yes what amount of dose I should use ? I guess it should be a lot less than 1mg/Liter coz they are eggs.

    Thx in adv,
    Jon

  7. #7
    Registered Member seanyuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Formalin should work.

    USE OF FORMALIN IN HATCHERIES TO CONTROL FUNGUS ON EGGS
    Formalin is approved by FDA for control of water mold (usually called fungus, although this is technically incorrect) in fish hatcheries. Concentrations of 1000 to 2000 mg/l can be applied to fish eggs for 15 minutes. Hatchery managers are reminded that sanitation is important for the prevention of water-mold invasions on fish eggs. Dead eggs should be removed from the system promptly because they serve as a source of infection for adjacent, healthy eggs.

    https://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/vm061




    Quote Originally Posted by jonnoya View Post
    Great explanation on how to use PP Pat !
    I have a question though. I have a lot of problems with my Discus eggs. After 38-48 hrs they all get fungus on them, even the fertilized ones. I know they were fertilized coz I saw some wigglers the other day.
    I use (soft) rainwater with following parameters: PH=6-7, TDS < 100.

    Unfortunately I can't get Methylene Blue in my area to handle this fungus. Therefore I like to know if I can use a minimum amount of PP to achieve the same goal.

    Can you please let me know if this is a viable option and if yes what amount of dose I should use ? I guess it should be a lot less than 1mg/Liter coz they are eggs.

    Thx in adv,
    Jon
    Grasshopper
    Francis

  8. #8
    Registered Member seanyuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Malachite Green is also effective against common external fungal infections of fishes and eggs.

    http://www.kordon.com/kordon/product...ompatabilities!
    Grasshopper
    Francis

  9. #9
    Registered Member seanyuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Currently, hatcheries use formalin and hydrogen peroxide—both approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA)—to treat fungus on eggs.


    https://agresearchmag.ars.usda.gov/2017/feb/fungus/
    Grasshopper
    Francis

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    Registered Member + MVP danotaylor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Good info Francis. Jonnoya which country are you in? Your profile says US but meth blue is readily available here...

  11. #11
    Registered Member coralbandit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Actually Methylene Blue seems to be missing in action from most suppliers now ?
    I have had several customers say they can not get it !
    When I searched every supplier I saw was 'out of stock' ?
    H202 [ Hydrogen peroxide is is easy and safe to use .
    About 1 ml H202 per gallon [in the US] should work .You should install this 2 times a day as the peroxide converts to water and air in about 12 hours as I understand .
    If you are in another country the dose should be half or one third as the peroxide is twice as strong in England and 3 times as strong in other countries.
    The US has 3% H202 while England is 6% and others 9% .
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhFp68wjRUU
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    Registered Member seanyuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Try here Methylene Blue powder @ Everything Aquatic


    http://store.everythingaquatic.net/d...e-powder-p-338


    Quote Originally Posted by coralbandit View Post
    Actually Methylene Blue seems to be missing in action from most suppliers now ?
    I have had several customers say they can not get it !
    When I searched every supplier I saw was 'out of stock' ?
    H202 [ Hydrogen peroxide is is easy and safe to use .
    About 1 ml H202 per gallon [in the US] should work .You should install this 2 times a day as the peroxide converts to water and air in about 12 hours as I understand .
    If you are in another country the dose should be half or one third as the peroxide is twice as strong in England and 3 times as strong in other countries.
    The US has 3% H202 while England is 6% and others 9% .
    Grasshopper
    Francis

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    Registered Member jonnoya's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Sorry Daniel, forgot to fill in my location. It is Bali, Indonesia

  14. #14
    Registered Member jonnoya's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Thk u much for mentioning the alternatives Francis & Tom.
    However, actually I like to have my question answered whether I could also use PP in saving the eggs.

  15. #15
    Administrator and MVP Dec.2015 Second Hand Pat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Potassium Permanganate (PP) How To

    Quote Originally Posted by jonnoya View Post
    Thk u much for mentioning the alternatives Francis & Tom.
    However, actually I like to have my question answered whether I could also use PP in saving the eggs.
    Hi Jonnoya, I have no clue nor have I seen anyone use PP on eggs. Since PP is an oxidizer of organics and eggs are organic I would think PP would not be a good choice. If you wish to it try I would suggest try just enough PP to slightly color the water. Maintain the color for six hours then do a water change.
    Pat
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