Discus turned completely black!

[hairyashell]

Hey everyone,

Problem

1. Please explain the problems with your fish. When did you notice the problems and did anything unusual happen that you think started them?
-I recently recovered my first Discus from hole in the head using a treatment of Metro. She recovered well and started eating again but I made a grave error of not quarantining a new discus tank mate for her and I believe I am paying the price now. I'd appreciate any advice at this point on what I can do to help her recover. She's gone from just turning dark to full on black. I've been trying to treat her with salt and Seachem Paragaurd for the last couple of days but things havent improved. She seems to breathing heavy today. I'm also running a treatment of metro concurrently in case the hex is back again.


2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds).
-Turned black

3. What medications/ treatments have you already tried and what were the results. Include dosage and duration of treatment.
Seachem Paraguard+salt. No improvement. Breathing heavy


Tank/Water

4. Tank size and ages, numbers and sizes of fish.
-17 gallon. 2 discus

5. Water change regime (What percentage and how often).
-10% every 2-3 days.

6. How long has tank been running? Is it bare bottom? If you have substrate, what type and how deep is it?
2 years, bare bottom.

7. Do you age your water? If you do for how long and what is the ph swing.
-yes. 24 hours.

8. What type/brand water conditioner do you use? Do you add it to the tank or aging barrel? How much do you use?
- Aged water (for 10% water change every 2-3 days) or dechlorinated water if direct from tap for large water change

9. Parameters and water source;

Note: Water Parameters are important in diagnosing problems within a tank. If you don't own test kits for the following information, you can purchase them, test your parameters and post this info as soon as possible.


- temp 29c

- ph 6.9

- ammonia reading 0

- nitrite reading 0

- nitrate reading 5

What type of water or combinations of water sources do you use? If it is an RO/tap/well water mix, please list percentages in the mix.

- municipal water (dechlorinated) or aged water

10. Any new fish, plants or inverts added recently.
-Yes


11. Please tell us what you feed your fish and how often. This can be critical information for solving the problem so be as specific as you can.
beef heart mix, twice a day


12. Include any pictures or videos you have which shows the symptoms. If you can't add them to this post, please provide a link to them.
BEFORE
KY8nTsy.jpg
AFTER
tAQnFVp.jpg

[jeep]

How much salt did you use and for how long?

[hairyashell]

I've added 1.5 tablespoons of aquarium salt per 10 gallon 3 days ago.

[seanyuki]

Try 5 Tablespoon of aquarium salt per 10 gallons, to kill parasites on the discus slime coat.

I've added 1.5 tablespoons of aquarium salt per 10 gallon 3 days ago.

[jeep]

Try 5 Tablespoon of aquarium salt per 10 gallons, to kill parasites on the discus slime coat.

Agreed! Also, I would raise the temp to 34 over a couple of days and increase water changes to 50% daily, replacing the salt removed during water changes. 10-14 day treatment. 10% every few days is of no real benefit. It's good to include metro during this time if you suspect hex...

[hairyashell]

Thanks for the tips guys. I've increased the salt and water change quantity. Speaking of salt, would marine salt work or it has to be rock salt?

[jeep]

As long as it's sodium chloride it should be fine. I'm not aware of any additives marine salt would have that would harm discus, but you may want to double check the contents...

[AquaticNerd]

I would stick to NaCl and not use marine salt. They typically contain buffers and other trace elements that could change the pH value of your water (considering it is a 6.9 and marine salt typically buffers pH to about 8.0-8.4). You can use large bulk packs of rock salt/kosher salt from your local grocery, or use something like this: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Diamond-...2454/100172669

[Iminit]

You’ve got a cross contamination. Salt and rid ich plus should help them out.

[CliffsDiscus]

Looks like the Discus was already stress from the start. Do the salt treatment with the daily water changes, also wipe down the sides and bottom of the tank because excess dead slime, start lowering ph to bring down the bacterial count. The Discus should start looking better around 1 1/2 to 2 weeks.

Cliff

[hairyashell]

Thanks everyone. Btw I'm curious, does salt alone get rid of Ich? Or the Ich medication is required with salt? I understand salt is supposed to dehydrate the fish and create more slime coat and then the med is supposed to take out the ich. Am I right?

[bluelagoon]

Salt does not need to be used for ich nor does medication. Heat alone will kill the parasite. Just make sure during the heat treatment that your water never falls below 86. Discus can tolerate 90 degrees for a few days. This method is quicker than salt or medications and only takes 4-5 days. This has worked for me many times for external parasites.

[jeep]

This appears to be bacterial, not parasitical. Salt will help discus produce slime coat which will aid against infection on the body and in the gills. Discus can handle high concentrations of salt for a short period and this is what I've always used and recommended it for any CC issues including bacterial and parasitical. As Tom said, Rid Ich+ will help because it's effective against not only external parasites, but bacteria as well. I've never use it but I've recommended it based upon the successes of others. Rid Ich+ and salt seems to be the go to method these days...

[Iminit]

Yes the name is rid-ich plus. But ich isn’t what it’s killing here. It’s killing the bad bacteria on the fish and whatever parasites. It does work. My discus started eating after the first dose. I’ve got a thread here “looking for help” that’s got a lot of good into on cc.

[seanyuki]

For cross contamination use Kordon Rid Ich + ( active ingredients are formalin & malachite green) for parasites and bacteria infections. Aeration should be increased because the O2 content of water decreases with higher temperatures. Elevating the temperature of the water can be beneficial also because it increases the fish's metabolism and heightens its immune response, while also hastening the life cycle of the parasite, thereby shortening the time required to cure the fish. Salt can also assist osmoregulation problems and help clear congested gills as well as supporting fish suffering from stress. One to two Tablespoon per 10 gallons. I also use antibiotics to get rid of internal bacteria infection.


Kordon Rid Ich +

http://www.kordon.com/kordon/product...ompatabilities!