altum ANGELFISH dying, unknown diease

[Ádám]

ALTUM ANGELS dying, little dots appear, all fine now, 2 of them died.

1. Hi, its started 2-3 months, nothing usual, in december 1 fish died randomly, so i medicate the whole group, because they seem unhealthy, now 1 of them got swim bladder disease and diead after 2 week of trying to recover. I wanna treat the others because they dont look healthy.


2. white dots on body and at the base of pectoral fins, black dots on mouth and at the base of anal fin (see pictures)


3. in december 1 treatment of omnipur over 7days
1-2 weeks later, bactopur normal over 3 days.
in february, tremazol over 6 hours
<-after that couple of day, bactopur direct over 7 days

Tank/Water

4. 550 liter, 5 altum angel over 20cm height, several little fish, like neon tetras, corydoras.


5. 3days 20%.


6. running over 3 years, 1cm sand substrate


7. yes 1-2 days, preheat it.


8.

- temp _28°C____

- ph ___6.5__

- ammonia reading __-__

- nitrite reading __-__

- nitrate reading __<10__

What type of water or combinations of water sources do you use? If it is an RO/tap/well water mix, please list percentages in the mix.

- well water ____

- municipal water __15%__

- RO water __85%__
TDS 140

9. no.

11.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sF-SJqQ1QM (mute it, i speak hungarian to my friend, but thats the best quality)

https://youtu.be/nS8AWWpRuVo

https://youtube.com/shorts/ACyomPWtimg


10. all types of frozen food, about 4-5 times in a day, and sera discus.
now not, but about till 3 months ago ago frozen beefheart mix.


When i purchased them, they said they WF fish, i dont know what should i do, should i use klion or some deworming? Please help me, i think its not bacterial.

20230225_203459.jpg20230225_203017.jpg20230225_202954.jpg

[brewmaster15]

Hi,
Welcome to SimplyDiscus! Sorry you are having some issues here!

Question for you.. on those white dots , do they break open and leave a hole? We see these in Discus and its linked to water quality. Its bacterial in nature.. Usually the fish recovers fine but there are cases where the bacteria is a more pathogenic one and the fish can die. Im not suggesting that is whats happened here but its possible. Read this thread for more information

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showth...very-long-read


On the mouth issue.. that could be from lip locking with other Altums.. but its also possible its lymphocystis.. I would look that up on the internet and see if its similar to what you have.

I would increase your water changes as well. Im surprised your water parameters are as good as they are with your water changes.. it may be your water quality has slipped to the point where the altums are just not happy and are open to infection. Generally though they look good except for the spot/sores.

Al

[Ádám]

Hey, thanks for then
reply, but i think, the black dots the problem, i had a fish who got several on the body and it got swim bladder issues and died. I think theres a connection between that 2 thing.
I want to get rid of that black spots from the mouth and the anal fin start. It wont puncture.

https://youtu.be/Xqqui5Ue-UY
Another vid, where the died fish still alive.
It was february 8.

3day 20% its bad? I think thats fair 😅 I should incrase it.

[brewmaster15]

Its always a good idea to increase your tanks maintenance when theres a problem. Sometimes thats all it takes to help fish recover from something.

The black dots .. There is a parasite called Turbellarian worms that causes " black spot disease"..these more commonly are seen in salt water tanks than fresh.. but they do occur in freshwater fish as well. In salt water fish its often treated by doing fresh water dips and its reported praziquantel may be useful. In fresh water species... salt water dips or baths may help. ..

I have seen one case of this in discus.. A long time ago... I had a batch of fry come down with it.. i had been feeding a commercially made well regarded frozen seafood mix to them. .. ..so I am sure its a possibility in fresh water aquarium fish. You mention you only feed frozen foods.. freezing alone is not always enough to make foods safe as an aquarium food..That may be where your issue started.

Please understand that these are just suggestions on whats going on in your tank based on what you have posted and my.own experiences.
Al

[Ádám]

Thanks all, i appreciated it! So, whats gonna be my next step, i change 50% water and than?

[captainandy]

Shot gun.
Hit them with anti parasite and broad spectrum antibiotic.

[Ádám]

Could you recommended some please? What i get on the Eu.

[brewmaster15]

The medications you have availible there are different than for us in the USA. Things are more restricted with antibiotics from what I have read. I do think Andy is right here with needing to address both a possible parasite issue and bacterial issue. If these are tubellaria worms they are just under the surface and most of the time they are not life threatening in low numbers.. but they open the fish to secondary infections.

It would probably be easier if you could list what antiobiotics you do have access to and we can suggest the best broad spectrum one you can get. You should talk to your local veterinarian as to what you can get.

Since what I have read indicates the praziquantel can treat tubellaria worms You should See if thats availible.. if its not.. look for levamisole.

[captainandy]

Could you recommended some please? What i get on the Eu.

Contact your local tropical fish store to see what’s available. Then post what’s available.

[Ádám]

In here, all kind of SERA product, omnipur, costapur, tremazol.... etc
But now i ordered some metronidazol and cloverleaf absolute wormer plus