municipal water + softner for first time discus water

[dtl8686]

Hello, all
I've been reading a bunch since I found this site. A lot of great information here! I have questions about my water. I have a municipal well here in Frankfort, IL. when I test the water out of the well that has not gone through the softener It is a PH of 7.2, GH of 36 degrees ( with API master test kit ) and KH of 14 -15 degrees. So, quite hard water. TDS is in the high 400's. Coming out of my softener the TDS is high 500's with GH being cut to 4 degrees.

I don't intend on breeding at this time. But, everyone seems to say to not chase PH. In my 125 gallon I have 6 electric blue acara, 4 sterbai corys, 2 clown plecos, 4 black skirt tetras, 3 rams, and 3 keyhole cichlids. All water changes have been done with softened tap water and API water conditioner at water change time for chlorine and heavy metal detox. Java fern and anubius plants are all doing quite well. I add almond leaves to the water as well just to add tannins and help with water quality a bit. PH ends up at 8.8 in this tank due to the high KH and stays pretty consistent.

I'm setting up a 75 gallon for discus now. It's my first time trying them. I don't want to order 6 or 7 fish and kill them! with that TDS, am I better to mix RO and unsoftened tap water? or do I use softened water mixed with the RO?

If all goes well and I end up with success, I may try breeding down the line...but baby steps for now. I just want to be able to provide consistent water with the least buffering, chemical addition way possible.

I've wanted to keep discus for a long time. I've just been intimidated by all the differing and conflicting information on line. This forum has a lot of successful keepers and breeders here that I thought could get me off to the best start possible.

Also, i was going to start with some smaller fish ( 2.5" to 3.5"). Is the 75 gallon too big to start them in? I had people telling me to put them in a 20 gallon that they like to be tight together and eventually go to the 75 gallon. My intent is to eventually have a 125 gallon display tank set up with a trickle filter sump. I have already got the tank purchased and stand will be next.

All advice is appreciated.

Thanks,
Dave

[brewmaster15]

Hi Dave!
Welcome to SimplyDiscus! Definitely keep reading the forum and asking questions.Best way to get started. A recent discussion we have had..


http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showth...s-in-my-Plan-)

Addresses some of your questions but to recap.. You should be fine with Discus in your tap water. Especially if they are domestics. Your plan on the 75 gal is fine too but be sure to get a good enough group size. ..its not so.much that discus like to be jammed together..its that they do best in groups. Its makes them feel safer and can promote active feeding and good growth. I routinely grow out small discus in 75 g and 125 gal tanks.

Al

[dtl8686]

Thanks for the reply, Al. So, I came home from work this morning and did some testing on both my softened and unsoftened water. I realize as the water dechlorinate from the tap that it will likely rise in pH. Initially, both of my softened and unsoftened water are sitting and right around 7.0. Where things change drastically is in my conductivity, TDS, and GH

In the unsoftened sample, I have a conductivity of 1270 microsiemens and a TDS of 657. The general hardness is sitting at 18° and the carbonate hardness is at 17°.

In the sample that came out of the softener line the conductivity is 1335 microsiemens With a TDS rating of 654, but the general hardness is only about 1° with the carbonate hardness sitting at 17°

I would imagine that the unsoftened water would be the one that I would want? Seeing as it has calcium and magnesium in it, that the fish would likely need to grow? It would be ideal to use if you think it would be OK? I just hate to risk a few hundred dollars worth of fish on it. But, it would be easy enough to do for water changes plus, adding the API tap water conditioner for the toxic metals and chlorine.

Thanks for the advice!

Dave

[brewmaster15]

HI Dave,
We have alot of keepers here with pretty hard water and their non breeding discus do well. Im sure that theres probably a few using a water softener too but I dont know.

Heres a screenshot of a famous discus hatcheries water..
Screenshot_20231004_093353.jpg

Your tap water without softener should be ok . I think if possible its best to use water that takes the least effort to ready for water changes as you will be more likely to do them. RO WATER is used alot but it is wasteful and its more processing. If it were me I would try tap water first but you could hedge your bets .Start off with a tap water Ro mix. Alot of people use Ro Water mixed with Tap to get to where they want to be. I use 80 R/O with 20% tap for my breeders when I need it. For you with your water a 50% Tap no softener and 50% RO should give a good starting point for growing out. Once you have the fish happy and healthy and acclimated you can try shifting the Ratio up to higher percents tap and maybe get to full tap.

Al

[Charlyc11]

Al plus the softener introduces a lot of sodium and removes the good stuff magnesium and calcium.

[Raul-7]

Al plus the softener introduces a lot of sodium and removes the good stuff magnesium and calcium.

Depends on the resin; some replace calcium and magnesium with potassium.

[Charlyc11]

Either way you are removing good stuff and potassium chloride is ok but who knows the PPM' that is added.

[dtl8686]

So, i did a simple test when i got home from work and started adding unsoftened tap water to my RO water. I started with 5 oz. of RO and aded 1 oz of tap water to it measuring the tds / EC along the way. Here is what i got.

5 oz. RO / 1 oz. tap = TDS@ 128 EC @ 292
5 oz. RO / 2 oz. tap = TDS @ 217 EC@ 562
5oz. RO / 3 oz. tap = TDS @ 274 EC 562
5 oz. RO/ 4 oz. tap = TDS @ 320 EC 668
5 oz. RO/ 5 oz. tap = TDS @355 EC 736

I was thinking of going the 50/50 route? The GH and KH at that point is GH 20 degrees and KH 12 degrees. PH so far as of now is settled at 7.0 - 7.2

Thoughts?

[dtl8686]

Al, I’m going to do exactly that. 50/50 RO / unsoftened tap to start.

Thanks!

[brewmaster15]

Glad to help Dave. When you are ready and get that tank going please take out a tank journal so we can follow along on the journey.

Al