Experience with Cloverleaf Absolute Wormer Plus

[btrast18]

Hi,

I did a search on the forums and did not find anything specific about this specific medicine so I hope I can get some advice from this thread.

I just bought some Cloverleaf Absolute Wormer Plus from the UK. I understand that its main ingredient is Flubendazole.

Has anyone used this medication before?

Did you follow the dosing provided on the package?

Did it work or did it result in any side affects/deaths?

[brewmaster15]

It contains

levamisole dewormer

flubendazole dewormer

diflubenzuron Diflubenzuron is an insecticide of the benzoylurea class.[2] It is used in forest management and on field crops[3] to selectively control insect pests, particularly forest tent caterpillar moths, boll weevils, gypsy moths, and other types of moths.[1] It is a widely used larvicide in India for control of mosquito larvae by public health authorities. Diflubenzuron is approved by the WHO Pesticide Evaluation Scheme.[1] source...wiki


cyromazive: Cyromazine is a triazine insect growth regulator used as an insecticide. It is a cyclopropyl derivative of melamine. Cyromazine works by affecting the nervous system of the immature larval stages of certain insects.[2] source wiki

Its basically a shotgun medication containing two dewormers and two insecticides. It theory it should be effective and it has good reviews. I really don't personally like shot gun treatments like this. I don't have direct experience with the medication as a whole but I have used all the components except that Cyromazive, Insecticides are generally neurotoxins and in discus they can cause loss of appetite, and lethargy, and loss of color. The effect is temporary. There used to be alot of these on the market but theres less these days. ( fluke tabs,clout etc)

Flubendazole as a powder does not go into solution well and we always had to use vodka, acetone, dmso etc to get it into solution... no idea how this product got around that.


One comment I can make is I have been helping a fellow hobbyist out with some parasite issues. He did try cloverleaf and it did not work. Usually when we read someone saying "tried it an d it did not work" I take it with a grain of salt but this hobbyist actually documented everything we discussed and captured images of capillaria eggs and flukes post treatment. He is pretty on top of his care as well so I am not sure why it did not work when by the ingredients it really should have. Maybe he got an old batch or bad batch. Since this is not my direct experience with it, take it with a huge grain of salt.

I really like flubendazole as a dewormer but its so hard to get the powder by itself from a reputable supplier..
This product does potentially offer a good solution... but I would use it half dose first and monitor closely. Tail standing and head standing can happen with both Flubendazole and Levamisole in situations we don't fully understand yet.

al

[Willie]

Why is this medication under consideration? Have your fish been diagnosed with worms? Treating discus can be a complete crap shoot and flubendazole has a number of potentially nasty side effects. "Potentially nasty" means that sometimes it works, but often it damages the fish to such an extent that a potential cure becomes irrelevant.

...Its basically a shotgun medication containing two dewormers and two insecticides ... I really don't personally like shot gun treatments like this ...

Another division of my old company had a huge animal welfare division, mostly on nutrition, but a number of medications are often incorporated into feed. It's virtually impossible that such medical cocktails have ever been tested to cure discus, or even fish. They tend to be old treatments wrapped up in a bit of hype. No research exists in this area because there's no way to make money in it. What we know about fish health comes from aquaculture, in which case it's almost always better to kill and bury the sick animals then trying to "cure" them.

If you feel compelled to treat, I recommend getting pure flubendazole. Every one of these ingredients is toxic and putting four active compounds together makes recovery unlikely.

[brewmaster15]

Why is this medication under consideration? Have your fish been diagnosed with worms? Treating discus can be a complete crap shoot and flubendazole has a number of potentially nasty side effects. "Potentially nasty" means that sometimes it works, but often it damages the fish to such an extent that a potential cure becomes irrelevant.



Another division of my old company had a huge animal welfare division, mostly on nutrition, but a number of medications are often incorporated into feed. It's virtually impossible that such medical cocktails have ever been tested to cure discus, or even fish. They tend to be old treatments wrapped up in a bit of hype. No research exists in this area because there's no way to make money in it. What we know about fish health comes from aquaculture, in which case it's almost always better to kill and bury the sick animals then trying to "cure" them.

If you feel compelled to treat, I recommend getting pure flubendazole. Every one of these ingredients is toxic and putting four active compounds together makes recovery unlikely.

And that Willie is why I respect you so much.

[btrast18]

Thank you for the guidance Al and Willie. Given what your comments, I will just stick to metro, prazi and levamisole for now. I was just let to believe (from a YouTube video) that this medication was very safe. In fact that youtuber claimed to use this medication as a monthly treatment as preventative maintenance on his fish.

I am not 100% certain that my discus has worms. I had a total of 7 discus in my tank and in the past few months, one had white poop and so I moved him to a hospital tank and treated him with API General Cure and aquarium salt. That fish died in a week. Then another fish became very thin. I also moved him to a hospital tank and used the same treatment. I never saw any white poop but he was very skinny and was always hiding. That fish passed away about a week ago. So now I have one discus that eats and acts normal but he seems to be skinny. I would actually describe him as a strong eater because he is always at the top of the tank when I come to drop some food. Regardless, he seems skinny to me and so I assume it must be some type of worm.


I will take some pictures and share it with the forum to get some thoughts.

[mleibowi]

I'm no discus expert, but I do use cloverleaf with new discus in QT per Al's QT protocol. I haven't been able to find levamisole.

[seanyuki]

Dena @ Everything Aquatics sells Levamisole



https://everythingaquatic.net/product/levamisole/





QUOTE=mleibowi;1381230]I'm no discus expert, but I do use cloverleaf with new discus in QT per Al's QT protocol. I haven't been able to find levamisole.[/QUOTE]

[mleibowi]

Thanks Francis and Al for providing links. I've spent so much on discus meds dealing with the cross-contamination, I'm going to hold off the levamisole for now. I'll use the flubendazole I have from Clover Leaf first.