Tapeworm experience by Brewmaster15

[brewmaster15]

Hi ocastro,
That looks like worm to me, but the real key is if its segmented, look at it under a magnifying glass. If its segmented its a tapeworm, if not then probably a round worm.
For tape worms -- praziquantel availible from vets as Droncit, or email Barry @ billman@citynet.net You can also get it online but its expensive

read these posts....
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index...;threadid=1028

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index...;threadid=1031

if its not tapeworm.... then a general dewormer like panacur in the food is best ...

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index...;threadid=1138

or you can use flubendazole , avbailible at Jehmco.com and put this into the food...


Metronidazole will not have any effect on worms though.

hth,
al

[Aquatic_Design]

Al,
After reading this post I decided to use prazi on all of my discus. All came up clean except for one (out of 40). This was one of a pair that I purchased less then a year ago.
The discus has already passed six very long tapeworms and three days later is still passing worms. I found another four in the tank and it was still passing a few more. Would you repeat the prazi treatment? If so when?
Thanks,
Donna

[brewmaster15]

Hi Donna,
Tape worms pose no immediate threat to a fish, they do little physical damage, except for where they attach. The damage is basically a long term drain of nutrients from the fish. Because of this Fish can live with them for years.

I would treat again one week from the last , and I would treat all fish. 2-3 treatments are usually reccommended if there is any substrate. I have been doing 2 in the bare tanks.

HTH,
al

Al,
Dang you take some very interesting pictures. and this information is very useful.

Thanks
Miles

[Gipper]

In regards to the tape worms can the fish reinfest themselves by consuming the tape worm once it is passed? I have a few I am treating with prazi for gill flukes and one has passed a tape worm (pics in another post). I have been watching carefully and trying to get them out asap, however a few times the fish have beat me to them. Does the prazi kill the tape worm or just make them evacuate the fish?

Gipper

[brewmaster15]

Hi Gipper,

The long answer....
http://www.shinpoong.co.kr/tdc/Schis...m..."Upon exposure to praziquantel, flatworms rapidly contract their musculature. Praziquantel seems to produce a non-selective increase in permeability of the muscle cells of the parasites to divalent, cations such as Ca++. The increase in permeability results in an elevation of Ca++ within muscle cells which apparently triggers to contract. Morphologically, praziquantel causes vacuolization of the syncytial distal tegument. At first, the vacuole is small but begins to enlarge to form grossly recognizable bullae. These Processes can be observed in flukes or tapeworms, both in vivo and in vitro. In general, larger and more prolonged dosages of praziquantel are needed to kill parasites with thicker syncytial tegument.
The tegumental vacuoles finally burst leading the parasites to death. The predilection sites where vacuoles appear after the praziquantel treatment are different by parasites. For example, in Clonorchis sinensis the sensory papillae around the oral sucker are firstly affected whereas in Hymenolepis nana, the vacuoles appear mostly at neck region. In schistosomes, the vacuoles are confined to numerous small areas scattered all over the surface of the parasites. Other secondary effects are reduction of the incentration of endogenous glycogen, decrease in the release of lactate."

the short answer.... Prazi kills the tapeworms

As to the life cycle of Tapeworms ~99% require a secondary host to come along and eat those segments and eggs that they contain. That secondaery host in often an arthropod (copepods often) or mollusk (snail often). Then the fish eats these and gets the tapeworms. I have only seen one reference to a tapeworm that could directly reinfest a host directly, Hymenolepis nana (http://www.soton.ac.uk/~ceb/Diagnosis/volume4.htm )
Please note though that this tape is very small..2.5 - 4cm long, whereas most of those we seem to see in discus are much much larger larger!

Hope this helps....
-al

[Discus_KC]

Al,

Thanks for the info. I have a curiousity that has been driving me nuts lately. I have a fairly big group of adults that should be sexually mature but are not spawning.

I have Prazi and Flubendazole on it's way. I am anxious to treat all my fish and will be very curious to see the results.

I will keep you posted on what comes out of this ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;

Jack

[beta]

Hi all,
I want to give treatment for discus in a 35 gallon bare bottom tank.

How much should the dosage be?

Is the medicine light/temperature sensitive?

After how much time should i change the water?

What should i feed the discus during the course of treatment?

Will it affect the biological filtration in the Tank?

Thanks & Regards

Beta

[brewmaster15]

Hi beta,
These are the directions that came with my Praziquantel....
Prazi.... an effective and safe med for the treatment of gill and body flukes, tape worms, and other cestodes and tremotodes in ornamental aquarium fish. May be effeective against capillaria when administered in the food.
Bath.... 100mg/10 gal (1/4 tsp/20 gal)
allow meds to remain in the tank for 48 hours. Mechanical filter may be running- no carbon or other chemical media. On the third day begin daily water changes of 10 to 30% for the next 5 days. On the 7th day repeat the entire process. On day 14 a third treatment may begin. This would be prudent for tanks with gravel substrate , and no undergravel filter..
Fast bath.... 1/2 tsp /10 gal prazi to a small medical tank. Insert affected fish for 2.5 hours
Food.... Mix 1/2 tsp prazi to 1/4lb food. Typically used is beefheart or beefliver ground in a blender and frozen for future use. 2-3 feedings every other day should be sufficient.
prep in water , it doesn't go in well, shake or mix vigorously. In acetone , mix 3 parts acetone to one part prazi, then pour chalky substance over the tank water... be careful as it too much acetone will cause oxygen depletion....use only pure acetone.

Most people seem to use warm water , I used it with the Acetone and had no probelm. I used just enough acetone to make it slushy, then add water to the container. If you use acetone - don't mix it in plastic only glass!!! OH, I also did long term baths (whole tank treatments) 2x for bare glass, and 3x for planted tank.


hth,
al

[Discusgeo]

Brewmaters I hope you don't mind but I borrowed a picture or two to show and tell.
Thanks
George

[brewmaster15]

Hi George,
I do not mind at all... If I post it, It was meant to be shared! ;D

take care,
al

[Gnome]

Hi,
do anyone know where to buy praziquantel,
Cause I think my discus got tapeworm.

[brewmaster15]

email barry at billman@citynet.net

he sells it at a good price.

hth,
al

[Gnome]

[quote author=brewmaster15 link=board=10;threadid=1024;start=15#79373 date=1046117587]
email barry at billman@citynet.net

he sells it at a good price.

hth,
al
[/quote]

Thanks al,
I will email him right away, btw
what's acetone for? is it the praziquantel contains acetone or do I have to buy that too?
Thank you.
Gnome.

[brewmaster15]

Hi Gnome,
The acetone is a solvent that is often used to get the prazi to go into solution. Its not necessary though. You can mix the prazi with Ro water or distilled water and it will work well also.

hth,
al