New Policy in effect immediately....

[korbi_doc]

Hi all, I'm really sorry to read 'bout these ongoing arguments which have made the new policy necessary, but it kinda goes with the territory, human nature I guess. Unfortunately it makes for a lot of extra work for you moderators, who, I think, are doing such a great job in face of adversity. I do realize you have your own full lives out there & I appreciate all the hard work you put into this forum, & the time it takes to accomplish this. Please don't let this jeopardize the forum, & do realize that there are lots of us out here who are grateful for all your help & wish to continue this venue. & there is still a method available to anyone who wishes to let it be known if a breeder/seller/buyer is doing unjustified harm to the uninitiated. JMO Dottie (& thank you so much, Mods)

I am sorry I have to disagree, I have never understood about some no name lurker complaining that there are negative posts, that offends them, good god... put things in perspective... If I don't want to read something, then I don't, it is as simple as that, noone is holding my head to the monitor, prying my eyes open, making me read. Obscene, personal comments, self insults or flaming, I could understand, what is wrong in explaining what went wrong and why someone feels this way, positive or negative either way it should have equal place, to be fair.

[DanCBW]

Hey Cary,
or "Braw" as they say here

You better not start feeding your fish once a day !

Anyway I agree with both Al and you. I don't say much on the fourms, but have noticed it gets out of hand a little.
You and I have had conversations about service and we both agree that its best for all to give the best. I would hate to see a few not able to satisfy customers send out their e mails privately, which they have all the right to do. While none of our very satisfied customers or for that matter, us have a chance to say what they want to say.
JMO

BTW
Its Halloween here in Lahiana, 25,000-30,000 "grownups"
show up tonight, so its time to get dressed and ready.

Dan
Aquatic Foods

Dan,
You going as a blackworm?

[brewmaster15]

Hi anand,

Obscene, personal comments, self insults or flaming, I could understand, what is wrong in explaining what went wrong and why someone feels this way, positive or negative either way it should have equal place, to be fair.

In an ideal world you are right, but You have been a part of these forums long enough to know that these breeder/ buyer disputes never are done in a mature civil manner. the facts are always biased in one way or another, and they always spin out of control or are locked/edited etc. The moderators then have to deal with a barage of why this , why that? How dare you apply your judgement on the properness of this or that, as if there was a guide book to what should be acceptible across the broad spectrum of member's backgrounds here. It amazes me how many feel their opinion is the right one for a website that is used freely by many. (this isn't directed at anyone , just the sum of my 6 month tenure as owner of this site)

There just isn't a fair way to deal a situation where one person is claiming one thing, and another is claiming something else. If you know of a site that allows this kind of seasaw back and forth disputing , without it spinning out of control, then let me know.

Everyone wants to have their say, their rights , their freedoms on both sides of the issue. Most also forget there is a much bigger picture that moderators ,and the owners of this site have to deal with. After a long discussion we have determined this is in the sites best interest.

I am truly sorry if it doesn't sit well with some. It was not an easy decision to make. We tried what you suggest Anand... It doesn't work.

take care,
al

[brewmaster15]

Hi Dan,
thanks for stopping by!

hey i got my worms today 100% alive as usual, now heres a funny image for....

The scene is 20 teachers sitting around a tray of these worms, with a queasy look on there face as I instruct them to cut them into pieces so they can regenerate, and reproduce assexually...
thats what'll be happening at a workshop I am teaching this saturady! LOL (something I do on the side)

take care,
al

Al,
I am not suggesting anything, at the end of the day, you do what you feel is the best for the forum. I am not sure if having a double standard on someones opinion is a fair way to deal with a public forum. On a breeders point of view I would want my customers to spread the good dealings they had with me... in the same way on a cutomers point of view I want an unbiased experience by others with a seller. If you allow the positive remarks without any restrictions then you should allow any negative experiences as well. This is what I see is fair, and I don't expect others to see the same. Frankly the threads that where locked weren't that bad if you ask me, then again I am not your model poster either.

[ronrca]

Hear ye, hear ye!

Al,
I would not want to be in your position (except having your discus) but hang in there and keep up the great work. I love this forum. I have learned sooo much in these past few months.

As for this issue of disputes, even though we have democracy and freedom of speech, bah, bah, its Al's and Ryan's forum at the end of the day. They own it! They are responsible for it. They have put their time, money and energy into this. They can do want they feel is best and appropriate. Do I agree with their point of view, not really but then on the other hand, I enjoy this forum for what it is, based on sharing experiences and knowledge. I prefer to keep it that way and think that it should be the first priority. Both sides have valid points so I think I will let the mods bash this one out.

[dogmatix]

Hi Al and all the team

I agree with you all the way on this one, in New Zealand we have a totally different legal system and is very difficult to sue one and other for what i consider to be a no good reason and quite frankly i get sick of hearing people cry like babies because they cant raise good fish
Would it be possible to start a list, maybe photos and or short stories of visits by respected members to discus breeders and sellers? this should be locked or whatever so that is is purely postive recomendations by people.

I feel that you all provide us with a great service that is appreciated by soo many people .
Thanks heaps to you all Ben.

[GA Freshwater]

Can't we all just get along..?? ;D

Wow just got back home from Trick or Treating with my daughter and found a little time to go on line for the first time today and check Simply and find these 2 new pages.
Al, Ryan I feel for you, no matter what you do half of this board is going to disagree with your actions. But hey its your board. You two are the big fish in this pond so everyone has to deal with it or go find another pond to swim in. You two have the best discus board out here for now and I hope it stays that way. It seems several other boards have died a slow death involving the same problems you two are experiencing now.
Who knows maybe your new policy will help.
On a personal note I totally DISAGREE with your new policy but I will totally abide by your rules and live with it. The reasons are many but will not go into them here.
Lets just hope this all blows over and everyone can continue to contribute to this great board.
Randy

[Pick]

Some might say that staying with Simply is now going to be like looking at the world through rose colored glasses. I guess I tend to agree. If I'm interested in the real world drivel I know where to go, there's plenty of it out there. I enjoy a good fight every now and then. But I know that I can learn and post here without having to put up with any fighting (including any I might start).

If I did not like this forum I would leave. I was looking for a good one when I found this one LOL! It's a little like home. I just feel a little safer here.

TC

[fcdiscus]

Al, and Ryan et al, I will say this- i disagree with your decision, but I respect your right and choice to make it as you did. Frank

[Ryan]

I know that people are going to disagree with us, and that's perfectly fine. To be honest, I didn't want to come up with a new policy. However, you guys should see the email that the moderators are getting behind the scenes. Threats, mentions of lawsuits for slander and defamation of character, etc. This is serious business, especially for someone like me who agreed to help with this board for the love of the hobby, not because I wanted to be thrust into the politics.

We have to remember, how much of this board is actually about buyer/seller transactions? This policy should not be a major concern to most of you because A) we discuss a lot of topics aside from buyer/seller transactions, and B) because most of you know how to remain civil and mature.

What this policy is, frankly, is a warning to let everyone know that we can and will delete posts if they get out of hand. Since most of our problems revolved around these specific threads, the "policy" focused on those types of threads.

I totally support Dave Clubine's most recent post. He offered to e-mail his opinions of the breeders he's dealt with to anyone interested. No one is being denied information here, it's just not being discussed publicly, and that will save us all the headache of the bickering and arguing. There are 900+ members here from different backgrounds, cultures, parts of the world, religions, etc. We'll never ALL agree.

At any rate, here's hoping it all blows over and things get back to normal. And as many have said, there are other boards that are unmoderated or less strictly moderated for folks that need a taste of that too. Even the moderators here post at other boards, it's not like there's a competition for number of members or posts. I will continue to post on other forums, as I'm sure many of you will.

Ryan

[scottwheels]

G'day Al and Ryan - I know I'm a bit late with this thread, but there's no way I can keep up any more with the volume of posts that come accross this board every day. It's a testament to success that is high praise indeed! I don't normally post on these topics as they really have nothing to do with me, but I just thought I'd post as a show of support.

I guess no one is sorrier than you guys that it's had to come to this, that you've had to impose a "total fire ban". (pardon the pun) Still there's the email avenue for exchanging negative experiences. I for one am quite happy to post "I had a bad experience with Blah, email me if you want more info." And I will continue to extoll the virtues of good suppliers. Like so many people have said, there's 2 sides to every argument, and the details need to be taken in the context of the situation in which they occured. I really don't think this policy will affect me, or 99% of other posters on this board. Congratulations on a great forum and thanks for all your hard work.

Cheers, Scott