Leopard Snakeskins (long)

Hi Brigitte,

Sometimes I find myself trying to save the discus world and post things others do not understand. The problem is I learned to much to fast. I have allways wanted to help people and done so back when the discus fourm's first came out!

Man brigitte I changed so much and helped so much!

I did things like testing MEDS, DISEASES, BREEDING, FEEDING ETC.........

And shared it with all on the Discus Fourms.

Hell! I was the one who got everyone to start feeding blkworms.
I tought people how to parent raise discus just by changeing of few things.
I also pushed for the light backgrounds on discus tanks that so many use now. I Raised the Quality in the USA over the years with the help of the internet and others. I helped many treat diseases. Also you!
I Even bought other peoples discus they bought from other breeders. Payed to send them out and payed for testing at the same time paying for the discus. Why? cuz I wanted to learn and wanted to share it with all. I never wanted to hurt any other breeders BIZ.. All I wanted was truth to make our hobby better for everyone.


However I do agree Now that am way over My head And Know to much.
I know I say things that newbies need not hear or need to worry about! I know am either scaring them or they have no ideal what am talking about. I know I should not judge other peoples Discus Because yes beauty is in the eye of the beholder I agree on that But I do not agree letting the newbies think that the pic of a poor Quality diiscus is good. Or letting something be said that is not true!

Brigitte the color feeding done with whatever is used on small discus fry is to find the spotted types for grading. I have tons of reports with info on everything I claim or write on this forum. I would be glad to share it with anyone this one last time.

Also I will not take back what I said about trash And will not say other thing about it.
I will say this I do have a few good ones from sing sing (roy + sly) that are very nice indeed. I also have a few from malaysia that are clean and of ok quality that I plan to outcross so yes there are good ones out there. (BUT NOT FOR THE MOST PART)
Again I hope everyone has good luck with their new leps and lep ss.
really I do wish all of you the best! I also hope you breed them and see for yourself. one last tip before I go IMO its better to outcross them with something close. Never inbreed them brother + sister unless you trust your breeder and they are of f1 stock.

I guess the time has come were I should keep My big mouth shut. And let others learn for themselves. hell thats how I learned. :-X

Keno, I agree Big eyes wrong strain.

Toothfairy,
Again I have no reason to post false info to the board without prof.
Also Jack wattley does not breed discus anymore gabe imports them along with the rest of us.

Limige, and Others
I agree with You but how can you have suscess when starting with bad stock?

well I hate to call Myself a expert But maybe I'am Maybe this board does not need that at all.

To be honest am a little hurt about the phone calls and emails telling me am arrogent and mean. or that am getting favertisem for being around so long. Really am not like that at all and thats not how I became a FAV.

I know am a bad writer and leave alot of blanks but really all I want to do is teach and help. hell I no I made alot of people mad at me but please do not take it personal I think everyone is great.

You see my problem is I tryed to be everyones friend and tryed to make everyone happy. But when you make one happy you make another mad. Hope you understand.
Also I agree after reading a few of my old posts that I do seem cocky.
I guess it could be from hearing and anwsering the same Q's for so long.

Brigitte,
I want you to know that your post today has nothing to do with what am about to do. I also want others to know the same. This has been in the makeing for a few days now and after much thought I think it would be better if I move on. hell am not even selling Discus right now!
Anyways I have a chance to own part of my own forum were its not so busy. This way I'll have more time to stop and think were am going or what am trying to prove. instead of trying to save Discus world hurting others during My search.

I want Brew,april,Carol,Jim,Ryan,julz,paul,randel,beth and everyone else on the simply team that I might of forgot to mention to know,
You guys will allways be my friends. Am sorry for breaking the rules and making you guys look bad. Its just right now I think am at a time in My life were I might say the wrong things like I have in the past and only hurt this place more.

So I plan to log off but i'll be back from time to time to say hi to all of you.
I will allways KIT and try My best to stay out or cause debates
here ever again.
Your Friend to the End
Cary Gld!

[goldengatediscus]

Thanks for the input. I agree that the eyes on some of the LSS are large compared to the body. Also, on some of the fish, the spots have joined to form lines. I consider these fish nice, not perfect, but I'm very happy with them.
Mike Wells, I think that the LSS in the pic look beautiful. I'll let you all know if I have any success in breeding these.
Limige, you're absolutely right. Since I don't breed fish for income, I can take the time to try breeding some more highly spotted ones and culling more heavily. Maybe I can become the "spotted queen", sung to the tune of Dancing Queen by ABBA! ;D
I see comments about size again. Some like them big, nobody likes them small, but what if the LSS is just suppose to be a 4-5" fish. Is it all that bad?
Brigitte

[Don_Lee]

Cary,

I am certainly sorry to see you go, but understand why you would need to take a break. We always need experts like you here, and the more the better.

Don

[EthanCote.com]

Hey Cary,

Now you stop that. This forum was built for us to share info and help one another. And ofcourse you can always typed something that will not agree with 100% of the folks, but that is life!!!

Although from what you said, you have received personal attack and backlashes from your post but its unfair that you have to stop posting.

The only reason you are getting these backlashes is of your status as a discus breeder.

I still thinks its unfair to you and to the many here that can use your help and sense of humour.

Don't let the few stop you from posting. I can understand if you stop posting due to family situation or need more time for your fish and family but what I will not understand is for you to give up posting just because a few of the people view your posts differently.

Cary don't do it. This is a forum made of some really neat people from all different background, race, religions, etc... and opinions. It is a shame to have a few stop you from posting.

If its anything, sometimes we dwell too much on the negatives and less on the positives. I'm sure the positive feedbacks you have recieved in the past and still am receiving far outweight these negative feedbacks.

Just my two and a half cents.


Cheers,

Chi.

Pizzle, my Nizzle, Peace to my folks in Mississizzle, especially my Grandmizzle, you fizzle dizzle!

Have a good holiday buddy. Grow some nice big fish and enjoy your family. You've got tons of friends and they're all here for ya. Ciao Dogfather.

Dave

[Pat_in_NC]

Well said Dave!

Have a good holiday Cary--we'll miss you and I know I have appreciated your advice and help here and over the phone. I have a feeling you'll find your way back to help us hobbyists in one way or another. A lot of us (nearly all I would imagine) really appreciate your straight shooting--even if we don't always agree.

Your friend,

Pat

[erikiiy]

Brigitte

I am fairly new to dicus so I don't think it matters what I think, but those discus look very nice to me. I have never really seen great discus. Or what is suppose to be great.

If your gonna call a strain trash, then why don't you make a better strain then? Until you develope a unique strain (and better), keep the trash talk about strains to yourself.

[Ryan]

Erikiiy,

Breeders, including Cary, are trying to improve the strain by outcrossing them to wilds and such.

Beauty is not the only issue. You must also consider things like health, growth potential, cull rate in fry, and weaknesses in the strain in regards to certain treatments, medications, etc.

People are taking this way too personally. Have you bred leopards? What is your experience with trying to raise them? If not, how do you know there is no truth in what the breeders have said? They do more than just buy fish and keep them on display. Beauty may only be part of their problem as far as raising and selling fish goes.

Everyone needs to take a step back and cool off. There is no sense in getting bent out of shape because someone expressed their opinions (based on experience) with a certain variety of discus.

I agree that Brigitte's fish are beautiful. That is not the question.

Ryan

[allan_mark76]

Okay can somebody please state the "FACTS, FACTS, FACTS, FACTS, FACTS" as to why there are so many problems with Leapords. Right now I'm hearing a lot of here- say on this strain and no absolute harcore facts on Leapords???. I'm not a breeder nor an expert on DISCUS so can somebody please state very simply while yet accurately why there is such a problem with Leapords and LSS???.

Thanks.

A- ;D

[Barb Newell]

Cary:

:'( What will we ever do without you? My experience knowing you.... you tell it like it is..... no sh...t -- the problem as I see it, sometimes some people can't hear it like it is.

It's too bad that we can't just get along - so much conflict --- so much hurt --- life is too short.

Barb

[April]

ok..now im very sad my bestest buddy Cary has signed off.
Cary you never did wrong. and i think alot of newbies just dont see how passionate you are about your fish. and caring about the continuation of this great fish. and not turn into weak sick problematic fish.
i trust you completely when i have a problem. guess who id call.
Allan you want to hear a fact story? i had 15 leopards and lss. i paid big bucks for them especially with my canadian money. and i was in absolute love with them. i got all mine the same time everyone on here did get the first nicest looking spotted fish to come to NOrth america. we all got them. cary and mike and me.and a ton i can name who have been around for awhile. well...all mine grew and were great . and breeding. then..i got a very mild virus. all myfish got over it in about 5 days. my wilds were hardlytouched. my spotted fish..however...took two weeks. thought ok..theyve turned the corner. all was looking good for afew weeks. then....one by one theyd dart and freak out and crash and die. each day id come home from work to scoop another 140 - 300 dollar fish. in a few weeks..i was down to three. and each night id hear them thrashing and crashing. so finally they were so bashed up and sick i finally froze the last three. i wasnt willing to risk every fish in my house. no other fish got sick like this. all the others went on and were not phased.
so...i talked to alot of people asking for help.then i started hearing similar stories . once stressed...bang. and none of these people were new to discus. they were all successful discus keepers with lots of great fish and experience .
so....guess what kind of fish i have now.? rt and wilds and basic classic strains.
still like to see them...but sorry...i spent id say almost 2000.00 on them and have nothing to show.
hope i get proved wrong one day.
the offspring may be fine. no idea. but....alot turn into rt anyhow.
and its not the money. its the time like mike said. two years of waiting for them to breed. now i am back to all juveniles again.and have not had any fish to breed as my ones i was waiting for to breed were gone. so its a setback. and im not doing it for the money.but i had a plan.and i had my heart set on fry. etc. and the heartache is very stressful. you begin to doubt yourself. and think you dont have a clue how to raise discus at all.

[erikiiy]

No I have not bred leopard discus. I have 1 leopard, he is smaller than the rest of the small ones that I bought around the same time.

You mean that is how discus breeders (experts) should be.... Oh, this strain is hard to raise, lets call it trash, next strain. Maybe thats how some breeders are.

Heres another way to see it, since its a new strain, maybe it needs more time to figure out?

Anyways, I am not gonna make any more comments on this thread.

p.s. This post is not about anyone in particular.

Remember, holiday is coming up, lets keep it jolly..=). Better yet, lets keep it jolly all year around.




8)

[brewmaster15]

I am locking this post as it definetly makes me way to sad to leave up.


Those of you questioning the value of the leopard spot, and the opinions of breeders on them. Here is some advise.... learn to listen and read thru the lines.You are all privy to less than 1% of the facts when it comes to what goes on in breeder circles. If one of thekm posts something like this....open you eyes and pay attention.

These fish were the bread and butter of the breeders for a while... theres a reason why they are moving away from them. Yes there are good ones out there, but you would all be wise to know the origin of the leopards you get or have got , and I don't mean where you bought them. God knows I have knowledge of enough mysterious deaths of them, as well as other probelms.

I'm sorry to lose you here Cary.

-al