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Thread: Flubendazole side effect....

  1. #31
    Registered Member Apistomaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    I have used flubendazole on my Heckels without noticing any problems. Heckels are very sensitive to adverse things be they external such as water quality or internal diseases.
    I have had experiences with fancy domestic discus having balance problems caused by gas in ther digestive track which can be stressful for discus and keeper alike. It happens when too much dry food is fed and some times is associated with the sequence and types food their are fed. I notice this most when the discus are in adolescence and like teenagers, I think that not all the parts of the anatomy(swim bladder control) is in balance with their rapidly growing bodies because after they have grown up and reach spawning size/age the problem disappears.

  2. #32
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    I have frequently used flubenol (flubendazole) but have never used any third party agent to dissolve it. I have never experienced any adverse reactions. I use it as a 2 day treatment a week apart if needed. Treat day 1, leave for 24 to 48 hours w/c treat again then normal w/c routine, repeat a week later if needed. I have found it very useful when nematode and/or tapeworms are suspected and the fish are not eating. No adverse affects on the biofiletr and it can be used safely in a planted tank, but it will kill ALL snails so be warned. It is very effective against flukes and other parasites too.

    These are my personal experiences of using it, I consider it a real asset, particularly as we can now get it over the counter in the UK.

    I do know though that it is a pain to dissolve, I wonder if the various mediums people use to dissolve it in (alcohols etc) are trhe more likely cause of any problems observed. Maybe they afect the chemical characteristics or the way it is used by the fish. I dissolve the powder in pure RO and stir continuously.
    Paul

    Comfortably numb.

  3. #33
    SimplyDiscus Sponsor Ardan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Maybe there are different types?
    I have some from Florida Tropical Fish Farms (not used yet) that says it is 5%.
    Here there is a "special blend for tropical fish" in the UK.
    http://www.flubenol.co.uk/index.htm

    ???
    Ardan
    Last edited by Ardan; 01-14-2007 at 07:11 AM.

  4. #34
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ardan View Post
    Maybe there are different types?
    I have some from Florida Tropical Fish Farms (not used yet) that says it is 5%.
    Here there is a "special blend for tropical fish" in the UK.
    http://www.flubenol.co.uk/index.htm

    ???
    Ardan
    Pure flubendazole is not water soluble... hence why people use acetone or DMSO, neither of which are good for fish, Flubenol 15 has another ingredient that was specially developed to be safe for fish use in.

    The problem with Flubenol at 5% is that its not strong enough to kill all internal parasites and they can become immune to it and thats one of the reasons why Flubenol 15 was developed. It kills all parasites, is approved by the English Vetinary Medicines Directorate, cannot harm fish and also not be overdosed

    And yes, you can have it shipped from the UK from the site linked above as long as you email first
    Last edited by Paulf; 01-28-2007 at 09:17 AM.

  5. #35
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    PaulF,

    I think it important and fair to this forum's membership for you to explain exactly what your relationship is with

    http://www.flubenol.co.uk/

    The company you happen to own. If you are going to be critical of a product as you are you should at least be upfront about your possible biases. Just leaving the Link to your website in your profile isn't enough.

    Thank you,
    al
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  6. #36
    Registered Member Timbo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    personally, its really kind of hard for me to consider an opinion that has a direct financial interest attached to it, as being unbiased

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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Quote Originally Posted by brewmaster15 View Post
    PaulF,

    I think it important and fair to this forum's membership for you to explain exactly what your relationship is with

    http://www.flubenol.co.uk/

    The company you happen to own. If you are going to be critical of a product as you are you should at least be upfront about your possible biases. Just leaving the Link to your website in your profile isn't enough.

    Thank you,
    al
    Fair point al and sorry for the delay in replying.

    Yes that is my site, although I only sell it, not make it, as do a number of people in the UK, some of who have been selling it for years. Its not available in the states yet (no distributor).
    The main reason I set it up was not many people know/knew about Flubenol 15 and have been using illegal meds to worm their fish here and I also saw it as a way to make a little extra cash.

    There was a debate on another forum about flubenol15 and how good it was and comparing it to Prazi meds available in the states and other countries (Its not for sale here) The outcome of this debate was that the question was asked to a UK Government vet into the benefits and downsides to both meds. When this has been answered, I will post here what is said

  8. #38
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Thank you Paul.

    -al
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  9. #39
    Registered Member Mistakes R Crucial's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Hi everyone,

    Haven't been here for quite a while and the main reason for calling in today is not a happy one. Over the last 8 days I have lost 700 fish, it (whatever it is)has completely wiped out my fishroom including over 600 juveniles, 12 breeding pairs and around 20 spare adult breeders. We have looked at bacterial infections, poisoning and God knows how many other scenarios but when I came across this thread my heart nearly stopped.

    I have been waiting for Levamisole from my vet for nearly 4 months and because she couldn't get hold of it she suggested I use Fenbendazole (Panacur) at the rate of 2ml per 100 litres of water, it was in liquid form. I am very careful with meds and the dosage rates are always spot on. That was about 3 weeks ago. The first thing I noticed was a few 5 cent pieced sized juves, just 1 or 2, dead every morning. I put it down to a few flukes hanging around. A couple of weeks later all my breeders just looked off colour and not as mobile as they normally were and the older juves (7-8cms) started to get a whitish shadow around their dorsal and tail, like the start of fin rot. From there on in it was like the nightmare from hell! Firstly all the juves would huddle in the corner of a tank, started losing some slime coat and were gasping for breath, I thought we had the Plague. One by one the adults would hit the bottom of the tank and stay for a few days until they died, they just didn't have the energy to stay afloat. Most of them were tail standing prior to hitting the bottom of the tank and this they would do for around 24 hours. I had one or two others that were head standing before they hit the bottom. The fin rot, within 24 hours with the juves, has simply been horrendous with complete tails disappearing within that time. This has not been the case with the adults, a little fraying here and there but nothing much at all. The juveniles or at least many of them are black but the adults, every single one of them has died in full colour, no stress induced colour changes whatsoever.

    Until we get the results back from the State Government Lab I cannot be sure what has caused this but the symptoms a few other people here have experienced are very similar, too similar to my mind, for Fenbendazole not to have something to do with this.

    Any comments would be gratefully received.
    MAC
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    Last edited by Mistakes R Crucial; 03-06-2007 at 02:45 AM.

  10. #40
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    I'm sorry MAC,
    IMO,Those symptoms are consistent with what happens when you dose FENBendazole in the water... Its recommended to be dosed in the food...not water.

    http://www.simplydiscus.com/library/...matodes6.shtml

    I have done experiments where I tried it on culls after Burning good discus and the results are verifiable and repeatable. That dewormer should not be added to the water, IMO> ever.

    -al
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  11. #41
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    some more info...

    I believe in addition to the external burns, a side effect is gill damage...I had talked with a pathologist about this many years ago... Its why I have stressed the use of this FENBENDAZOLE only in the food...never added to the water.

    I think it was Dr. Ruth Francis-Floyd. Shes at the Florida coop extension. A search will find a wealth of info shes published and her contact info. Who ever I spoke with told me that the med destroys the gills of angelfish...so I can't imagine discus would be different.

    HTh,
    al
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  12. #42
    Registered Member Mistakes R Crucial's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Thank you Al, I am grateful for your information but it also makes me pretty mad as the vet we deal with specializes in fish and has a Phd so one would have thought she would keep up with the times. Obviously not the case.
    MAC

  13. #43
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Hi MAC,

    I understand the feelings here.. unfortunately Fenbendazole though used as a fish dewormer, is technically not marketed as such, nor as far as I know is it approved as such... Therefore..I am not sure the vet can be blamed. But its surprising that a Fish DOC didn't know this potential issue.

    It is a terrible loss though and I am sorry for you!

    I think you should try to document the recommendations of fish pathologists and then talk with your vet..At least you can protect others down the line.

    hth,
    al
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 03-06-2007 at 03:53 AM.
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  14. #44
    Registered Member Mistakes R Crucial's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Thanks Al, I'm not out to blame anyone, I'm past that to be honest. It's been a very emotional week and I am simply looking for answers and I think I may have found one.
    MAC

  15. #45
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    Unhappy Re: Flubendazole side effect....

    Sorry to hear about your lost

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