General discussion on the Heckel's Natural History

[Apistomaster]

Hi kayceo,
I appreciate you wellwishes but I have no illusions about the challenge they pose.

Salvo and I have been in a contact for some time now sharing our observations and thoughts about Heckels and have become fast E-friends.
We are approaching the challenge slightly differently which I feel is not a bad thing as I feel it will take much experimentation to come to more useful conclusions. We do do differ in our belief that Heckels require water matching their native habitat but I am using water with a pH of about 7.2 and 110ppm TDS for raising my fish.
I am doing this for two reasons: 1. Laziness or convenience. and 2. Discus tend to grow faster in water with more dissolved minerals.

I do not think that it will work for breeding though. I may even be running a risk that the ovaries with be damaged. Again, experimenting.

Larry W.

[Moon]

I agree with your thoughts Larry. Mine are in well water for grow out. When they are adults I will change water parameters. They are still small and will take about a year to mature. Interesting thought about the development of ovaries.
Joe

[Apistomaster]

Hi Joe,

Don't be too surprised if Heckels take twice as long as other discus to become mature enough to spawn.

Larry W

[Moon]

Hi Larry
I have lots of patience.
Joe

[Apistomaster]

Calcium deposition in the ovaries of many of the SA soft water tetras such as in Cardinals, Rummy Nose, Neons and the like has been cited in aquarium literature regarding problems with spawning fish reared in harder alkaline waters so that thought lingers over me as I grow my Heckels up in 7.4pH and 110mg/l TDS.
I am just giving it a try.
Mine are beginning to act much more like adults now that they are all 4-1/2 to 5 inches in diameter. A little courtship, bonding between pairs, and increased territoriality by said pairs. It is looking good so far. I think I'm looking at abiut 6 to 9 more months for my fish to become fully mature.
I got all the way with a pair of Heckels I bought as large adults many years ago as cleaning and guarding a site on a large flower pot. That was when I lived on the other side of the river from where I live now. The pH was the same but the TDS was 240mg/l. I was able to breed and raise wild greens, and Blue/browns in that water.
I know that 110mg/l is very high compared to the Rio Negro lagoons but just maybe healthy Heckels can be successfully bred in this water. I am more concerned about the osmotic pressure of this water preventing normal egg development as it does with the softwater Characins so I will change parameters when a pair gets serious and they are in their own tank.

Larry Waybright

[Moon]

My ph is 8.2 and TDS 340mg/l and raise all my domestic discus in this water. The baby Heckels are in this water for now and so are the Altums. I am thinking of changing the water in the Altums tanks this summer. They are about 18 months now.
Joe

[brewmaster15]

Hi larry,

Calcium deposition in the ovaries of many of the SA soft water tetras such as in Cardinals, Rummy Nose, Neons and the like has been cited in aquarium literature regarding problems with spawning fish reared in harder alkaline waters so that thought lingers over me as I grow my Heckels up in 7.4pH and 110mg/l TDS.

Do you have references for these articles... Its of interest to me and I have not seen reference to it before.. I have seen it speculated that discus eggs once layed do not hatch in hard water because of the minerals in the water..The thought was always that this took place outside the fish though.. If theres info on it happening inside the fish...that is very interesting.

Thanks,
al

[Apistomaster]

Hi Al,
I can't recall the specific references. It is something I have come across in articles and old texts over the past 40 years and all in reference to SA softwater Characin breeding. If I find anything I'll post it. I think it is a hypothesis put forth by German authors.
Larry

[raglanroad]

Hi Al,
I can't recall the specific references. It is something I have come across in articles and old texts over the past 40 years and all in reference to SA softwater Characin breeding. If I find anything I'll post it. I think it is a hypothesis put forth by German authors.
Larry

There have been many such references to some calcium related difficulty in getting the eggs to come out. I think a few might have been scientific references, Larry. I can't remember offhand though.