Ok!, Thats it for me, I AM DONE. Goodbye simply

[dinodiscus]

Oh, Man! I am so sorry for your lost. I totally understand your frustrations. I, myself is still recovering. One thing I learned though, discus hates change, they love routine. I am ageing and aerating my water for 48 hours now and I am using Seachem Safe. So far, keeping my finger cross, I did not have any accident.
I don't know what's in it for me but I just can't give up. The learning process for this hobby has lot bumps and curves but seeing your young ones gleaming and asking for food is just part of the reward.
I hope you will not give up on them.

Dinodiscus
I murdered them too.

[discusmurderer]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you haven't been adviced or acknowledge on what you are doing, I wouldn't advice throwing in medicines as it will cause stress to the discus (especially at a young age). The best thing you could do now is to provide them with good clean water and salt to help them fight the 'flukes'.

Are the two discus eating at all?

Hope all is good,

Yes they are eating, but only when they stop swirling around. someone told me that they had flukes so i thought of throwing in some formalin, i did not know that it would affect them. i will try salt and clean water and leave them alone.

[rickztahone]

i'm really not trying to bag on you OP, seeing as you are going through some tough times, but i don't undestand how you are going through these issues again. did you not heed ANY of the advice given to you the first go around? if you would read some of the stickies, you would know that ammonia is bad. i understand when you need to put discus in a hospital tank with no bacteria in a crisis, but to just ignore cyclying even after you've had a bad experience the first time around? had it been me i would have read up as much as possible and done everything by the book. then if you had problems it would make things a lot easier for us to tell you your options. again, not trying to make you feel back but there is a plethora of information on this site that you could have attained quite easily to avoid this problem this time around.

[discusmurderer]

Do you have a name brand for the 'bed sponge?' If I remember correctly, I posted that I had poisoned a pair and fry using cushion foam.

This foam is made here in a factory called ( Vicmol foam factory ) and i remembered u saying that .

i would say your not cycled..and if ammonia happens..ph drops...and they start spiralling..done it myself..sounds like the right amount of time for the ammonia to start spiking. i think you would need to do almost full wcs daily to keep from it getting ammonia. and i would store water..have it aerating..
sorry to hear..but im sure someone can help to sort it all out.

WELL! a breeder was just here and he said that i was stressing them out with too many wc's, now i don't know what to do. I think your advice sounds like the best one and Darrell Ward's. but one Thing ( the amm was between 0 and 0.25, isn't that low?. that was a reading after i did a 50% wc on a 133gal.

Any amount of ammonia is too much for discus. You didn't change enough. 100% water change is in order here. Cool it with the meds until you get a handle on your water, or you'll truly be a "discusmurderer".

ok i will try changing 100% tomorrow, i just did 50% at 6 pm so i guess i will stress them out if i turn on the lights now. the only time they started to do this is after i treated them with formaldehyde the first time and today i treated them again, i will do a 100% wc tomm. and see if they stop acting this way.

[discusmurderer]

i'm really not trying to bag on you OP, seeing as you are going through some tough times, but i don't undestand how you are going through these issues again. did you not heed ANY of the advice given to you the first go around? if you would read some of the stickies, you would know that ammonia is bad. i understand when you need to put discus in a hospital tank with no bacteria in a crisis, but to just ignore cyclying even after you've had a bad experience the first time around? had it been me i would have read up as much as possible and done everything by the book. then if you had problems it would make things a lot easier for us to tell you your options. again, not trying to make you feel back but there is a plethora of information on this site that you could have attained quite easily to avoid this problem this time around.

Ok i am sorry for not reading up and not listening but listen to this one. I had a cycled tank and the fish are going fine, from one inch to five inches and no treatment of any kind and all of a sudden they start darting around and doing the whirling thing, the tank was cycled.no meds. What went on there? i am certainly going to try 100% wc in the morning, how does that sound to you? I so wanted those fish i couldn't wait for six weeks for my tank to be cycled, You know the fever( the fish demond) that says buy that one!!!NOW!. I could'nt help myself, i just had to get them. What is the best thing u would do right now?

[discusmurderer]

What about amm. dropping solutions Can i use them in this case? or should i keep doing wc's instead of using chemicals to lower the amm.

[nc0gnet0]

What about amm. dropping solutions Can i use them in this case? or should i keep doing wc's instead of using chemicals to lower the amm.

You can do both, but I have to say, you have a tendency to treat first and ask questions later. I am sensing a pattern here. You need to resist the urge of throwing chemicals in the tank everytime you think you see something wrong.

.25 is not an immediate threat, but you need to have 0 ammonia. I am curious to see what your ammonia level will be PRIOR to your next water change. Salt is unneccesary until you start to get nitrite readings.

For starters I recomend at a minimum 2 50% water changes a day, preferably 12 hours apart. I also recommend a product called ammo lock at only recommended doses (ie: follow the instructions). Unfortunatly, you have put yourself in a position in which it will be neccesary to have at least low levels of ammonia in your tank for about 6 weeks, otherwise your tank will never cycle.

For all the money you have spent on fish and meds, I cannot for the life of me figure out why you insist on using cheap homemade filter material. Go out and get yourself some decent sponge filters like the Mark IV's or Mark V's. have them shipped to you if neccesary. Nobody here knows for sure if your bed foam is safe or not, it is all about eliminating possible problems.

[April]

FORMALDEYDE WILL KILL ANY CYCLING YOU MAY HAVE HAD. IF YOUR AMMONIA WAS STILL THAT AFTER A WC..IT MUSTVE BEEN ALOT HIGHER BEFORE THE WC.
IF YOUR ONE TANK IS GOOD..THEN LEAVE THEM IN THERE TILL YOU GET THAT OTHER ONE CYCLED. NORMAL IS 6 WEEKS..ADDING A BIT OF AMMONIA DAILY.

[discusmurderer]

Wait ,wait. i think i am now getting this. A cylcled tank would have made it easy for the fish (juvies) to acclimatised and there would have been 0 everything and nothing to affect the fish! SO THATS IT!!!! when i see the fishes scraping its not only flukes would cause it but either amm. or nitrites and i go treating with meds and cause a greater problem. SO THE SECRET IS A CYCLED TANK!!! why did'nt someine tell me the secret from the begining. MAN i can't believe it is so easy. BUT WAIT , what would explain my big fish already in a cycled tank freaking out after months of being in there?

[discusmurderer]

You can do both, but I have to say, you have a tendency to treat first and ask questions later. I am sensing a pattern here. You need to resist the urge of throwing chemicals in the tank everytime you think you see something wrong.

.25 is not an immediate threat, but you need to have 0 ammonia. I am curious to see what your ammonia level will be PRIOR to your next water change. Salt is unneccesary until you start to get nitrite readings.

For starters I recomend at a minimum 2 50% water changes a day, preferably 12 hours apart. I also recommend a product called ammo lock at only recommended doses (ie: follow the instructions). Unfortunatly, you have put yourself in a position in which it will be neccesary to have at least low levels of ammonia in your tank for about 6 weeks, otherwise your tank will never cycle.

For all the money you have spent on fish and meds, I cannot for the life of me figure out why you insist on using cheap homemade filter material. Go out and get yourself some decent sponge filters like the Mark IV's or Mark V's. have them shipped to you if neccesary. Nobody here knows for sure if your bed foam is safe or not, it is all about eliminating possible problems.

You are perfectly correct, i will eliminate one by one and start slapping myself in the face next time. i just keep ducking from buying a $100 sponge filter when i could make it myself, i even mixed tile grout to make a base for the filters to sink. i am going to do the 50% 12 hours apart tomm.How are the big ons not doing that ?

[peterhql]

Sponge filters are like.... 7 dollars. It's quite possibly the cheapest filtration on the market.

[DiscusKev]

...SO THE SECRET IS A CYCLED TANK!!! why did'nt someine tell me the secret from the begining. MAN i can't believe it is so easy.

Basic stuff

You are perfectly correct, i will eliminate one by one and start slapping myself in the face next time. i just keep ducking from buying a $100 sponge filter when i could make it myself, i even mixed tile grout to make a base for the filters to sink. i am going to do the 50% 12 hours apart tomm.How are the big ons not doing that ?

Sponge filters are relatively cheap and efficient to run, a good one will cost you $15 (rated 500litres), but off course there should be cheaper ones of the same quality from our sponsors.

[Altum Nut]

You are perfectly correct, i will eliminate one by one and start slapping myself in the face next time. i just keep ducking from buying a $100 sponge filter when i could make it myself, i even mixed tile grout to make a base for the filters to sink. i am going to do the 50% 12 hours apart tomm.How are the big ons not doing that ?

I don't like what I see. Did you say you made a filter base with tile grout and put it in your tank.
NO-NO-NO, it will leach into your water column and poison your fish.
Yes, sponge filters complete will run you $10 max ea. but you will also need a pump to run it. Something for your purpose will be around $50 which will run two or three airlines.

...Ralph

[DavidH]

+ on what Ralph pointed out and if you had a breeder over is it possible to borrow some bio from him. I know Angel Plus sells seeded sponges but they do warn of snails, your call.
Good Luck

[discusmurderer]

Sponge filters are like.... 7 dollars. It's quite possibly the cheapest filtration on the market.

In the US, but here its $100 bucks, i think i will start shipping in stuff myself.

Basic stuff



Sponge filters are relatively cheap and efficient to run, a good one will cost you $15 (rated 500litres), but off course there should be cheaper ones of the same quality from our sponsors.

If i was in the US i would have all these things at my fingertips but here we only have one type of sponge filters ( azoo)

I don't like what I see. Did you say you made a filter base with tile grout and put it in your tank.
NO-NO-NO, it will leach into your water column and poison your fish.
Yes, sponge filters complete will run you $10 max ea. but you will also need a pump to run it. Something for your purpose will be around $50 which will run two or three airlines.

...Ralph

you have a point there, i will take out the grout.

+ on what Ralph pointed out and if you had a breeder over is it possible to borrow some bio from him. I know Angel Plus sells seeded sponges but they do warn of snails, your call.
Good Luck

Great idea , i am going to call him now and ask him for one or two sponges.