Patty, nothing makes me feel as good as when someone who I like buys fish from me and is so jumping up and down delighted with them. I know that they will do just fine under your care.
I was never much of an angel lover until I started seeing Liz’s Angels. It didn’t take long for me to fall in love. I am now the proud owner of 2 Half Black, 2 German Blue Blusher Pearlscales, and 2 Baby Blue Platinum Pearls!
These pics don’t do them justice. They are feisty, healthy and hungry and I couldn’t be happier. Thank you Liz for these beauties! 3AB6CC11-72F9-43CD-9873-331D03992A27.jpg988B7EB4-8C35-4B29-A0AD-78BCE1E56951.jpg
Patty, nothing makes me feel as good as when someone who I like buys fish from me and is so jumping up and down delighted with them. I know that they will do just fine under your care.
Mama Bear
The TV is on, but nobody’s watching it....ha I’ve been staring at fish all day. I’m giddy over them and they seem to like their new digs now that I slowed the current down.
No more pictures for a while Liz, I’m out of tanks! Ha ha
Patty
The form on the HB is almost perfect. Very nice fish.
Liz, are the German blue blushers the newer "Paraiba" type (S/S and pb/pb) or the old timey ones (either S/S alone or D/g and S/S)?
S/S pb/pb plusmine are pearlscales and parent raised to boot!
Mama Bear
Nice fish Patty
Liz should does do a nice job with her angels.
Pat
Your discus are talking to you....are you listening
Ah, should've known. Paraibas always have those cool black fin tips. Love it when they get the shiny patches.
I would like to know what pb/pb S/S is. Where can I learn about these guys? Liz, I really like you too. You were one of the first people who guided me through my first discus tank even though you don’t remember. When we talked I felt like I already knew you. I’m still jumping up and down happy too. My discus are probably feeling slighted. The only problem is they don’t like Discus Hans premium fish flakes yet. They love Al’s fdbw though and I’m going to order them his pellets. 0989D418-FC7D-40B8-8D6B-394C01726D5A.jpg
pb/pb, S/S means your fish has two Philippine blue genes and two stripeless genes in the angelfish geek language. Paraiba is the name I learned, but German blue blusher sounds cooler.
This is a good place to start with angelfish genetic jargon: http://www.angelsplus.com/ArticleGenetics.htm, http://www.angelsplus.com/ArticleGenetics2.htm
Cool calculator (though some of the phenotype names vary): https://angelfins.ca/index.php?main_...ics_calculator
Capital letters (S for stripeless, D for dark, etc.) denote dominant or incomplete dominant traits. Stripeless (S) is an incomplete dominant, as it will always express if present but does different things if there are 1 or 2 copies of the gene. A single stripeless gene (S/+, + denotes "wild-type" or plain) makes for a "ghost" (usually removes the vertical bars along the body). Double dose stripeless makes "blushing" (their gills look like rouge when young as you can see through the gill plates easily). These fish lack bars and develop random shiny patches like your paraiba/German blue blusher soon will.
Lower case letters (a for albino, pb for blue/Philippine blue, etc.) denote recessive traits. These need two copies of the gene to express.
Took me forever to figure the capital/lower case thing, so hopefully this helps.
Some names not mentioned in the Angels Plus's article:
KOI (not sure how this one slipped) - gm/gm or gm/g, S/S (double gold marble or gold marble and gold, double stripeless)
Clown - S/Z (stripeless and zebra)
Paraiba - S/S, pb/pb (double stripeless, double blue)
Veil - V/+ (single dose veil)
Superveil - V/V (double veil)
Pinoy - D/(), pb/pb (at least one dark gene, double blue. People screw this one up a lot for some reason)
Platinum - g/g, pb/pb (double gold, double blue. Plats lack bars without stripeless genes)
Another side note: your paraibas and plats are probably going to grow more slowly than silver angels of the same starting size. Blues and blacks grow slower for whatever reason. Those half-blacks though are stellar. Liz, are those from that miracle spawn you posted a while back? Where every single fish from the spawn was the same size?
Wow Adam! This is so cool!
I just happened upon a pic of a pair (maybe the parents) a few weeks ago on SD. Liz titled it weird and said you would either love them or hate them and I loved them, but wasn’t into breeding. I had other plans for my planted 75 gal. Then I happened on another pic of those HB and again I couldn’t stop thinking about them. I pictured them in my tank and the German Blues and that was that! I am over the moon with these. I’m showing pictures and videos at work like a proud mom!
Thanks for taking the time to explain the genetics to me. Fascinating stuff! We have our first named tropical storm of the season here in Florida, Albert, but I’ll have time to check out that site and learn more about my new fishies this weekend. Thanks again for sharing. You guys aren’t just breeding fish, you’re breeding geeks!
Patty
Patty, I'm got nearly as good at genetics as Adam. I actually call it Greek. I kind of understand it but I don't speak it well at all. I know enough to know what I have in Greek and how to breed to get what I want but after that I breed my fish based on their quality.
I kick myself every time I do it but I feed Al's freeze dried black worms to my Angels every night for dinner. I keep telling myself that this is expensive food and I that I should feed it only to my Discus but I am weak. I see how my Angels tear into it and I just can't help myself. I feed pellets for their lunch but all my tanks are BB. I wouldn't feed pellets in a tank with gravel. I feed the flake I PM'd you about for breakfast.
I love it that you are so over the top in love with my Angels. You are so over the top in love with them that it's a bit embarrassing to me.
Adam, those Half Blacks do indeed come form the amazing spawn that I posted about a while back. The problem is that that pair never raised their own kids again and non of their offspring will raise their own kids. The artificial raising thing, although easy with Angels, brings me no joy. I am separating pairs into breeding tanks when they spawn and offering them as unproven pairs. The eggs last a couple of days before they are eaten. They would be a good deal for anyone into the artificial thing. Send me a PM if you are interested in a pair. I'd rather sell them to folks here than sell them on AB.
Mama Bear
@ Liz.Do you believe that when angels are artificially reared that they do not make great parents.I have 8 albino dantum angels about 14 months old.The males do not seem interested or mature and do not pass over the spawn.I have reared angels in the past with no issues(about 12 years ago).Just getting back into one of my favorite fish again.
I think it's OK, Liz. We could move this to a new thread if there's enough interest. I've read the rumors about hormoning for years, but I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who had some hard evidence or direct experience that it's happening.
Moved off topic posts to this thread http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showth...of-Infertility
Last edited by Second Hand Pat; 05-29-2018 at 04:39 PM. Reason: Added link
Thank you Steve.
Mama Bear
They are some pretty cool looking Angels! Good job Liz and good pick up Patty
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