what is best used for cleaning sand bottoms??

[spiffyfish]

ok so my tank right now is a bb, but i have been contemplating putting a thin layer of pool filter sand just enough to cover the bottom. i have used it before but in a thicker form and it was such a pain to keep clean i could never figure out what to use to keep it clean. so what are you guys that have sand for a substrate using to keep it clean.

[krislewis3]

I used to have a very beautiful fine white sand in my tank, and yes, it was a pain to vacuum...much of it went down my drain. Then I put my thinking cap on, and simply bought white sand in a larger grain size and weight. Now I can easily vacuum. If you look on-line at aquarium sand, you will notice that it comes in several different sizes. The larger the grain size, the heavier it is, and the easier is it to vacuum. Perhaps someone here at SD can suggest the best size, since I can't remember now what I bought. Good luck.......kris

[sandy]

But if u feed BHM it will not spoil the water?

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2

[spiffyfish]

i will be using pool filter sand which is a little bit more grainy but is still sand, but ive noticed it is heavier than most aquarium sands. i just havent found the best thing to vacuum it with.

[Elliots]

There are several things to buy. !) A battery operated vacuum. It is water proof. 2) A siphon ( Python is a siphon) with about a 2" wide clear plastic attachment so the gravel is sucked up and falls back down. These clear wide tubes come in different lenghts. One of them comes with a Python

[spiffyfish]

I have 2 pythons but with the attachments they never cleaned the sand out very good, i know eheim makes the battery powered but idk if its worth the money.

[SaucyKP]

Eheim quick vac pro is a good tool for cleaning the surface of the sand, as far as deep cleaning it is not a good option. When you dig deep with the eheim, the sand pieces tend to jam up the spinning mechanism (don't know what its called). It works great for surface and up to 1/2" depth of sand cleaning. If its only a thin layer of sand you are planning to use it for, it will probably do the job. I think the python is still your best option for deep cleaning along with larger grain sand as stated previously. HTH

[Elliots]

I have both, the Eheim is good but you have to be careful or it will pick up sand also. You can add the sand back into the tank but you have to seperate the stuff you vacuum out and the sand. I being somewhat lazy have an extra 50 lbs of pool filter sand to add back into my tank so I just dump the entire contents of the vacuum.

[kreekree]

I am having the same issues....I have the python but it doesn't seem to suck up the cory poop. I have tried other syphons and they still do not sift up the cory poop. My white pool sand now has black speckles of what I assume is cory poop. I keep the cory's around because they tend to eat up the extra discus pellets the discus eat and spit out at times.

[SaucyKP]

If you are using the python off of a sink attachment you won't get very much suction in my opinion. I hook the python to a water pump and the amount of suction is really really good. Like Elliots said, it does suck up some sand too, but that is easy to replace.

[bogia99]

You guys have got to try the circulating pump or a submerged pump with suction cups, install it on the side glasses pointing to the other end , 1"-2" off the bottom, adjustable flow/angle is highly preferred. You will have to play with it until you get the desirable result. The end result is as soon as you turn the pump on (or set it on a timer), you are gonna see all the big/little poops/leftover skipping along the bare bottom toward the inlet of your filter (on the other end). This doesn't work very well if you only have sponge+hob filters. 5-10min is all I need for my bb. You will need a bit more power/longer time for the sandy bottom. For sandy bottom with plants + wood etc , I was able to get only about 1/3 cleared (about 2 feet). I already bought a more powerful circulating pump but haven't install it yet (should work at least 3-4'). I don't dig into the sand any more (see no need for it). Worst case, you only need to vacuum 1/3 the length of the tank. good luck guys.

[spiffyfish]

I have an over flow and sump on my tank so A powerhead probably is out of the question for me.

[bogia99]

I have an over flow and sump on my tank so A powerhead probably is out of the question for me.

that is what I have also, an overflow and a W/D .... extend your overflow intake all the way to the bottom of the tank with PVC to pickup all the junks and put a filter sock or catch it all prefilter plate in your sump. Once you figure out all the little thing to have it work properly, you will be glad that you did. Overfeeding cleanup is no long a problem. (don't forget to drill a hole which will break the intake suction at the max capacity of the sump when you lose power).

[pastry]

Chris, I think I might have the sand grain size you're thinking of in my tank (took it straight from the beach). It'll get sucked up if I jam the syphon into it but otherwise I have no problem not having it sucked up. It's pretty heavy. I like it because it's small enough so poop and food just rest on top yet heavy enough so it doesn't get syphoned up. Now with plecos and other things that may disturb the sand then of course there'll be "gunk" that gets trapped under sand so you'll have to accept that fact. Roots of the plants I have in mine are pretty thick and I'm sure love that "gunk" but at the same time that doesn't mean they eliminate bad things from tat gunk. That's just a risk that I've accepted and who knows... may end up wiping out my fish some day yet I haven't experienced that yet (knocking on wood... seriously). By the way... I found out that taking sand from the beach is illegal apparently... "who'd a thunk?"... looks damn good with my "illegal" driftwood though!

[shoveltrash]

I'd like to know the exact "grain size" of sand that is best to use......a bit o/t, but this thread prompted me to ask! :)

[kreekree]

I was trying to explain to my hubby that my cory poop was too light and was getting stuck in the pool sand. He can't appreciate my problems.;) Anyone with some ideas lets me know :)

[pastry]

trish, i have no idea. will try to figure out.

kreekree, i have the worst tank when it comes to poo. i have poo everywhere in my tank and just try to get as much as i can when i use the syphon. most of the times i just do mostly the WC without syphoning (big no no obviously... i'll admit). the funny thing is now you have me watching my cories to see when the poop! if it's too light then why wouldn't a syphon work? just confused.

[kreekree]

The Cory poop is just tiny little specks (I think as I have never witnessed them pooping). It sucks up into the siphon but i
the siphon sucks up the sand as well and doesn't sift out the poop from the sand. If I just move above the sand it's not heavy enough to move so it doesn't suck. Each time I'm siphoning I'm digging and moving the sand everywhere.

[Elliots]

Trish, your question about grain size earlier today. I have HTH brand pool filter sand. It costs $8-$12 for 50 pounds. You might be able to find the grain size on the internet or contact HTH. It is beige in color. I originally wanted white sand. I have not compared HTH with the brand of white sand that was unavailable. I like the beige, it looks a bit more natural than what I think the white would have looked. I am very successfully growing sword plants and Aponogeton Ulvaceus (I did not check the spelling.) I use root fert tabs and I add Flourish Plus every time I change water. My tank is 60X24X25, 150gal. Only the back half of my tank has almost a wall of plants. I know I need to buy a camera or at least use my cell phone camera. I have eight 24" bulbs, two are T5 HD 1000K, two are T5 6700K and four are Colormax. They are housed in four 30" reflectors. The bulbs all have different wattages totaling about 150 watts. The plants are doing great. I trimmed the swords once, too bushy. Now I have to do it again. I have had the tank running about 15 weeks. Instead of cycling the tank I used API quick start. The extra infomation is to let you know that this size pool filter sand works well with plants. I also have those black spots in the gravel but I have a lot of fish so I did not know which fish it comes from. I have a very large bioload of tetras and clown loaches. Ten 5" Discus arrived four hours ago. I personally imported them from Maryland to NYC. I vacuum the gravel and sometimes replace what came out with the vacuum. I hope I answered the question you asked and the questions you didn't ask.

[pastry]

kreekree... I can't figure out the size. The closest I can come is probably equating it to the size of table salt or standard sugar for coffee. It's not powdery at all but won't let poo seep under it!

[Elliots]

I just Googled HTH PFS. There was a price of $6.36 for 50 lbs. I do not know if that includes shipping or if you have to pick it up. It appears that it is #20 size silica sand that is .45 to .55 mm.

[spiffyfish]

the sand i was using was an even larger grain. i was using quickrete pool filter sand it was also beige and looks really nice just could never figure out the best way to clean it. the specs from there site are US Sieve Size 20-40 Particle size (0.85-0.425 mm).

[pastry]

Chris, i'm still a bit confused but even being confused i'm still pretty confident that a python/aqueon water changer with syphon is going to be your best bet. unless you've got some sort of set up where your water output from your filter is just above the substrate level and blows your poo across the aquarium to one side where your intake and syphon can suck it up then i don't know anything else that's going to wet your whistle, boss. poo happens :p be one with the poo... just get rid of it the next day!

[spiffyfish]

im probaly going to use the python with gravel attachment, it may be cause the tank i had the sand in it was a thick layer with a large load of fish, the tank now does have a large load, but im wanting just enough layer of sand this time to cover the bottom. i think a bb with wood is an eyesore. so i guess i will only know how well it works when i finally put a thin leyer of sand in the tank and see what happens.

[pastry]

Chris, I'm also the same way on thinking a BB with wood is an eyesore and like having sand. We both know the risk we're taking. You'll be fine, bud. Either way, there's only one way to find out, right? I keep seeing some AWESOME tanks on here by people with wilds that have just wood, sand, but NO plants and I'm amazed. It's more of a natural discus setting and I want to do it but I think the plants I have right now take care of at least some of the crap from the fish so that's why I'm hesitant... yet that's what I want to do in the next year or two. If I do that then I think I'll do what you're talking about... thin layer of sand. My sand right now is as deep as 4+ inches at certain points which is too deep I think. Either way... take PICS!!! Let us know how it turns out!

[spiffyfish]

my fish are all domestic imports nothing wild yet but maybe in the near future, but it certainly looks better with stuff in the tank. i ordered 2 jumbo Rt's from Kraig so i probably wont see them till the beginning of the year so i wont be taking the plunge till after that.

[nikond70s]

i bring in my garden hose to do waterchanges. while i do that i use the garden hose to suck out all the poops in the tank. then re-attach the hose to fill up my tank. works great nothing fancy.

[krislewis3]

My main poop problem isn't the cory cats, but the bristle nose cats!!! It's utterly amazing the amount of mess they can make in one day . Can someone enlighten me on this problem? Kris

[krislewis3]

Has anyone come up with the sand grain size needed for, keeping the mess on the top of the sand, and, for vacuuming without pulling out sand and destroying my pipes?

[3dees]

I use a python without the attachment. I get better suction that way. just put a bucket under the faucet and you won't lose any sand.

[pastry]

Has anyone come up with the sand grain size needed for, keeping the mess on the top of the sand, and, for vacuuming without pulling out sand and destroying my pipes?

Kris, not sure of the grain size I have but I used to live near Va Beach and surf there & the outter banks often... "THAT" size grain. My current sand is similar (if not exact) size to that from a beach where I am now.

[krislewis3]

GREAT!!!! MY DAUGHTER LIVES IN VA BEACH!!!!! IS THERE SALT IN IT? IF SO, HOW DO YOU REMOVE IT?

[GrayLadyPat]

I have a sandy "area" in my planted tank, but mostly gravel. I looked at all the options for sand, and I finally settled on play sand, the kind you can buy from Home Depot or Lowes. It's pretty uniform, and no larger pebbles. I rinse it until the dust is gone, then boil the rest in a good rolling boil for at least 15 minutes, then drain it and put it in a bucket with Prime and tap water, stirring for 15-20 minutes. Drain again, and it's ready...

It seems to be heavier than pool sand, it's lighter than some beach sand (in color) and the poop from all my fish sits on top. When I vacuum, I use a plain old 2" diameter that reduces to garden hose size. The larger mouth pickes up the sand, but it's heavy enough that very little of it goes down the drain, so to speak. It tends to fall down the side of the siphon and re-deposit more or less in the place I picked it up... No more poop, even cory poop. :D Not only that, by stirring up the sand, it makes absolutely sure than no air pockets have developed so it keeps the more harmful anaerobic bacteria at bay.

I have been using this method for years on my tank, and it works wonders.

[pastry]

I just did the same thing with the sand that I did with driftwood... 1 part bleach/9 parts water just to clean it. Did that twice and then just did 100% water for a rinse. I then put my sand & wood in my 150 and filled that sucker up with water. Got the filtration going for several weeks, seeded with some filter media from established tank, put my initial plants in it (no Co2, root tabs, or fertilizers), and then put a few cories in to see if anything killed them after a few days. Then I added som tetras to see if anything would kill them. No fish killed from water and so I plopped the discus in and that's that. The sand from down here doesn't do anything crazy to my water and I would be surprised if the Va Beach sand does anything different. I'm sure someone is bound to be cringing at what I did but hey, it worked for me.

[krislewis3]

I'll try your method.....first in my community tank...then if that works with no issues, I'll try it with my discus!! Thanks for the tip! ....Kris

[Len]

I use a python to clean my substrate which is pool filter sand and don't have a huge issue. If there are pieces that don't get picked up, I just take the attachment off and hold the end about an inch or so off the bottom and get very little if any sand sucked up. Takes a bit of practice, but once you get the hand of it, it's pretty quick and simple.

[Mr.Al]

http://SubstrateSource.comHi Guys and Girls, Here's a company that carries different sizes and color of sands to be used in the aquarium hopefully this will be of some help to some of you ...Al of Omaha

[SMB2]

I use a python as well or cheaper knock off.
If sand is an issue and you are only using a thin layer why not choose a different substrate? Is it just the aesthetics? There are certainly lots to choose from that are Cory friendly and suitable for Discus. Perhaps a little more expensive but again you are not using a huge amount.

[pastry]

I'll try your method.....first in my community tank...then if that works with no issues, I'll try it with my discus!! Thanks for the tip! ....Kris


Kris, I forgot my disclaimer: If you try out something that I suggested and it didn't turn out so good... well... my bad :p You'll be fine though. Just don't let the "itch" persuade you to take a risk and just put it in with the discus and by-pass the community tank. Also, quick question: is the tank already set up? Sound like it. Are you just going to pour it in?

[krislewis3]

I use a python as well or cheaper knock off.
If sand is an issue and you are only using a thin layer why not choose a different substrate? Is it just the aesthetics? There are certainly lots to choose from that are Cory friendly and suitable for Discus. Perhaps a little more expensive but again you are not using a huge amount.


Like what? I know I don't like gravel.......what else is out there?

[krislewis3]

Kris, I forgot my disclaimer: If you try out something that I suggested and it didn't turn out so good... well... my bad :p You'll be fine though. Just don't let the "itch" persuade you to take a risk and just put it in with the discus and by-pass the community tank. Also, quick question: is the tank already set up? Sound like it. Are you just going to pour it in?

Yes, both tanks have been set up for a good while! Question......does the beach sand pack? If so, is that a good thing?

[pastry]

Kris, I think I know what you mean by "pack" and yes, it doesn. I didn't mention that when you do the whole bleach thing then you may want to break it up into shallow pans. I originally did a huge trash can which was dumb because you can't stir the sand yet the sand in the middle and bottom aren't even really touched by the water & bleach.

[decoy50]

Sorry if I missed it, but why are you going to all the trouble of getting sand from the beach & bleaching it when you can buy pool filter sand at Home Depot? $7 will get you a 50lb bag, rinse it once and its ready. No need to worry about possible contaminants.

I live 5 minutes from the beach & all my sand comes from Home Depot lol.

[pastry]

decoy, personally, I just liked the sand from the beach. i'm by the beach too and, well, it was much less than $7 per 50 lbs for me :p

either way, the cost difference isn't that much so either way I personally think is fine. I only go nuts when I see people pay an arm and a leg for driftwood when they can certainly get that for free... not only that, but nearly pick out the piece they want. I might get attacked on that one due to different wood doing different things to water and I'm not expert on it but good grief, seeing several stores and sources pricing a tiny piece of wood for crap loads of dollars in price motivated me enough to risk it (of course the risk was done prior to discus in tank)

[a volar]

Pool filter sand it’s what I use, and I clean it with a python like tube