PH bottomg out Need Advise!!! (help)

[Spencer]

I need some advise on whats going on with my tank.
My ph out of my faucet is 7.6, once aged its about 7.2
My discus have been "not right" for the past week or so,
darting about.. I could tell there was some stress going on.
After one of my fish darted and rammed the lid last night,
he actually knocked himself out, but eventually started swimming again.
I do 25% to 50% water changes daily. Its a 55 gallon tank with 5 discus
ranging from about 4" to 5". Barebottom tank.
I tested the ph last night after the fish about killing himself.
The ph in my tank is 6.2
What causes the ph to drop that drastically?
I need to figure this out pretty soon, I dont want to lose any fish.

Thanks for any advise.

[Popeye_ali]

Have you got good aeration within the tank?

[fredyx]

Have you measured the KH? you need a KH over 2 to have a minimum of stability in terms of ph.-

[Chicago Discus]

How long has the tank been running?

[chaoslite]

Ditto on all those questions and how long are you taking to age your water? I know of a few people that have to go 48 hours before the water is aged properly.

Mishka

[Spencer]

Josie the tank has been running for about 2 years... only barebottom since Oct.
There is plenty of aeration in the tank..... I dont know the KH. I would have to go get a test kit for that.
The water maintains the same ph even after 24 hours.
I have never had ph to drop like this.... Since Oct when I got the first discus the water has maintained
7.2 to 7.4 in my tank with the fish until now..... i have got to figure out whats going on.

[Chicago Discus]

Josie the tank has been running for about 2 years... only barebottom since Oct.
There is plenty of aeration in the tank..... I dont know the KH. I would have to go get a test kit for that.
The water maintains the same ph even after 24 hours.
I have never had ph to drop like this.... Since Oct when I got the first discus the water has maintained
7.2 to 7.4 in my tank with the fish until now..... i have got to figure out whats going on.

What kind of filter ?

[sammy]

As i'm writing this I know people are gonna yell at me BUT how big is the tank???? We use crushed coral around here to raise the PH - its a very common practice around here - everybody I know locally uses it - it does not harm the fish and when mixed right locks the ph. By the way...what's wrong with 6.2 ???? your plants won't like it but your discus will love it...maybe even make some babies!!!!

[sammy]

AND...if you are aging your water you will have a lower ph then put of your faucet

[sammy]

lastly- do be doing 50% wc with ph over 7 into a 6.2 tank. You WILL shock them

[sammy]

DON"T DON"T - not do be----TYPO

[Chicago Discus]

I would check the filter to see if it is dirty that can cause PH changes, also make sure to take any wood or plants in the tank. This is going to sound weird but try changing less water until it stabilizes.......Josie

[Spencer]

I use 2 Marineland Emperor 400's. I clean the filters weekly. I take them off my tank and rinse.
I use tank water to rinse out the pads and extra sponges I have in there. I have pre filter sponges
on the intakes that I take off and rinse daily.
I dont have any driftwood in my tank. I do have 3 potted amazon swords which have been in there past 4 months.
Sammy... 6.2 is fine for discus...the problem is my ph is not 6.2 out of the faucet or after being aged.... my issue
here is why is it dropping after its in the tank.

[Chicago Discus]

Ok just relax, it's not dropping that bad don't do anything drastic like putting PH up or down or crushed coral take the swords out and do a normal water change check the PH after you do the water change then check it after three hours, six hours then 12 recording the findings. After 48 hours check the PH again. It's normal for the PH of the tank to slowly start coming down. If the change is drastic after two days it tells me you need to age your water longer. You can also get a small water pump and put it on the bottom of the aging barrel as to agitate he water a little more. Hope this helps.......Josie

[cjr8420]

Have you measured the KH? you need a KH over 2 to have a minimum of stability in terms of ph.-
+1 check this ur ph should not lower after ageing only rise

I use 2 Marineland Emperor 400's. I clean the filters weekly. I take them off my tank and rinse.
I use tank water to rinse out the pads and extra sponges I have in there. I have pre filter sponges
on the intakes that I take off and rinse daily.
I dont have any driftwood in my tank. I do have 3 potted amazon swords which have been in there past 4 months.
Sammy... 6.2 is fine for discus...the problem is my ph is not 6.2 out of the faucet or after being aged.... my issue
here is why is it dropping after its in the tank.

how often do u clean out those potted swords that is the only other thing i can see that would cause this is a ton of nasties in or arounds the plants and pots hth

[GrayLadyPat]

My pH crashed one day... Yes, I said in one day...

Turns out I had a dead platy under some decorations I had in the tank and didn't know about... It didn't even dawn on me that it could be the problem. Evidently it had been there for a few days. Thankfully, this was long before discus.

Do a thorough search to make sure you dont have something dead, a clutch of bad eggs, or some other biological issue like that. Even dead/dying plant leaves will lower the pH a bit. As someone else said, 6.2 is not bad. If it drops a bit more, look into some heckels ;-)

Good luck to you!

[Spencer]

I got a test kit to measure the KH.... its showing less than 2.
I am still stumped as to what is going on with my water.
The ph holds at 7.2 after being aged about 48 hours.... But once in the tank it drops.
The discus that darted yesterday did it again while ago... had what appeared to be a seizure and died.
I have got to figure out whats causing the ph to crash.... I rinsed the filters and removed the plants
last night..... The fish are showing signs of stress..... Anything else I can try? I dont want to lose the other 4 discus.

[cjr8420]

I got a test kit to measure the KH.... its showing less than 2.
I am still stumped as to what is going on with my water.
The ph holds at 7.2 after being aged about 48 hours.... But once in the tank it drops.
The discus that darted yesterday did it again while ago... had what appeared to be a seizure and died.
I have got to figure out whats causing the ph to crash.... I rinsed the filters and removed the plants
last night..... The fish are showing signs of stress..... Anything else I can try? I dont want to lose the other 4 discus.


As i'm writing this I know people are gonna yell at me BUT how big is the tank???? We use crushed coral around here to raise the PH - its a very common practice around here - everybody I know locally uses it - it does not harm the fish and when mixed right locks the ph. By the way...what's wrong with 6.2 ???? your plants won't like it but your discus will love it...maybe even make some babies!!!!

get some crushed coral

[Poco]

You pH is crashing due to low KH. If you can get it over 2 at least your pH will be more stable.

[yogi]

Take a look at these links for some basic understanding.

http://faq.thekrib.com/Annex/oldfaq-hardness.txt

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/water_chemistry.php

[Elliots]

Did you recently check the pH of the new water you are putting in your ageing tank? It is possible that the pH of the water coming out of your faucet might have changed.

[Spencer]

Thanks for the links... I have been trying to learn what exactly KH etc are. I am no chemist lol.
So how much crushed coral do I need to use for a 55 gallon?
My Ph runs about the same out of the faucet and once aged.
I tested the KH its 2 out of the faucet.... so the KH along with the ph also drops once in my tank.
I tested the aged water and it has a KH of 2 and ph of 7.4
I just dont understand why the KH and PH drops once it leaves my aging barrel and is in the tank a few hours.

[Cullymoto]

I cant answer what is going on in your tank, but I can explain why kh drops, causing ph to fluctuate. Kh is consumed by live plants, also by nitrifying bacteria. the more live plants you have, the more square inches you have for bacteria to grow on the plants. Both of these will use up KH faster. Low kh = ph fluctuations.
I use 100% r/o ( kh = 0 ) so I have to boost the kh value with every water change, its about the only thing I have to watch with r/o water.

[yogi]

Thanks for the links... I have been trying to learn what exactly KH etc are. I am no chemist lol.
So how much crushed coral do I need to use for a 55 gallon?
My Ph runs about the same out of the faucet and once aged.
I tested the KH its 2 out of the faucet.... so the KH along with the ph also drops once in my tank.
I tested the aged water and it has a KH of 2 and ph of 7.4
I just dont understand why the KH and PH drops once it leaves my aging barrel and is in the tank a few hours.

The reason it drops in your tank in a few hours is your not doing a 100 percent water change. So your tank is not reaching the level of your water storage container it's already lower to start.

When using crushed coral it will be different for each persons tank and starting water. So you will have to experiment to see what works for you. For a 55 gallon I would try either one or two tablespoons of crushed coral. Give it 24 to 48 hours and then see if you need to add more or remove some. It also wears out over time which is also different for each set up, so it could be one month or it could be three months, you will have to wait and see. Put the crushed coral in a small nylon bag or use a piece of ladies stockings to put it in. Rinse slightly before putting it in your filter.

Now getting to the ph falling to 6.2 to begin with. I don't think this caused the problem with you fish to begin with, 6.2 is an acceptable ph to have. So something else might of caused the problem with the fish. I keep mostly wild discus and my ph has already dropped into the fours without any problems. The wilds don't seem to mind, but some of the domestics will become lethargic at this low ph.

[discuspaul]

This is quite likely a stretch - but have you tested your water for the presence of ammonia ?
Your discus' behavior may be a reaction to ammonia toxicity, even quite low toxicity. While significantly low pH, even down to 5.0 or as low as 4.0, is generally no cause for concern, resulting in the presence/formation of usually non-toxic ammonium - there have been cases of very low pH completely negating the effectiveness of beneficial bacteria which had gone into a dormancy stage. In addition to that, for example, if chloramines were being used in your water supply, there could have been some form of chemical reaction where some ammonia has split from the chlorine, producing a toxic situation.

I have traditionally had a low pH of around 5.0 in my tank, and a similar situation of discus behavior occured with me a few months ago. I lost 4 fish before testing for, and discovering the presence of ammonia in the tank. I took immediate steps to buffer the water, moving up the pH somewhat, did frequent large wcs using Prime, and assisted the build-up of bio-media with a SafeStart product - the erratic discus behavior ceased more or less overnite, and everything returned to normal very quickly.

[GrayLadyPat]

re: crushed coral...

in my 60 gallon tank, I used about a quarter to half cup (2-4oz.) in a nylon stocking. I doubled the stocking by putting one foot into the other and making a baggie. I just threw it in behind a bunch of plants to hide it, but it was still accessible to be able to pull out when my pH stabilized. It is not a fast process. It won't change your pH over night, but in a few days, you should see some improvement.

Make sure you test your pH often, because once it has remained in the desired area for a few days, you need to take the coral out. If it crashes again once you remove the coral, then there is another issue that the coral won't help.

Sorry for your loss....good luck to you