View Full Version : Hi!
Hello SD folks. I'm new here.
I'm setting myself up for discus, reading and preparing. I currently have a 200 l tank with five angels, one ancistrus, a few neon tetras and four Kuhli Loach (that's a 52.8 us gal, or 44 uk gal. Although any number does, since gallons are pretty ambiguous. I think I prefer uk wine gallons, if I where to choose, then it'd be a 54.5 gal. Silly imperial units... :p). I also have 99 gal (that would be "us") stashed away dry. Should come in handy. I'm still deciding on size for a discus tank. I do not think I'll be using the two I have for discus.
How likely is it for discus to pair, breed and raise a few offspring in a discus community tank? i.e. not a community tank, but a tank with ~12 discus and and a few other compatible fish. Provided that all conditions are kept perfect, water parameters, feeding etc.? I'm not interested in breeding, I just thought it would be neat to have it happen, as it would change the scenery.
How likely is it for discus to pair, breed and raise a few offspring in a discus community tank? i.e. not a community tank, but a tank with ~12 discus and and a few other compatible fish. Provided that all conditions are kept perfect, water parameters, feeding etc.?
I'm not interested in breeding, I just thought it would be neat to have it happen, as it would change the scenery.
none
ps.. welcome to SD :) :)
troysdiiscus
03-05-2013, 10:17 AM
Welcome otpi, good to have you with us. I myself are kinda new to discus, raised many cichlid tanks, heavy planted tanks, now discus, IMO are the top dog of fish world. There are alot of good reading here at the" discus for beginners" section. Alot of thinking and prep work to go into selecting discus, the size, grow out tanks, feeding water changes, water changes and did I mention water changes. Alot of work to put in but end results well worth it. Discus will breed in that enviroment based your water parimeters will depend on if successful or not. Nature does its thing regardless. I have seen discus breed in ph up to 7.6 and higher. When they breed changes of them making it in that tank is slim, without taking them out and pairing them in there own tank, but like you said if your not interested then nature does its own thing.
troysdiiscus
03-05-2013, 10:21 AM
skip, congrats on your marriage, honeymoon over yet??? lol didnt take long for people to jump on buying up your selection, by the time I saw it, too late... oh well...
none
ps.. welcome to SD :) :)
otpi..
the problem is the other fish.. AND the feedings that would be required..
1. even as a pair.. they would have a hard time.. fighting off other fish from eating the eggs..
2.. eggs may or may not hatch in your water.
3. even if hatch.. wigglers or free swimming.. they are at parents sides. once again.. easy snake for other fish.
4. they require lots of feedings.. and water quality can be issue .. esp if you have planted/substrate
Elliots
03-05-2013, 10:27 AM
If you start with and end up with 12 Discus they should pair and breed. I very slightly disagree with Skip (Warlock). He says the chances of them raising young are zero, I would say almost zero. I have a 150gal planted community tank with 11 5-6" Discus. I get eggs often and they hatch. That is as far as my fish have gotten. I am not trying to breed them or raise the young. I do nothing to help the fry survive. I let nature take its course. I have read that it is possible for fry to survive in a planted community tank but I would put the chances at near zero. If you want to breed Discus be ready with more than two tanks I think.
GrayLadyPat
03-05-2013, 10:39 AM
...five angels, one ancistrus, a few neon tetras and four Kuhli Loach ...
Not sure how the Kuli will deal with the higher temps required by discus, but neons do well...for a while...then they begin to die off, one by one, because they can't tolerate the heat.
Angels and Discus do not meld well, as angels can be aggressive, and the water parameters need to be slightly different for discus. Some people have said they do well together, but eventually, I believe you will have problems.
I have 4 small ancistrus in my tank... so far they haven't decided to lunch on the discus slime, but they may as they get larger.
Other than that, breeding for fun and profit is a large undertaking. Having discus breed on their own is fun to watch. It does happen once in a while (usually when you're least expecting it) and seeing how they care for the ill-fated young is mesmerizing. Unfortunately, more likely than not, the young will become fish food for the rest, and those that do survive won't be very good specimens.
I am doing everything I can to keep the discus I have, not breed them. If they should happen to breed one day, it will be a case of "Oh, wow..." but I will not try to raise the fry.
Good luck to you, and welcome to SD!
I'm not planning on mixing my current setup with the discus. Discus tank will be a tank of it's own.
From what I have read, angels can mix with discus, but treat the for tape worms and flukes beforehand Stendker: Stocking rate & other fish (http://www.diskuszucht-stendker.de/gb/582,0,stocking-rate-other-fish,index,0.html). But I'm not really thinking of mixing those anyway.
With the requirement for low nitrate I don't think I need ancistrus for algae anyway. My theory regarding slime eating bristle noses is that they are starved. Mine is happy scraping the glass and drift wood. In the last 10 months I cleaned the glass once using a MagFloat, and that was just to get of rid of tiny, barely visible, green spots.
I think I'll manage water parameters just fine. I'm not getting discus without an auto-valve and overflow to do the water changes (I'm lazy that way). My tap water is ph 7, and zero anything else (that includes zero Cl). There is so little minerals in tap here that we never de-calsify our dishwashers, water hardness is basically zero.
I kept a community tank in the 99 gal for about 8 years before shutting down the thing in 2000. In all that time I never measured more than ph 7+-0.2.
@elliots: That's what I'd like to see. If I get free swimmers I will see it as entertainment for the day. And not worry about their survival (cruel?). :D
Orange Crush
03-05-2013, 02:53 PM
How likely is it for discus to pair, breed and raise a few offspring in a discus community tank? i.e. not a community tank, but a tank with ~12 discus and and a few other compatible fish.
Welcome!
That is by definition a community tank, lol. I have a pair in my community tank that lay eggs once a week like clockwork. They have successfully raised fry when they were in their own tank but in this tank the fry get eaten within 12 hours of becoming freeswimmers 100% of the time. So yes, you might get pairs, and yes they might be able to get them to the freeswimming stage but IMO they will never make it past a few days of freeswimming with other fish around. If you want to breed discus buy a confirmed pair and keep them in their own tank.
Spoken like a purist. I did not expect any less from SD :P
I see your point, but: Does a tank of 12 discus and one Ancistrus become a community tank? :confused:
otpi.. if you have Other discus besides a breeding pair.. its a community tank.. if you have one pair in a tank.. its a breeding tank..
other discus will try to eat the eats.. tetras will eat the eggs.. snails will eat the eggs..
pastry
03-06-2013, 02:08 PM
otpi, they're pretty much right but I've been lucky enough to have a very protective pair keep some fry alive in a community for about a month or so before I killed when switching the filtration system. i wasn't trying to do anything and it just happened in a tank with other discus, other fish, tons of plants, wood, substrate, etc. I have a crappy video of it on an old thread if interested. a lot of people on here will jump on you if you don't clarify that you have no intentions to raise them or sell them so if by chance it does happen then have a disclaimer ready. can't blame them for not wanting discus that may be poor quality to exchange hands.
if you get WIGGLERS then Awesome!!
when and if you are ready to breed.. you are set!!
if you get WIGGLERS then Awesome!!
when and if you are ready to breed.. you are set!!
otpi, they're pretty much right but I've been lucky enough to have a very protective pair keep some fry alive in a community for about a month or so before I killed when switching the filtration system. i wasn't trying to do anything and it just happened in a tank with other discus, other fish, tons of plants, wood, substrate, etc. I have a crappy video of it on an old thread if interested. a lot of people on here will jump on you if you don't clarify that you have no intentions to raise them or sell them so if by chance it does happen then have a disclaimer ready. can't blame them for not wanting discus that may be poor quality to exchange hands.
If that's the case I will clarify: I will not raise substandard discus with the intention of selling and/or trading for supplies at the lfs. Should I get lucky and get a breeding pair of good quality, and I find the time and will, I may move the pair to a breeder and try to raise a few. Clear? ;)
My current plan is to get a 6-800 l display tank. If there is space I will add a sump. Use a thin sand substrate (I don't like the look of bare bottom). Add a few rocks and drift wood planted with java fern. I've had great success in my current setup planning water flow and substrate elevations such that crap collects at a few designated places for easy cleaning. :D
pastry
03-07-2013, 10:56 AM
6-800 l tank? Not sure what that is. I like you're "crap collection" plan... that's awesome! Never thought about that and may fiddle around with it. Well keep us posted!
6-800 l tank? Not sure what that is.
600 to 800 LITER Tank
BODYDUB
03-07-2013, 02:04 PM
6-800 l tank? Not sure what that is. I like you're "crap collection" plan... that's awesome! Never thought about that and may fiddle around with it. Well keep us posted!
It's because the OP is from the UK and they use the metric system.....................
pastry
03-07-2013, 02:43 PM
thanks skip.
It's because the OP is from the UK and they use the metric system.....................
That's news to me. Although I've heard the brits are slowly converting to the metric system "inch-by-inch". :p
GrayLadyPat
03-08-2013, 09:26 AM
.../snip
I like you're "crap collection" plan... that's awesome! Never thought about that and may fiddle around with it. Well keep us posted!
The directionality of my spraybars cause currents in my tank as well. The water to eddies and piles up the debris in one spot... makes it really easy to pick it up. I still vacuum the rest of it, but the majority piles up in one place... unfortunately, it's front and center, where everyone can see it...lol
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