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View Full Version : What did I do wrong, what should I have done? What do I need to do now?



Atomicmiss
05-29-2013, 11:35 PM
What went wrong?

I cycled!!
I fully cycled my 55 gallon bow front. I treated the water with the instant cycle crap that came with the tank and Seachem Prime. I used a programmable thermostat (fluval 250 watt) and set it for 84 degrees. My filter is an HOB Fluval C4 with 5 stages of filtration. I removed the carbon and replaced it with foam after it cycled.
I bought fish to help cycle the tank that I have since given to a friend except for the following: 3 dwarf gouramis, 2 albino corys, 5 harlequin rasboras, and 7 danios.
Before adding my discus I removed the rasboras and the danios and I added a killifish. All was peaceful and fine!

My first Discus
I did a lot of reading online and I knew I was in for the unimaginable when I fell in love with discus. Then off to the pet store I went.

I went to a reputable store and talked about my community tank and compatibility and was assured a discus would be fine. I was also assured that one discus would be fine in a community tank so I bought a pigeon blood. That was my first mistake, I should have bought at least 2, eventually upping it to 3 or 5.

I used the dripping method after allowing the bag to adjust to the temp of the tank and added him. Right away he started hiding in the corner nose down. I figured it was just stress so I turned off the light for 24 hrs and peeked at them often. From the time I got him he did this all while swimming along the back of the aquarium at the bottom. He was a good eater but he was always hiding somewhere.

My second discus
SO I thought he needed a friend to cheer him up. I went back to the store (just 10 days ago) and purchased a beautiful golden albino. They were from the same tank so I used the same method to introduce my new discus to the tank. They were instant buddy's. they sat head to tail sometimes and shimmied their fins, but my pigeon blood was still shy. He started floating sideways more and stopped eating. I called the pet store and they exchanged the fish as an exception (I only had him 6 days).
The new guy is excellent! No issues whatsoever and I hope it stays that way and my albino and him schooled together
Then about 5 days ago I saw my albino was floating sideways in the tank but it only lasted a few seconds and off he would go. The next day tho he would do it minutes at a time. There was nothing outwardly wrong with him but he did stop eating. I checked my water and my tank had uncycled. I did a 75% wc because my ammonia was at 3 or 4 and treated the water with my usual discus buffer, aquarium salt and prime.

My albino seemed to be a little more active and normal that night but it was short lived.

The next day I check my water again, ammonia is still high so I do another water change and add an ammonia remover/carbon filter in hopes it will help and also did 5x prime. It didn't. So I start setting up my qt tank (which of course would leak right)? Long story short I was able to set one up anyway.

After moving my albino to the qt tank I did a 90%water change, treated my water with normal doses of prime and stability. Although my HOB filter was adding oxygen to the water I added a sponge filter as well. The tank has been fine ever since and I can't believe how clean the water is.
My second mistake? Using a discus buffer.

The QT tank
Once my albino went into the quarantine tank not much improved and I noticed under the night light there was cotton ball fungus coming out of the bottom of his gill. He still wasn't eating and so I called another discus store. They confirmed it was fungus and he possibly had an internal parasite. I added the proper amount of Tetra Fungus Guard to my tank. He wasn't laying on his side anymore though but he was headstanding at the top of the tank (this was before I added the Tetra too). He finally pooped and it was white, almost like rice only finer. I went to the pet store to get something to help with internal parasites and when I got home he was dead. I'm devastated, he's albino so it was impossible to see the fungus in the big tank but I feel like if I could have qt'd him sooner I could have saved him.

Water changes:
I did a 30 to 50% change every second day and about a 60 to 75% every week.

Food: freeze dried and frozen mysis shrimp and bloodworms, flakes and pellets. I pre soaked the freeze dried and the pellets before feeding them but they really only stuck to flakes. I fed them 4 to 5 times a day as they are young adults.

Now I don't know where to go from here, I have one lone discus and I'm scared to get more but I don't want him stressed. I'm hoping this post will help the beginners and encourage the more experienced discus owners to help me understand where I went wrong and what I could have done differently. Did I just get a sick fish? All of my other fish are fine...

Second Hand Pat
05-29-2013, 11:57 PM
I would suggest you did not read enough. Not meaning to be harsh here but you asked. You should have started with a fishless cycle using pure ammonia for the full six weeks, bought a group of six discus from a reputable source and had a firm understanding of your water parameters.

Atomicmiss
05-30-2013, 12:05 AM
So if I do that will everything be perfect?? I relied heavily on what I thought were knowledgeable experts and was upping my discus to 5 within a month. I knew my parameters but I don't understand how they crashed. I just lost my pet and I'm quite upset about it.

Second Hand Pat
05-30-2013, 12:18 AM
I am really sorry about that and can not say if all will be perfect if you "did it by the book". There is a good learning curve with these fish and a good bit of work.

Atomicmiss
05-30-2013, 12:29 AM
Thank you for that and I realize that more so now than I did before I owned them. I am learning very quickly but there are less common things I overlooked as I was learning the main stuff. I'm worried about my lone discus now and if he will be okay without his buddy. Until I learn more and find a REAL reputable breeder I won't be adding any new fish but I don't want to wait too long and I need to learn how to introduce them if I buy more than 1 (which I will do this time when I'm ready)

dkeef
05-30-2013, 12:30 AM
Having set up a new discus tank i relied heavily on ppl here. I almost went to my old way of doing things. But stuck to their advice and within one week of trying my very first new discus. They are spawning already, eating like pigs.
One of the hardest thing i had to fix on my ways were sticking to qt all tankmates and buying from reputable sources only.
I used to buy at any decent local stores and as long as fish looked ok i would mix them in tank with others without qt.
With discus u shouldnt do that.
I think two things could be the main reason. Ur discus wasnt healthy or clean from the start or your other fish u had in the tank have transmitted disease to discus.
Experts here will tell u to start all over again. Bleaching everything u have in the tank including all the equipments. Throw away other fish. Then start fishless cycle again and start discus only first but buy from sponsors here and start with as many as u can get.

Atomicmiss
05-30-2013, 12:42 AM
Wouldn't the other fish be sick as well? I know I should have qt'd them but I was thinking it was because of the other fish, I don't know why I didn't even consider the tank! Another reason I just added them was because they were in the same tank at the store. Could it have had something that couldn't be spread like a parasite? I scrubbed everything down when I did the 90% change but I already know from what you're telling me that doesn't work. If that's what I have to do ill have a long time to master discus before I get new ones :( if none of the other fish are sick would it be more probable I just got a sick fish? I'm like the crazy fish lady and I'm always hoping for an easier answer :( I'm glad this will help people getting into discus at the very least.

Congrats on your discus!! That's amazing!!

blueluv
05-30-2013, 01:04 AM
Hey atomicmiss

Sorry to hear about your loss. So what have we learned from this? Here are the basics ; clean water, proper nutrion, tank hygiene and always buy from a reputable breeder or importer here on simply discus. Also never, never use discus buffer again...if you still have it throw it in the garbage or get a refund. With discus you have to first know what your goals are with them before getting into discus. If you want to go the planted and community tank route, then really do your research on planted and community tanks, that type of set up (imo) is an ecosystem in a small space...if one parameter is of that could lead to other problems. If you want to start bare bottom, them all you need to is.. clean water , proper nutrion and tank hygiene. Discus like stability, so you don't have mess with the ph...unless you want to breed them. When adding new additions to your tank..always qt them before adding to your tank. I hope that I didn't leave anything out and sorry if I rambled here. One more thing everyone here has lost discus at some point, so don't feel bad. Take this as a learning experience and don't give up on the hobby. This is just my point of view, you don't have to agree with it. :D

Best of luck
Chris

blueluv
05-30-2013, 01:06 AM
Some fish have a stronger immunity system. Some will fall ill to a disease and some won't.

Atomicmiss
05-30-2013, 01:22 AM
Thank you Chris you've been so helpful! I learned I thought I knew more than I did that's for sure... That buffer crap went as soon as you said it should!! I'd really like to do what I have now, fake reef with a little sand and a few other little fish but it was proving very high Maintenence and bare bottom is way too easy. I am going to stay well away from planted tanks for now, a little too hard to handle but I would like to do a show tank.

blueluv
05-30-2013, 01:31 AM
You can do a show tank. .. you have to learn how to balance things out in planted tanks. If a show tank is what you want, then the right size discus for show tanks are adults. Believe it or not even in bare bottom tanks, problems can still happen. The thing with bare bottom of that it's easier to maintain clean. As long as you have the basics down pact, you'll be good to go.

Atomicmiss
05-30-2013, 01:42 AM
Thanks for the vote of confidence!! I'm pretty awesome with my water (for real now) and I bet that whole crash could have been avoided if I hadn't used the buffer, I read adult discus are easier as well so that's even better! Bare bottom with fake coral sounds easy and pretty. The qt tank was a breeze to clean and I fell head over heals for bb lol.

GrayLadyPat
05-30-2013, 07:52 PM
Atomicmiss, one thing that you have to "relearn" is that a show tank doesn't necessarily have to be a planted tank. You can have a tank that is perfect for discus without a single plant in it.

Second, everyone has lost discus. I have lost them. With every loss, we learn. I learned.

What you need to do now, is decide exactly how you want to proceed from here.

There are some wonderful people here who will be more than happy to help you on your way. Then, when you're ready for more, get them from one of the sponsors here. They are truly wonderful.

I wish you the best, and I am terribly sorry for your loss.

Len
05-30-2013, 08:03 PM
+10 to that. It really would be in your best interest to avoid a planted tank if you are just starting out with Discus. Yes, it can be done, but it is a LOT of work and you really need to get the basics of keeping healthy discus down to a science first, and then decide if you really want plants. I do know how disappointing it is to have lost your fish, so I empathize with you, but you can get more fish and with the help and guidance of some great folks here, you can get good quality fish and really get some enjoyment out of keeping them.

Best wishes

Crunchy
05-31-2013, 08:41 PM
I had the same experience starting.

The tank seemed cycled but when I added discus the ntrites went up. Seems like overfeeding 5x a day and bioload is much higher than the smaller fishes.

Also, a canister filter will provide more bio media than a HOB.

discusmat
06-05-2013, 04:50 PM
I agree with Crunchy, You need better filtration. an HOB is ok for a 10 or 20 gal tank.
anything larger you need a canister filter.much more bio media.

Atomicmiss
06-06-2013, 02:22 AM
Well my last discus is still very alive and well and I'm starting to think ill be ready for more discus soon :)
And if it weren't for the help and support I've found here I think I would have given up faster than I started... I've lost all the fish I purchased from that store so I'm down to 3 gouramis 2 albino corys and my buddy. With 2 bio filters in my HOB and my sponge filter ill be okay without a canister until they go on sale. I'm going to stay well away from plants until I'm comfortable with my discus again. This lil guy is great too, I hand fed him for the first time today and he took to it instantly! He's so animated and fun to watch. Thanks again everyone :)

firas2002
06-06-2013, 05:21 AM
I would suggest an HMA or RO system depending on your tds, prime is not effective If you have high levels of toxins in your water prime removes 4mg/l chloramine, 5mg/l chlorine which could be the reason for your filter crashing then high ammonia. prime is good when you have high ammonia to keep your free ammonia down while your tank gets cycled.

j03yYung
06-15-2013, 01:54 AM
atomicmiss - how long was your tank cycled for? By adding those instant cycle chemicals in the tank that doesn't mean the tank was cycled. The bioload changes as you add in more fish.

But yes, you should QT the fish before adding them into the tank.

Atomicmiss
06-17-2013, 05:17 AM
I never really believed the instant stuff was all its cracked up to be so although I did dump it in I let my tank fully cycle, I'm trying to remember how long it took but I want to say it took around 5 weeks... I knocked it off balance with discus buffer but with heavy wc's (sometimes twice a day) my parameters have been excellent and all my fish are thriving :) I've learned my lesson and no matter what I will always qt!! It gets pretty pricey to treat my main tank..