Advices regarding stocking and distribution.

[seashell_midwest]

Hi I am new to discus.
I have 55 gallon, 75 gallon, 40 gallon, 20 gallon and 10 gallon tank.

55 gallon and 75 gallon are cycled and running.

55 gallon has 13 neon tetra, 5 albino brittlenose, and 30 cherry red shrimp.

Planning to get 50 cardinal tetra, 24 glo light tetra, 6 mixed veil angel fish and 10 discus (2.5 to 3 inchs).

Would like to make 55 gallon a planted aquarium and have 75 gallon as bare bottom to grow the discus. And once the discus grow, will get a 120 gallon show tank.
So how do I distribute my fishes. Any suggestions.

I thought I will have 20 gallon settup as a shrimp only tank with a sponge filter and aquaclear 55 hob, with gravel and plants in it.

55 gallon will have 13 neon tetras, 25 cardinal tetra and 12 glow tetra and 6 mixed veil angelfish ( wondering if i am overstocking the tank, getting the angle fish from freshwatertropicalfishonline.com) and 2 brittle nose. filter eheim 2217, spong filter #4, moving bed filter with K1 media.

75 gallon will have 10 discus, 25 cardinal, 12 glow and 3 brittle nose. My main question is by having the cardinal/glow/brittlenose in will i compromise the growth of my discus?? and this will be a barebottom tank. will do 60% water change 2-3 times a week. with a aged water. thanks in advance for the advice.
filter sunsun 304-B, spong filter #5, moving bed filter with K1 media.

[azmtns]

Eventually, the angelfish will eat the tetra's. The discus will most likely also eat the tetra's. You might get away with tetra's and angelfish for awhile, but not such small tetra's. I keep emperor tetra's and a few different larger barbs with angelfish (both full adult) and they are ok. I speak from personal experience that the neon's and cardinals will be lunch for adult angelfish.

[Frankr409]

I would not keep Angel Fish with Discus so lets get that out there straight up. Angels are too agressive even for their own kind at times.

[Madaboutdiscus]

Discus that small id keep them alone til grown with daily water changes.

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[seashell_midwest]

I Dont plan to have discus and angel together. I Dont mind angel/discus eating the tetras after they become adults. So if I buy 3inch discus if I do 3 weekly water change vs daily water change how different will the size be.

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[seashell_midwest]

How many months of daily water change? I will get my discus from discus Hans .

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[Rudustin]

I have 12 adult discus in a 120 gallon. I have about fifteen cardinal tetras and the Discus don't seem to notice them at all. I agree angels and any smaller, busy fish will be eaton. I have a sixty-five gallon with four sub adult White Butterflies and six juvenile silver pigeons. I am relocating the four WB because I feel that they are slowing down the growth of my SP's because they are bigger and stronger. So, I would suggest that small, and 3 inch discus are small, discus need to eat often and without bullies of any kind in their tank or other fish that may slow down their growth potential until they are at least sub adults. I'm new in the hobby as well so don't take my word as the bible. I'm sure there are many more experienced keepers of discus that could advise you better than me but I just felt like giving my opinion. Take care and good luck.

[Madaboutdiscus]

How many months of daily water change? I will get my discus from discus Hans .

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Most say daily wc until theyre adults or close to it. Not sure how the growth difference would be but daily wcs help them reach their full potential whereas with rare changes you may get a 5 inch discus or so but with wcs you could get 6-7 inches. I know mine expereinced a huge growth spurt when I started doing daily changes and theyre healthier and happier too. Your water bill may suffer but itll be worth it.

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[seashell_midwest]

What percentage water change do you recommend.
I have collected
Tetra color bits
Freeze dried black worm
Sera discus pellets
Cobalt discus flakes
Planning to use two feeders to have at least 5 feeding per day.
I cannot do frozen beef heart secondary to religious reason.

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[seashell_midwest]

One more thing my pH when I use api kit
Regular pH test shows 7.6 when I use high pH then 7.4. TDs 400. My pH in the tank never changes. Why is that is it because of the high TDs???
My water from tap has a pH of 8.2 when I age and prime it becomes 7.6/7.4 and stays there. Why is the water becoming more acidic with aging???
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[White Worm]

75 gallon will have 10 discus, 25 cardinal, 12 glow and 3 brittle nose. My main question is by having the cardinal/glow/brittlenose in will i compromise the growth of my discus?? and this will be a barebottom tank. will do 60% water change 2-3 times a week. with a aged water. thanks in advance for the advice.
filter sunsun 304-B, spong filter #5, moving bed filter with K1 media.

10 discus in a 75g @ 3in - Daily 75-100% WC. Glow-light tetras don't do well with higher temps. 25 cards and 4 sterbai for cleanup would be my choice for a discus tank. Sounds like you have a lot of free time with discus, planted tank, shrimp, etc.

[seashell_midwest]

10 discus in a 75g @ 3in - Daily 75-100% WC. Glow-light tetras don't do well with higher temps. 25 cards and 4 sterbai for cleanup would be my choice for a discus tank. Sounds like you have a lot of free time with discus, planted tank, shrimp, etc.

I use a marine land 1100 to do water changes. I am planning to change water in planted tank and shrimp once a week. So what else do you think I need to do. I have not started doing the whole thing it. So I don't know how much time it will take. Maybe it may become too difficult then I will cut down the stock.

[White Worm]

Wiping down tanks, cleaning filters, preparing food, feedings, maintenance and changing water takes some time daily for discus owners (let's hope you don't have to add time for meds and treatments) and then on top of that, plants. I've done both and I had to watch, test and adjust ferts, Co2, trimmings, WC's (different than discus). With a full time job, family and finishing my bachelors degree, time is scarce for me. Now include the time you spend just hanging out watching and enjoying the hobby...:D

[seashell_midwest]

White worm:
I am not going to prepare food, I had mentioned earlier what I plan to use. My planted tanks will not frets, CO2, trimming etc... they are just very rudimentary plant tank... with easy to grow plants.

[White Worm]

Sounds good. Keep it simple. We all start out like that but it seems to always expand as the interest grows. Good luck and enjoy.

[strawberryblonde]

What percentage water change do you recommend.
I have collected
Tetra color bits
Freeze dried black worm
Sera discus pellets
Cobalt discus flakes
Planning to use two feeders to have at least 5 feeding per day.
I cannot do frozen beef heart secondary to religious reason.

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You've chosen good foods for growing out discus. Many use beef heart because it is inexpensive and high protein, but it's not necessary to do that, so you're fine.

6 feedings per day would be just about perfect for 3" discus. Try to feed first thing in the morning, then auto feed flakes and pellets during the day and then more freeze dried black worms for 2 feedings at night. The last feeding is what I call a "bedtime snack". Put the cube into the tank about an hour before you turn off the tank light and they will chase down the worms even after the lights go out. That provides optimal growth for them since their bellies are full later at night.

For the tank itself: Try to keep it very simple while you are growing them out. Just paint the bottom of the tank with white paint so that they can't see their reflections. Then add your filters, heater and air stone. No sand, gravel or plants. You can add a nice piece of driftwood for a little decor though.

And for water changes, you should plan to do a large daily water change until they are about 6". If you buy 3" discus from Hans and feed 6 times a day plus the daily water change, they will reach 6" in about 3-4 months.

At that point you can add some sand, a couple of plants and some cories to clean the sand. You can also add the cardinal tetras when they reach 6". They will continue to grow until they are about 2 years old, but it will be much slower growth.

[seashell_midwest]

Thanks for all the excellent input. So I am going to have all my other fishes in the 75 gallon tank. Put the discus in the 55 gallon tank and do 75% water change every day. In a month there maybe 5 days when I cannot do water change. I will be travelling for my work. I will keep you guys informed. If this regimen does not give me good discus then I will have to buy adults... or get the discus when I will be home everyday for 3 months period. And I should thank every one of you for the supportive and help... I appreciated it very much. Any further thoughts are always welcome.

white worm: if i open the link of yours it takes me here : http://www.bidka.org/guide1.shtml this is what I used to buy the discus companions.

[strawberryblonde]

It's fine to miss a daily water change now and then. So long as it doesn't happen too often the juvenile discus will be fine. Just be sure to not feed them too much when you expect to be gone the next day so that they don't make too much of a mess in the tank and foul the water.

[seashell_midwest]

It's fine to miss a daily water change now and then. So long as it doesn't happen too often the juvenile discus will be fine. Just be sure to not feed them too much when you expect to be gone the next day so that they don't make too much of a mess in the tank and foul the water.

It will actually be 5 days in a row. I am scared, but I am still going to try it. I have know how important it's for juveniles for getting contious feed etc... But I cannot avoid these travels. I am working on standby procedures for possible water changes and feeding. But they may not be available. I am going try... I cannot control my self from getting the discus.

[seashell_midwest]

one of my albino brittlenose developed a bloated belly. by the time i picked the disease, it was having small hemorraghe in the flanks. I put it in a 10 gallon tank with 1 tsp of Epsom salt. It died in a 3hrs. I am sad. Other fishes are fine. Do you guys think I should wait on my purchase of discus for gaining some more experience?
Thanks

[strawberryblonde]

If you purchased all your new fish from a LFS, then you can expect a couple of losses, it happens and isn't necessarily an indicator of poor fish keeping on your part.

If you feel overwhelmed with just getting to know your new fish and how to best care for them, then it might be best to wait a month or so till you feel more comfortable with them before buying the discus. It will also give you time to sort out any who are sick so that you aren't trying to care for sick ones in your community tanks and also caring for brand new discus.

For the 5 days away from home that you mentioned up above: How about an inexpensive auto feeder so that they get two small flake food meals on those days? It won't foul the water too badly and will keep them from getting too thin. It may not be optimal, but it's doable. =)

Oh! I also wanted to offer up the idea that you purchase the discus so that they arrive at your house immediately after you get home from a 5 day outing. That way you'll have the maximum number of weeks home with them again before you have to go out again. That will mean that they'll have grown quite a bit before heading out that first time and leaving them home alone.

As an example, I received two 3" discus from Hans last month. Even with spotty feedings (they were used to QT my current stock and went from tank to tank which upset their eating schedules) the smaller one grew about 1/2" in four weeks and the larger, more out going one grew 1".

[seashell_midwest]

Strawberryblonde: I have two auto feeders: Plan is to use freeze dried Blackworms in the morning at 7AM before I go to work, 10AM cobalt flakes, 2pm Sera Pellets, 5pm Cobalt flakes, 7pm freeze dried blackworms, water change after the feeding. 10pm freeze dried black worms and go to sleep.

Regarding feeding when away, the question raised multiple time is food vs quality water. and the debate seems to tend towards quality water. Maybe this be towards adult discuses. I don't know. But you suggest I should try 2 small flake/pellet meals, but what about water getting dirty?

I will plan to be at home for around 1.5 months after I get this discus before heading out.

both autometic feeders are eheim.

[strawberryblonde]

Yup, there's going to be a rise in nitrates in the tank over the course of 5 days if you feed lightly twice a day. And mind you that this is only MY personal thoughts on the subject, ok?

The way I see it, a temporary rise in nitrates in a lightly stocked tank of 3" juvies isn't going to have nearly the detrimental effect on them that going without any food at all for 5 days would have. So long as you have sufficient filtration, plenty of aeration and start off with fresh water the night before you leave they should be just fine.

On a side note, I learned a lot about short term nitrates spikes last winter when I had to be away from home for a month at a time. My tanks got one weekly small water change and feedings were reduced to twice per day flake feedings. My husband did those water changes and feedings and tested the water parameters just before the water changes.

Nitrates rose the highest in my well stocked tank and reached about 20ppm over a months time. The discus in that tank were not affected by that level and received a super cleaning over the course of the first three days that I was home again. The first day was a light WC to reduce any pH shock, the second day was over 50% water change and the third day was a nice big 80% WC with full scrubbing of the entire tank. The other two lightly stocked tanks never had nitrates rise above 10ppm during the entire month. But they also got the same three day cleaning when I got home and before I headed out the door again.

So what I'm saying is that from my own experience, even long term absences can be managed successfully. In your case, since the discus will be juvies, it's my opinion that it's better to feed them twice a day and then do your water changes when you get home than to leave them without food. The little guys can get awfully thin in very short order if they don't get fed.

[seashell_midwest]

Strawberry blond: I was trying to figure out why my nitrite level in my tank was higher after water change rather than before water change. My tap water has 0.5ppm of ammonia. So after adding prime I age the water for 5 days by that time the ammonia is converted to nitrite and my nitrate levels after water change becomes 0.5. What do you suggest? I Dont want to do ro at this point of time. Can I be successful with discus?

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