Help! Discus clamped fins and darkening

[Fish mon]

Hi everyone please help!

I have a 55g thats been running for about 5 months now.
It has 6 discus around 5" each, 4 corys, 2 german rams. The last fish added were the rams a month ago.

Water parameters are:
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: ? (I dont have a test kit for it)
PH: 6.8

I have an aquaclear 50, eheim 2217, and a sponge filter running on it. The tank has some fine gravel, a piece of driftwood and some rocks.
I do 40% water change everyday with tap water and discus buffer to set ph to 6.8.


So the problem is both my map and blue diamond discus started becoming lethargic two nights ago. I noticed this when the blue diamond hid behind the driftwood and looked really dark all day and the map stayed in one spot with really clamped fins and suddenly peppered alot. This was last night. I ran to the lfs and put in a dose of API general cure.
Now I just got home and they arent looking good especially the blue diamond who looks like he has spots in his head....



All the other discus and fish are completely fine. I dont have a QT unfortunately

Please help!

[PP_GBR]

When fish is under medication they seem to darken than normal. Just observe the its breathing. If they begin to roll over/loss balance then do emergency water change. Otherwise, you should finish the meds as directed.

[Fish mon]

When fish is under medication they seem to darken than normal. Just observe the its breathing. If they begin to roll over/loss balance then do emergency water change. Otherwise, you should finish the meds as directed.

Thanks for the response. Okay I will dose for the second time tomorrow as the instructions say. Does it count as a loss
of balance/roll over if theyre leaning on their sides against something?

[OC Discus]

Do you have some pictures?

[Fish mon]

Here are pics of them. I couldnt get a clear shot of the blue because hes hiding

http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps56a5ab12.jpg.html
http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps859a1853.jpg.html

[OC Discus]

Most sd experts are saying don't adjust ph in the tank, but maintain a stable level anywhere from 6-8. With a fully cycled tank, nitrate is a potential problem. Test strips say 20 is safe, but discus keepers say 5-10 is the target range. After cycling, ammonia and nitrite don't tend to rise noticeably. It is nitrate that rises and must be kept down by water changes, vacuuming/wiping substrate, wiping down glass and decorations, and cleaning filter floss (prefilter, not sponge) regularly. Flushing out filter housing can remove hidden stuff that pollutes the tank.

[Fish mon]

Most sd experts are saying don't adjust ph in the tank, but maintain a stable level anywhere from 6-8. With a fully cycled tank, nitrate is a potential problem. Test strips say 20 is safe, but discus keepers say 5-10 is the target range. After cycling, ammonia and nitrite don't tend to rise noticeably. It is nitrate that rises and must be kept down by water changes, vacuuming/wiping substrate, wiping down glass and decorations, and cleaning filter floss (prefilter, not sponge) regularly. Flushing out filter housing can remove hidden stuff that pollutes the tank.

Okay I will clean out the filter floss and prefilter materials and grab a nitrate test kit. The tap ph is around 8 so I should re-adjust them to that then

[Argentum]

The spots on the BD seems like Ich. A better picture will help. Anyway keep with daily water changes and vacuuming the gravel. If you are going to change the pH do that gradually on 3 days if you are going from 6.5 to 8 I will do 30% treated unbuffered water daily for 3 or 4 days and you will get the pH to your tap.

it is even better to age your water first to check if there will be any pH swings before attempting this.
My final advice don't panic and take it slowly.

[Fish mon]

The spots on the BD seems like Ich. A better picture will help. Anyway keep with daily water changes and vacuuming the gravel. If you are going to change the pH do that gradually on 3 days if you are going from 6.5 to 8 I will do 30% treated unbuffered water daily for 3 or 4 days and you will get the pH to your tap.

it is even better to age your water first to check if there will be any pH swings before attempting this.
My final advice don't panic and take it slowly.

I will try to take a better pic of the BD but its not ich for sure. I think he scratched himself a few times trying to hide behind the driftwood and he finally came out not long ago and its just scrapes. Okay I will do the 30% daily.

Im trying not to panic :( Why is it just the map and BD feeling ill though? The rest are acting like nothings wrong

[Second Hand Pat]

Here are pics of them. I couldnt get a clear shot of the blue because hes hiding

http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps56a5ab12.jpg.html
http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps859a1853.jpg.html

Definitely not ick on the BD. Might be HITH, hard to tell from the picture.

http://i1026.photobucket.com/albums/y327/rzmalunes/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps859a1853.jpg

http://i1026.photobucket.com/albums/y327/rzmalunes/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps56a5ab12.jpg

[OC Discus]

Just gradually adjust ph by not adding buffer to water changes. Don't make a major adjustment at one time.


Okay I will clean out the filter floss and prefilter materials and grab a nitrate test kit. The tap ph is around 8 so I should re-adjust them to that then

[Fish mon]

Yes the BD has small holes near its mouth. Its skin looks like its peeling too and its really dark :(
Ok no more using of the buffer

[Fish mon]

Update:
They are both looking better! The map has opened up his fins and the BD has stopped hiding and has lightened up a little in colour as well. Although they are still refusing food, this is an improvement. Thanks for the advice everyone

[OC Discus]

IME the bd show more of their pores than other colors and strains. Looks like white spots of some kind on the bd to me. Are the white spots just on the face, or also in other places? Can you get a clearer picture?

[Fish mon]

http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps66932e76.jpg.html
http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps186399a8.jpg.html

Here they are now

[OC Discus]

The pb looks less stressed. The bd looks ok, but too fuzzy to see the spots. Are they raised spots like grains of salt, fuzzy spots, or holes?

[PP_GBR]

FM

The BD is looking much better now. So keep up with wc. I'd dose the whole tank with Epsom salt 1-2 TBSP per 10 gal for 1-2 days. After that, just do wc and observe the fish for a week. If he does not eat after 1 week then you need to step up your action.

[Fish mon]

The BD no longer has any spots. They both finally ate a little of the beefheart while I was feeding the others so its looking better

Here they are right now
http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsb18318e6.jpg.html
http://s1026.photobucket.com/user/rzmalunes/media-full/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps642d5b4d.jpg.html

[OC Discus]

They are looking much better. Can anyone comment on the amount of black in the bd eye? Is that normal? If not, what is it? Is it remnants of a stress bar?

[Fish mon]

They are looking much better. Can anyone comment on the amount of black in the bd eye? Is that normal? If not, what is it? Is it remnants of a stress bar?

Yeah I wonder that too. Its pretty thick for a stressbar remnant

[PP_GBR]

Your BD eye color with black bar across the eyes indicates he's not happy. That's what I call Sad Eyes. LOL.

There is something bothering him. Maybe he is constipated. That's why I suggest to treat him with Epsom salt to rule out it's not internal issue. Have you seen him passing feces @ feedings or WCs?

[Fish mon]

Your BD eye color with black bar across the eyes indicates he's not happy. That's what I call Sad Eyes. LOL.

There is something bothering him. Maybe he is constipated. That's why I suggest to treat him with Epsom salt to rule out it's not internal issue. Have you seen him passing feces @ feedings or WCs?

Oh I see. I still have to go grab some epsom salt. No I havent seen him pass feces yet. Will the salt be ok for the corys?

[PP_GBR]

FM

I don't have corys in my discus tank but I had treated my discus tank with Epsom salt and with upside down catfish in the same tank with no issues. If they are of your most concern, then move the corys to another tank while you're treating your discus. Personally, I don't think it'd be an issue for your corys. I could only make suggestions and it's up to you to decide what's best for your fish. Someone treated corys with Epsom salt may chime in.

[Skip]

why epson salt

[Fish mon]

why epson salt

Hi Skip what salt would you recommend?

And I just saw the BD pass a big dark solid chunk of poop so does that mean hes okay?

[Skip]

epson salt is for constipation..

table salt, sodium choloride is like a general tonic for fish.

[PP_GBR]

FM

I'd treat him with Epsom salt. Look at his eyes and you can tell if he's better. Compare the eye color to the pics in post #18.

[Skip]

OP.. i am not going to confuse you anymore then you are by adding what i know.. to much misguided information getting thrown around here lately..

hope they get better..