need help (for a friend)

[4discusdude]

Hi sd member, ok the story began on saturday night. I had a friend come pick up 6 of my discus fry ( the fry in the other posts that I had). As u can see that video was taking 3 day b4 he came and pick up the fry and they all healthy n eating fine. So he pick them up on saturday night and put in his new 10 g tank ( it just temporary tank until the fry grow bigger). The next morning all the fry die. The tank is not cycle, so I told him is should be fine with large daily water change and the fry need it anyway for the growth and health. He did everything I told him b4 the day he came pick it up. Everything is news, heather air pump but not the tank. He ask me why does the fry look like it need air ? So he sent me a couple of pic of the fry. They look fine too me, they just swimming at the top. It just look like they scare of the new home. He got plenty of air in it. I call him the next day n that what he told me they all die at night. So we talk n trying to find out what happen n last conversation he told me that he clean the tank with soap. So I told him that might be the problem but then he also he said he did it before with other tank n they were fine which I don't think so but who know. So now I just really trying to help him out. Today he take water sample to petsmart to test n they said everything is fine no ammonia n ect. But he keep telling me that he did everything the same with his old tank, cleaning with soap n they fine except this tank didn't cycle yet. So what is the problem why the fry all die in just said 8 hr max? I told him not to give up on discus, they pretty n will bring joy to him n now he want to start again but still afraid it might die on him again. Oh and he didn't live far from me. Just 10 minute drive. So the fry didn't travel that far. I double bag n wrap it with news paper. So what is going on? Thank you

[brewmaster15]

My guess..and its only a guess based on what you have described..but if he rinsed the tank well..and got out all the soap residue..I'd bank on dissolved gases like C0 2 being a possibility. it does sound like this is water related.

One other note 6 fry dead,10 gal tank ,no biofilter? And the water tested 0 for ammonia? That is not what I would expect.Id expect some ammonia but no nitrite or nitrate.

[4discusdude]

Thank you for responding al, well I did give him new k1 media though n yes he said he take the water sample to petsmart to tested today n they said is was fine. Now I'm not there when he clean the tank with soap but he said he rinse a couple time. Most of my tank r not even cycle when I start adding discus in it. Like the fry that I give it to him, their tank not even cycle three week ago before I move them in. Im trying to post the pic that he texted to me. But I can't n really don't know how.

[4discusdude]

That what my first guess about ammonia is present but he did add prime b4 he add the fry n he add another dose to it when he said they didn't look rite.

[brewmaster15]

Did your friend do a huge water change before he put the fry in the tank?How does he prepare his water? Is he city water or well water? A night in an uncycled tank would not kill them...but chemicals residue can as well as dissolved gases..

Its going to be hard to figure out after the fact though.
al

[OC Discus]

In all my years of fish keeping, even with non-discus, one rule has always been to use buckets or containers that have never had soap in them. If he failed to rinse good with hot water, I would think the soap is a possible culprit. It might be helpful to know what kind of soap, how much he used, did he rinse with "hot" water?

[musicmarn1]

In all my years of fish keeping, even with non-discus, one rule has always been to use buckets or containers that have never had soap in them. If he failed to rinse good with hot water, I would think the soap is a possible culprit. It might be helpful to know what kind of soap, how much he used, did he rinse with "hot" water?

agreed

[brewmaster15]

We had a case awhile back where someone killed a tank of fish by using laundry socks as a filter instead of filter socks. The residual detergent killed the fish, probably by coating the gills leading to suffocation. I think back then it was a case of confusion as he heard "socks" used as filters...thinking they meant the type we wear on feet...in reality the "socks" mentioned are designed for filters.

-al

[4discusdude]

Yes, he did exactly what I told him to do. Set up with new water with air stone n heater b4 the day he come pick up the fry. I even told him don't put prime in yet but wait until he pick up the fry the next day and add prime. The temp setting is at 85° is in the tank.

[4discusdude]

In all my years of fish keeping, even with non-discus, one rule has always been to use buckets or containers that have never had soap in them. If he failed to rinse good with hot water, I would think the soap is a possible culprit. It might be helpful to know what kind of soap, how much he used, did he rinse with "hot" water?

Yup me too. After I heard from him n I told him that a bad idea. Even me, I don't wash my hand with soap because most of the time I put my hand inside the fish tank. I only wash when I know I'm not going to touch for awhile. It just I felt really bad about because his son also like discus n it seem like it is his son first discus but they die b4 he wake up n gone. Now I told to cycle the tank fishless and that what he want anyway. I told him set it up like a fish. Everything that he going to use for that (used equipment) let it run with bleach in it for couple day n drained it out and air dried.

[4discusdude]

Did your friend do a huge water change before he put the fry in the tank?How does he prepare his water? Is he city water or well water? A night in an uncycled tank would not kill them...but chemicals residue can as well as dissolved gases..

Its going to be hard to figure out after the fact though.
al

He use city tap water. So now he just going to start over n clean with bleach and after that he going to start fishless cycle like I told him. He has bad experience from the past. All the discus from past didn't grow healthy n big.

[OC Discus]

After the bleach he could drain and run a heavy dose of prime for 24 hours- wiping down all surfaces with prime in the water. Just extra caution since he had a problem.

I would add the bleach then wipe down all surfaces with bleach in the tank. Let it run 24 hours drain and repeat with prime. Then drain and refill again before cycling.

[4discusdude]

After the bleach he could drain and run a heavy dose of prime for 24 hours- wiping down all surfaces with prime in the water. Just extra caution since he had a problem.

I would add the bleach then wipe down all surfaces with bleach in the tank. Let it run 24 hours drain and repeat with prime. Then drain and refill again before cycling.

Yeah that what I told him to do now. Bleach n let it run for couple day n drained it out n air dried n add new water with prime n start add ammonia the next day to start the cycle.