Practice

[rickztahone]

I just had an idea for a possible sticky, or maybe even a little corner section of the photo center. This post will be earmarked for that purpose.

In short, I would like to set a practice routine where I tell people specifically what to do with their camera on a step-by-step basis.

For example,

Go outdoors during daytime
set camera to Aperture Priority
set aperture to...
now change aperture to...

Stuff of that nature.

In this way, we actually get these potential photographers out and shooting, rather than just reading about it. What do you think?

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, I think some people may need that and others will take the initiation so would supply that as needed.

[rickztahone]

Ricardo, I think some people may need that and others will take the initiation so would supply that as needed.

Would you be willing to do a test run today if I gave you a certain set of steps to take?

[Second Hand Pat]

Would you be willing to do a test run today if I gave you a certain set of steps to take?

Sure but if you want outside pictures it is cloudy now and is expected to be all day. Just saying if sunlight is needed.

[rickztahone]

Sure but if you want outside pictures it is cloudy now and is expected to be all day. Just saying if sunlight is needed.

Hmm, depends how cloudy really, but shouldn't be a huge problem. This is what I would like for you to do for me:

Get your fastest lens, hopefully one that starts at 2.8, but I believe you have prime that is 1.8? If so, choose the 1.8.

Grab your camera/lens and go outside.

Find a rather small object, maybe the size of a soccerball or thereabouts.

Isolate it on a table, but have something interesting in the background, maybe a flower corner, or something colorful in general. If you can't find something along those lines, use what you got, but something interesting may suit better.

Set your camera in apeture priority.

Set your White balance to cloudy if it is cloudy. Or if under shade, use shade. Either one works, so long as your WB is consistent.

You will start wide open (hopefully at 1.8 if I remembered correctly). When wide open, the camera will choose your shutter speed, but should let you choose your ISO.

Now, set your camera for spot focus so that you are only using your middle focus point.


Check out what your exposure metering is set to. Exposure metering should look something like this icon right in the middle of this picture, right above the iso100
http://nikonmag.com/img_post/image-dd401b8d5c6f6e7a48ccc3dc6319729e.jpg

In Nikon it may look different than mine, but I believe the one shown is wide metering. This means that it will try to meter the WHOLE scene for you and will tell you how to compensate your exposure to achieve a good exposure.

What I would like for you to do is set that exposure metering to spot as well. In this manner, all we are telling the camera to meter for is the subject (e.g. soccer ball or something similar). You will notice, that if you have spot focus, if you move your focus to something else, say the background, you will see your exposure reading change, and it should be pretty dramatic. That is typically because a sky outside is much more brighter than a subject not directly under the sunlight.

Set your camera to focus on the object. Once you have locked focus, see if you can set the camera in to manual. If you can, the focus will remain on the subject.

So, now we are manually focused on the subject. You will want to stay in relatively the same place.

Now, finally, I want you to start stopping down and taking a shot at each stop. This means, you will go from 1.8, to 2.8, then to 4, then to 5.6, 8, 11, 16, 22. When you reach the end of this scale, you will probably be in lower shutter speed numbers (if it really is cloudy outside, if daylight, the shutter speed may still be useable). If the shutter speed is too low, say 1/10, you can bump up your ISO to help with the camera shake.

Once you do all of these things, review your photos, and tell us what you find.


Now THAT, is some homework, lol.

I almost went in to exposure lock:
http://cschu.redirectme.net/mirrored/F80/www.nikonians.org/html/resources/nikon_articles/body/f80/F80_files/AE-AF-Lock-Big.jpg

but I forgot that in apeture priority, you do not need to worry about locking in the exposure to keep the exposure the same. The camera does it for you. If you ever transition to full manual mode, like I always shoot, you will have to use the exposure lock button to drag the shutter speed with you to keep the same exposure.

Same principle, just one added step.

[rickztahone]

I forgot to ask, do you know how to read your exposure meter? In the first picture, do you see the meter that it is pointing to? You typically always want to be at 0 on that scale. This gives you a sense of correct exposure. This is a guide of sorts. You don't always have to abide by it, and you can use exposure compensation to override it, but in general, it is very handy and should be used all the time.

Keep an eye on it, and notice how it changes during the exercise (or doesn't :))

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, this is what I didn't know.

1. Setting the white balance.
2. The camera will set the ISO in AP. Not sure how to set it manually.
3. Spot focus is AF-S?
4. No clue about the exposure metering?

[Second Hand Pat]

Ok, got the WB to Cloudy http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/changing-settings-for-white-balance-on-a-nikon-d70.html

[Second Hand Pat]

Ok, found the EM, it is in the view finder and is set to 0 which is where you want it. Not sure you can set it in AP mode. Perhaps just in manual mode http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/reading-and-adjusting-a-nikon-d7000s-exposure-mete.html.

[Second Hand Pat]

I see you actually want to go to manual mode. So will lookup ISO and see if I can set the metering mode to spot.

[Second Hand Pat]

Ok, here's the metering button http://www.digital-photography.com/nikon-d7000-guide/top-settings/d-07-exposure-metering-button/. Now I need to fine the main command dial. The main command dial is here http://www.digital-photography.com/nikon-d7000-guide/back-settings/e-12-rear-command-dial/ and I do have the metering mode set to spot. Now ISO.

It is not "lite" homework lol.

[rickztahone]

Ricardo, this is what I didn't know.

1. Setting the white balance.
2. The camera will set the ISO in AP. Not sure how to set it manually.
3. Spot focus is AF-S?
4. No clue about the exposure metering?

1. It seems that on the next post you figured out the WB.
2. I rarely use Apeture priority, but you SHOULD be able to adjust the ISO to your desire. I would have to check that later though.
3. Spot focus can be used in AF-S(ingle) or AF-(C)ontinous. It is a focus point that determines what will be in focus. By default, all cameras come with wide focus, which means the camera chooses it for you. You can see the spot designation here:
http://farbspiel-photo.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Spot-Metering-Mode.jpg
Right at the bottom (the one marked 3) you will see that it shows only a tiny dot. That is the spot focus.
4. The exposure metering CAN be changed in AP mode. To do this, you have to change the exposure compensation.


Ok, got the WB to Cloudy http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/changing-settings-for-white-balance-on-a-nikon-d70.html
I believe you got the WB part, great job! If you shoot jpeg, it is crucial to get the correct WB from the start. If you shoot RAW, you get a lot more latitude and can be fixed in PP. You can always put it in auto, but as you can probably tell from all of my postings in this section, I tend to not let the camera do ANY of my decisions. For this reason, most mid to higher end (and even some entry level) cameras have something called WB Set. In thise mode, YOU tell the camera what is actually white. You basically get a white piece of something that is getting the type of lighting from the scene, then shoot it, and you tell the camera that the subject you just shot is actually white.


Ok, found the EM, it is in the view finder and is set to 0 which is where you want it. Not sure you can set it in AP mode. Perhaps just in manual mode http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/reading-and-adjusting-a-nikon-d7000s-exposure-mete.html.
You should also have a metering bar across the bottom (typical location) on the LCD, but don't quote me on that.


I see you actually want to go to manual mode. So will lookup ISO and see if I can set the metering mode to spot.
The only thing that I wanted you to set to manual was the lens itself, so that it doesn't Auto Focus on its own, and it was locked on the subject. I didn't mean to switch to (M)anual Mode. My apologies for not having been clear there.

[rickztahone]

Ok, here's the metering button http://www.digital-photography.com/nikon-d7000-guide/top-settings/d-07-exposure-metering-button/. Now I need to fine the main command dial. The main command dial is here http://www.digital-photography.com/nikon-d7000-guide/back-settings/e-12-rear-command-dial/ and I do have the metering mode set to spot. Now ISO.

It is not "lite" homework lol.

There you go, that is exactly the button I was hopingyou had. That button will change what is being exposed for on your viewfinder and lcd (if in liveview mode).

Typically, when there is only one scroll wheel, you have to activate it by holding another button and scrolling with the wheel to adjust. If I remember correctly, it is typically the AEL button that you hold and then scroll. It basically works as an "alt" button.

I know many of this sounds complicated, but getting to know where all of these buttons are, will help you a great deal, and will expand your knowledge of photography like never before.

If it is too much at once, take a break, and take it in small steps. If you need help along the way, I am here to help. :)

[Second Hand Pat]

Ok Ricardo, I did try to call you BTW but just left a voice message. I see the MA vs M on the lens so think I am ready to try this.

[rickztahone]

Ok Ricardo, I did try to call you BTW but just left a voice message. I see the MA vs M on the lens so think I am ready to try this.

lol, I did get a voicemail, but no call came through. I get really horrible service here at work.

Yes, the manual override would be on the lens I believe. Again, it is difficult for me to tell you specifically without seeing what you are using. Some have the manual override on the lens itself as a switch, others have a coupling system where you have to pull it, and my camera actually has a AF/MF engage button that it doesn't matter what the lens says, it will override it regardless, which makes it super easy for me to spot focus, hit that button and not have to refocus again. If you need some help, I will be on my lunch break in about 30 minutes or so. After I eat, I got outside and watch the nice Santa Monica weather :)

[Second Hand Pat]

OK, took all the pictures. The camera was indicating Lo in the main window so think the pics will be underexposed. Will upload those shortly.

[Second Hand Pat]

Well, these are not worth uploading. They are overexposed. Too much light, here's the pic at F1.8 but they are all similar to f22. I think the WB is incorrect.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7538/15783960649_3e30c65106_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/q3LVAz)DSC_6225 (https://flic.kr/p/q3LVAz) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[Second Hand Pat]

OK, went back out and placed the WB on shady. Same result and then normal, also same result. Guessing that the ISO needs to be dialed down a bit or perhaps I am just lost. I also note that my AF-S went to A. Not sure how that happened.

[Second Hand Pat]

Ok, after talking to my hubby who knows a bit about photography the way I composed the picture are wrong as I was looking edge on at the table and the Frisbee was only slightly elevated. I used a mango instead and got a much better result.

[Second Hand Pat]

A better result

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7482/15350800753_d149cb8c55_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pouSfv)DSC_6236 (https://flic.kr/p/pouSfv) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

Pat do you see the scale at the bottom of this picture? In your viewfinder, you should see that scale. I tried googling your bodies viewfinder and this is what I came back with:
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/nikon-d7100/ZTECH_VIEWFINDER-2.jpg

[rickztahone]

Ok Pat, I just saw your EXIF data, and your problem for sure is your ISO. You need to dial that down to your base ISO, that should be either 100 or 200, you are currently at 2000. You have to be able to adjust the ISO manually, the camera shouldn't do that for you on aperture priority.

[rickztahone]

The mango shot is much better. If you notice, the tree in the background is nice and blurry. On the frisbee shot, the tree isn't as blurry, which means, you focused somewhere closer to the tree.

[rickztahone]

Here you go Pat, I believe this is your problem:
Adjusting ISO (http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/using-the-iso-controlling-features-on-a-nikon-d700.html)

You need to hold the ISO button and then scroll wheel down to adjust ISO. That is if I read that correctly.

[Second Hand Pat]

Yea, I am not multitasking well yet with the camera. I have to think about where my fingers are to change the f-stop, then remember where I should be focusing and then adjusting the focus...can we say overload :D I will research the ISO later. Brain is too full ATM. lol

[rickztahone]

Here's the thing Pat, I could have easily told you to worry about 3 things, apeture, shutter speed and ISO in manual mode. However, I also want you to know what the other buttons do, so that when you have to employ them, you can.

So, in manual mode, you would set apeture and shutter speed individually. This gives you a lot more freedom to be creative, but it also makes it so that you have more work to do, but again, you could have tackled just those three things.

[Second Hand Pat]

Understand Ricardo. I did note that at f-stop 16 and 22 the shutter speed seemed slower...or the camera took longer to take the picture.

[rickztahone]

Understand Ricardo. I did note that at f-stop 16 and 22 the shutter speed seemed slower...or the camera took longer to take the picture.

indeed. they have an inverse effect. If the f/stop gets wider, then the shutter speed increases for the added light. If the f/stop gets narrower, the shutter speed decreases to compensate for the lack of light. This extends your exposure, which is why I mentioned early on that if your shutter speed got too low to increase your ISO to compensate for the slower shutter speed.

[brewmaster15]

indeed. they have an inverse effect. If the f/stop gets wider, then the shutter speed increases for the added light. If the f/stop gets narrower, the shutter speed decreases to compensate for the lack of light. This extends your exposure, which is why I mentioned early on that if your shutter speed got too low to increase your ISO to compensate for the slower shutter speed.

Hopefully not hi jacking this thread, but wanted to add something .

Theres also a depth of field relationship here Pat..

The smaller the aperture (ei..the larger the f stop number), The greater the depth of field...meaning the more distance in front of the object and behind the object will be in focus. To put it in perspective,.. if you focus on a person with the aperature openned wide to let maximum light in, the person may be in focus, but the background is out of focus... If you close the aperature down ( and have enough light) you get more infocus in front of an behind the person.

Pat, a trip to the library and pick up any old book on 35 mm SLR photography will really help you understand the relationships between light, aperature, and shutter speed.

Coming from the dinosaur age of print film, These are ingrained in my head, but can be difficult to understand when new to photography and used to the camera thinking.
One thing that not mentioned much these days, is a rule we use alot in old school as a s starting point.. Its called the Sunny F16 rule....


I believe this article is along the lines of what Ricardo is trying to accomplish here...
http://www.digital-photo-secrets.com/tip/1565/the-sunny-16-rule/



HTH,
al

[rickztahone]

Hopefully not hi jacking this thread, but wanted to add something .

Theres also a depth of field relationship here Pat..

The smaller the aperture (ei..the larger the f stop number), The greater the depth of field...meaning the more distance in front of the object and behind the object will be in focus. To put it in perspective,.. if you focus on a person with the aperature openned wide to let maximum light in, the person may be in focus, but the background is out of focus... If you close the aperature down ( and have enough light) you get more infocus in front of an behind the person.

Pat, a trip to the library and pick up any old book on 35 mm SLR photography will really help you understand the relationships between light, aperature, and shutter speed.

Coming from the dinosaur age of print film, These are ingrained in my head, but can be difficult to understand when new to photography and used to the camera thinking.
One thing that not mentioned much these days, is a rule we use alot in old school as a s starting point.. Its called the Sunny F16 rule....


I believe this article is along the lines of what Ricardo is trying to accomplish here...
http://www.digital-photo-secrets.com/tip/1565/the-sunny-16-rule/



HTH,
al

Good article Al. I believe one of the main reasons we never hear of that rule anymore is because we have in theory an onboard light meter which is pretty accurate now-a-days. Additionally, many also have liveview histograms that help analyze and adjust accordingly.

When I go out with my film Minolta x-700, it is a good rule to follow though and one in which I see a great importance for.

The digital age has spoiled us significantly though, and many rules have gone by the wayside due to it.

My goal for Pat was simply to observe the difference betweena a wide open shot in relation to the background, and a very stopped down shot, also in relation to the background. In this manner, she would see how it is much more easy to keep things in focus to stop down, but also to show that there is a time and a place to open a lens up all the way. I hope that translated in to Pat's exercise :)

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, I will repeat the exercise when the weather improves. Have a misty rain here all day.

[rickztahone]

No worries Pat. We need more rain here in Southern California :)

[Second Hand Pat]

Here is a series of picture where I wish I knew how to change the ISO and perhaps the shutter speed. It was late on a cloudy rainy day and just could not miss the opportunity. One of these pictures is in auto mode. The rest at AP. I have only cropped the pictures.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7556/15976832591_10e9dd91ce_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qkPrGT)DSC_6253 (https://flic.kr/p/qkPrGT) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7490/15978157382_3f82390293_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qkWew7)DSC_6252 (https://flic.kr/p/qkWew7) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7561/15978159092_18df0dd2aa_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qkWf2A)DSC_6251 (https://flic.kr/p/qkWf2A) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7476/15953056826_d3c484471f_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qiHzZU)DSC_6250 (https://flic.kr/p/qiHzZU) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7565/15793098017_6a147bb249_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/q4zKPp)DSC_6249 (https://flic.kr/p/q4zKPp) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

In this picture I bumped the fstop to F2.8
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8602/15792830729_a67291ff16_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/q4yomZ)DSC_6248 (https://flic.kr/p/q4yomZ) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7475/15359211943_f2d6aece29_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/ppeYB2)DSC_6244 (https://flic.kr/p/ppeYB2) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

If you notice, your ISO is bouncing back and forth in some of the shots. This is due to auto mode I am sure, because you say you are not adjusting it. Take a look at the previous page, and it shows you how to take it off auto iso and how to adjust it.

Notice that at f/1.8, it is very easy to miss your focus. This is because your DOF (depth of field) is very small at that apeture.

In shot 6248 you missed the focus. On the following shot, 6249, you got the subject in focus. This exercise was to show you the increments of stopping down.

So, say you starting shooting the butterflies at 1.8, your next shot would have been at 2.8, then at 4, 5.6, 8, 11, 16. In this manner, you would have progressively noticed that more things were in focus as you stopped down.

On AP, you can not change the shutter speed directly, but inderictly you can by using your exposure compensation. If you increase (+) your exposure compensation, it will decrease (-) your shutter speed, and vice-versa.

My favorite shots are 6250 and 6251, although the latter is a bit underexposed.

Also, remember to set your WB to something specific like shade, or cloudy. In this case, your WB is changing from one pic to the other, and this makes it more difficult to be consistent.

If I were to have approached this shot, I would probably have gone with f/4-f/5.6, Shutter speed around 1/60 and ISO 1,600, wb shade.

[Second Hand Pat]

You are right, I did not step thru the fstop. Also I thought the WB was set to shape and it is ATM. I did not change it but the EXIF says it is set to manual except one pic was auto (when I changed to auto for one pic)?? Confused on the manual setting for the WB.

[pcsb23]

Pat, I know you are keen to learn but I get the feeling you are trying to run before you can walk. I hope that doesn't upset you.

If you remember previously I have suggested that you master one aspect of camera control at a time, only moving on to the next once that is down pat (pun intended).

There is a basic relationship between aperture and shutter speed. ISO complicates matters but is easily factored in once you grasp this basic principle. In order to maintain the same exposure each time you stop down a lens (i.e. go from f2 to f2.8 or f4 to f5.6) you have to correspondingly decrease the shutter speed. So if f2 gave you 1/500 the f2.8 will give 1/250 and f4 will give 1/125 and f5.6 will give 1/60.

Where ISO comes into play is when at say ISO 100 we get 1/8 sec at f5.6 and we wish to use f5.6 for the DoF. We have two choices here (excluding a tripod ;)) Add more light or increase the ISO (or both - but that complicates things some). If adding more light isn't feasible then we are left with increasing the ISO. Now here comes the interesting bit ... ISO can also be considered in stops, so if ISO 100 gives 1/8 sec then ISO200 will give 1/15, ISO 400 will give 1/30, ISO 800 will give 1/60 and ISO 1600 will give 1/125. So each doubling of the ISO halves the shutter speed.

We have exactly the same relationship between ISO and Shutter speed as we do between shutter speed and Aperture. We also have the same relationship between ISO and Aperture, i.e. double one, halve the other. As we have three settings we often refer to this as the exposure triangle. ISO should be the last setting to change btw as the higher the ISO the lower the image quality.

OK, so some suggested camera settings for you (D7000 specific) ...

Switch off Automatic ISO - Menu, Shooting Menu (Camera Icon), ISO Sensitivity, Auto ISO sensitivity control = Off
Mode = Aperture Priority (top left hand dial set to A)
WB set to Auto WB - the D7000 is remarkably good with WB and shooting raw it can be adjusted at no IQ cost - Menu, Shooting Menu (Camera Icon), White Balance = Auto (cannot remember if there are multiple Auto modes)


Ideally you will be saving in raw format, if not I strongly suggest you start and if you need a fallback set it to record in Raw and JPEG fine, remember you have two card slots! I wished I'd saved more in raw. It is likely that the metering mode will be set to matrix, that's fine and should generally be left there.

Now when you half press the shutter release to activate the meters and autofocus you can now change your aperture by using the front command wheel. Simply rotate it left and right to stop down (e.g. f4 to f4.5) and left to open up (e.g. f5.6 to f5). Looking through the viewfinder you will see the shutter speed shown in the bottom left of the screen, usually something like 125 or 60 - this represents 1/125 and 1/60 etc ... On the lower right hand side you will see the ISO setting, literally small lettered ISO followed by a number (usually, can be Lo or Hi but ...). If the shutter speed needs adjusting and you don't want to change aperture then press and hold the ISO button on the back of the camera and rotate the Rear command wheel. The ISO button is located on the back of the camera on the left hand side as you look at it, second button up from the bottom. It only changes the ISO when NOT viewing images on the rear lcd. Practice this, as believe me it is such a time saver. It is second nature to me, but has only become so because I have practised and practised it!

The above is a lot to take in, and could be argued running v walking. BUT you need to master the basic camera controls if you are to progress and get out of Auto.

As a very rough guide with your 35mm lens you want to aim for a shutter speed no lower than around 1/60, even perhaps 1/100. Some people are better at holding cameras than others, I used to coach people to shoot so the technique is transferable, needless to say I can get decent results at lower than average shutter speeds, but as I'm getting older I'm finding it more challenging! The longer the lens, the longer the minimum shutter speed needs to be too. Rule of thumb is 1 over effective focal length - note the use of the term effective focal length, on a D7000 the effective focal length of the 35mm lens is 50mm (actually 53mm but ...) - I won't explain this just now, just accept it as said, the explanation is confusing ;)

So given the above if you are using a zoom at say 150mm the shutter speed needs to be 1 over (150 * 1.5) or 1/250 at the nearest whole number ...

ISO is your ally, use it when you have to, but understand the cost in doing so. The cost is a decrease in image quality (IQ).

A little exercise when you have good light and a spare 15 minutes. Set the camera up as above (the suggested setting will only need applying once). Pick and object, preferably stationary. Stick your 35mm lens on and start at f1.8 and ISO 100 and shoot, then without taking your eye from the viewfinder, set the aperture to f2 and shoot again, note the effect on shutter speed. Then set the aperture to f2.8 and repeat, then f4 and repeat, keep going until you hit the min aperture of the lens (not sure if it is f16 or f22). Repeat but this time change the ISO to say 400 and note the effect on shutter speed. DON'T take your eye from the viewfinder! That would be cheating ;)

Remember half pressing the shutter activates af and meters, use the front command wheel to change aperture, press and hold second button up on the rear left hand side and use the rear command wheel to change ISO.

This type of practice gets you used to using the controls and builds an understanding of the relationship between aperture, shutter speed and ISO. This is the foundation for everything else.

[Second Hand Pat]

Nope Paul, not upset that all. Tomorrow should be sunny :) and I am known to run prior to walking sometimes. After I beat my head against a wall a time or two I slow down and go back to see what I missed. Tomorrow is play time. :D

[pcsb23]

Remember to read that guide I gave you, Thom Hogan is one of the very best photography teachers out there, his guides are excellent.

Practice can be fun (and should be most times) but be disciplined. Honestly, being able to control aperture, shutter speed and ISO really is the building blocks for everything else. Stick to A mode, even when you get frustrated! In due course you will instinctively know if you need to be in Aperture priority, Shutter priority or full manual. My coaching experience tells me that by following a disciplined approach, which may seem slow and tedious at times, you actually get there much quicker than a hap hazard try and everything and forget approach.

We've all been guilty of running before walking though ...

[Second Hand Pat]

Paul, I should start with the full guide on the CD. I already got lost in the "to go" guide. :o

[Second Hand Pat]

I started reading the complete guide tonight plus ordered "The Camera" to help with the basics.

[rickztahone]

Good stuff Pat. Let us know if you have any questions.

[Second Hand Pat]

Will do Ricardo. Funny thing is my hubby just handed me volume one of a two volume set. The title on volume on is "Photograghy" under that is "U.S. Bureau of Naval Personnel". It is printed in 1953.

[rickztahone]

Will do Ricardo. Funny thing is my hubby just handed me volume one of a two volume set. The title on volume on is "Photograghy" under that is "U.S. Bureau of Naval Personnel". It is printed in 1953.

well, you will get the principals of photography in such an older volume which there is nothing wrong with, but, you will miss out on newer tech stuff. However, a lot of the newer tech stuff is really just bells and whistles gimmicky stuff. Read those books because they have a much more practical approach to photography that is often not done in modern age.

[Second Hand Pat]

well, you will get the principals of photography in such an older volume which there is nothing wrong with, but, you will miss out on newer tech stuff. However, a lot of the newer tech stuff is really just bells and whistles gimmicky stuff. Read those books because they have a much more practical approach to photography that is often not done in modern age.

It covers a lot in interesting stuff from to basics to developing film and even infrared photography.

[Second Hand Pat]

I went out and played with my camera and basically did as you suggested Paul with the f stop and ISO. I took the berry series, two cat series, and the butterfly series. This is my favorite of the lot even thru it is a bit dark.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7575/15394818133_55a87460c7_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/psot5R)DSC_6312 - Copy (https://flic.kr/p/psot5R) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

I will be graphing the fstop, shutter speed and ISO to show the change across fstops. I also did all my own focusing.

[Second Hand Pat]

This is one from the cat series. Focusing is getting better.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7550/15988757396_32f2c91323_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qmSywY)DSC_6300 - Copy (2) (https://flic.kr/p/qmSywY) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[Second Hand Pat]

Ok, went out and played with the cat again. This is the best one.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7462/15835574038_30124c1fe4_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/q8kssA)DSC_6386 (https://flic.kr/p/q8kssA) by phusband56 (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

Good shot Pat. Let me give you some advice that got me ahead in my photography quickly.

-Try to shoot subjects on their level, in this case, it would have required you to lay down on the grass with Kitty and take the shot. This allows for a more pleasing background.
-Always(well almost always) try to focus on the nearest eye of a subject. Remember that you always get more DOF behindi[/url] a subject than in front of it, so it is always good to keep the closest eye to you tack sharp and have the DOF do its thing.
-Amputated limbs are a tricky subject. In most cases, you do not want to cut off a subject where a limb looks like it was cut off. If you absolutely [I]have to, then try to crop in between a joint. For example, if you take a shot of a person, and you need to cut them off for some reason, do it in between wrist and elbow, or elbow and shoulder, knee and foot, etc.

Lovely kitty though, and a great subject. If your cat is a cooperative one, then it is the perfect subject for you to practice on. Their eyes are very photogenic.

[Second Hand Pat]

Thanks Ricardo, on this particular shot it was taken quickly do to getting that look in the cat's face and yea, I hate amputated limbs but took advantage of the moment. :D

Good points BTW.

[rickztahone]

It happens to all of us. It still happens to me regularly, because you try to juggle a million "rules" in your head and one is bound to slip, lol. Photography rules can always be broken, and I often do, but it is good to know the rule and know when you are actually breaking one intentionally.

Keep 'em coming.

[Second Hand Pat]

Here's the best one Ricardo but was a little closer to the cat then I wanted to be hence missing parts. I do feel I got the focus on the foreground eye.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8615/16029584892_e6ebcbbacf_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qqtP8j)DSC_6417 (https://flic.kr/p/qqtP8j) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[Second Hand Pat]

I kind of like this one too.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7570/16030309535_6a29739c44_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qqxwxa)DSC_6419 (https://flic.kr/p/qqxwxa) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

Here's the best one Ricardo but was a little closer to the cat then I wanted to be hence missing parts. I do feel I got the focus on the foreground eye.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8615/16029584892_e6ebcbbacf_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qqtP8j)DSC_6417 (https://flic.kr/p/qqtP8j) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

I typically do not advocate "pixel peeping" (enlarging a photo to see fine detail), but I wanted to pixel peep this photo to make sure you are getting focus correct. Unfortunately, you did not. One way to pixel peep in Flickr is by clicking on your photo, then click on the 3 dots on the bottom right corner of the picture. Select view all sizes, and view the photo in a large format, in my case, I went with 2048. At this size, you will notice that your focus as actually not on the foreground eye, but rather the patch of grass in the foreground. I only bring this up so that you are aware that somewhere along the line, you are missing focus. This may be due to your focus spread. If you are shooting in wide, the camera will decide where it will focus.

I typically shoot in spot focus, because I can tell the camera exactly what I want in focus. In your case, you would have acquired focus on the foreground eye by half pressing shutter, then, when focus on eye and still holding the focus, you recompose your shot (make it a good format shot) and take the photo. I hope this makes sense.

[Second Hand Pat]

It does Ricardo...more practice. :D

[rickztahone]

It does Ricardo...more practice. :D

See, that is why I like interacting with you. Many would have taken offense to being told they didn't do something to the best of their ability. You take it in stride, and strive to get better. Those are the qualities of a person eager to learn :)

[Second Hand Pat]

See, that is why I like interacting with you. Many would have taken offense to being told they didn't do something to the best of their ability. You take it in stride, and strive to get better. Those are the qualities of a person eager to learn :)

I'm here to learn Ricardo. If I got all bent out of shape then I do us both a disfavor. Also if you compare the two pictures from today. I think the focus is more spot on in the second picture as the grass acts as more of a blurred frame in front of the cat. In the first picture the glass is nice and sharp.

[rickztahone]

You are correct. On the second one, the focus is spot on. The thing that hinders this photo is the underexposure due to the sun casting a shadow. This is unavoidable of course, but sometimes, shadows can be brought up and still keep a natural looking photo.

[Second Hand Pat]

I seem to like taking awkward pictures. :) Overall I do feel my pictures are getting better.

[rickztahone]

I seem to like taking awkward pictures. :) Overall I do feel my pictures are getting better.

Noticing the growth is key here because ultimately it will be you who will be the judge of what you like and what you don't like. So long as you notice a sense of progression, you are on the right path. Keep sharing :)

[Second Hand Pat]

Noticing the growth is key here because ultimately it will be you who will be the judge of what you like and what you don't like. So long as you notice a sense of progression, you are on the right path. Keep sharing :)

I think the best part is I am enjoying messing with the camera :D

[rickztahone]

I think the best part is I am enjoying messing with the camera :D

Soon enough (and this should be your goal), you will know the button layout of your camera so well that you will not need to take your eye out of the View Finder. When that happens, man o man, you start enjoying photography so much more.

[Second Hand Pat]

Soon enough (and this should be your goal), you will know the button layout of your camera so well that you will not need to take your eye out of the View Finder. When that happens, man o man, you start enjoying photography so much more.

Well, remember Paul's little exercise he tailored for me and my nikon. He was explicit that I keep my eye on the view finder. Well, I did and can change the f-stop and ISO by feel. The f-stop is pretty automatic and still have to think about the ISO, mainly it is the second button from the bottom on the back, left hand side of the camera. :D

[rickztahone]

Well, remember Paul's little exercise he tailored for me and my nikon. He was explicit that I keep my eye on the view finder. Well, I did and can change the f-stop and ISO by feel. The f-stop is pretty automatic and still have to think about the ISO, mainly it is the second button from the bottom on the back, left hand side of the camera. :D

Well there you go! Slowely but surely right?

[rickztahone]

Just look at the difference in those photos you posted just now Pat!!! The speedlight is just amazing. The detail is ridiculous! Wonderful photos. TFS

[Second Hand Pat]

Just look at the difference in those photos you posted just now Pat!!! The speedlight is just amazing. The detail is ridiculous! Wonderful photos. TFS

Thanks Ricardo, i have used the speed light before and didn't like the results. But tonight was different. :)

[Second Hand Pat]

Hey Ricardo, question for you. I really like this picture but it is worth cleaning up?

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8653/16038286401_077534b359_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qrfpMk)DSC_6515 (https://flic.kr/p/qrfpMk) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

I would say so. Want me to take a crack at it? What things would you like to do to it?

[Second Hand Pat]

You may Ricardo. If you zoom in there are several white dots which are on the glass I guess :( and I would like to remove the half fish in the lower right corner. I could send you the unaltered jpeg and I also have the RAW version which is too big to email. I may take a wag at this myself. So how would you remove little white dots. Pixel cloning?

[Second Hand Pat]

Playing with the speedlight again. In some of these I actually turned off the speedlight as it make everything too bright if that makes sense and washed out the colors.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7555/15885991570_6f0310f2ab_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qcMRQo)DSC_6556 (https://flic.kr/p/qcMRQo) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8581/16073273125_350b5cb303_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qukJ7H)DSC_6549 (https://flic.kr/p/qukJ7H) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8571/16073276075_ae50bc2288_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qukJZz)DSC_6539 (https://flic.kr/p/qukJZz) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7556/16071333941_e4eeed2a12_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/quaMEv)DSC_6540 (https://flic.kr/p/quaMEv) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

You may Ricardo. If you zoom in there are several white dots which are on the glass I guess :( and I would like to remove the half fish in the lower right corner. I could send you the unaltered jpeg and I also have the RAW version which is too big to email. I may take a wag at this myself. So how would you remove little white dots. Pixel cloning?

Sry Pat, just saw this. I will take a crack at it when I get home. Removing the half fish was my first observation as well as the reflection on glass.


Playing with the speedlight again. In some of these I actually turned off the speedlight as it make everything too bright if that makes sense and washed out the colors.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7555/15885991570_6f0310f2ab_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qcMRQo)DSC_6556 (https://flic.kr/p/qcMRQo) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8581/16073273125_350b5cb303_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qukJ7H)DSC_6549 (https://flic.kr/p/qukJ7H) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8571/16073276075_ae50bc2288_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qukJZz)DSC_6539 (https://flic.kr/p/qukJZz) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7556/16071333941_e4eeed2a12_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/quaMEv)DSC_6540 (https://flic.kr/p/quaMEv) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

I went over to your photostream and can tell you that your main problem is that your flash is too apparent. There a couple of things you can do. The first, and typically what I would do, is to actually not use a flash, but to use a tripod. I suggest this because with flash, it is more difficult to get the "Christmas" atmosphere. You have to be able to use speedlight off camera, diffused and very subtle to pull off.

6556 is one of my favorites here. The flash actually brings definition to the outline of the object here. The colors look a little washed out, but you can probably recoer some by wb adjustment and vibrance.

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, where would you position the speedlight in relation to the camera and/or subject?...or perhaps something to play with. I like 6556 also.

[rickztahone]

Ricardo, where would you position the speedlight in relation to the camera and/or subject?...or perhaps something to play with. I like 6556 also.

It really depends on a shot to shot basis as well as what your end goal with the subject is.

For instance, 6549, I would have first isolated the subject so there isn't distracting elements, like the wires from the christmas lights and I would have moved it forward a bit, or rather moved it completly to a seperate location. Reason being is that the cup itself is creating a shadow because of the head on flash. I would have shot this cup from a top left position shotting down on a 45 degree angle. I would also have shot it with a second speedlight (I know this isn't available to you currently) with a snoot and directed it right behind the cup to define the outline of the shape.

What you are in desperate need of is a modifier. This reduces your harsh shadows. Check online, there are many DIY approaches to do this.

If you'd like to spend a bit of money and go with a cheap softbox, check out This one (http://www.amazon.com/Fotodiox-Softbox-Speedlight-Speedlite-Panasonica/dp/B00DBB7Q02/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1419197344&sr=8-2&keywords=speedlight+softbox). From the description I can not tell if this comes with the bracket, but from the reviews, I believe it does. If so, then it makes this a killer deal. I have paid $40 for just the bracket in the past. I have like 3 now I believe when I do onsight shooting. They are easy to transport.

[Second Hand Pat]

Hehe, I can get that before x-mas :D By bracket are you referring to the mount point for the speed light?

[rickztahone]

If you notice on that item I listed, the last picture shows the bracket. This bracket is needed to hold the actual umbrella in place as well as the connection point for the tripod. Try to contact seller to see if it is included, again, if it is, then it is a really good deal. The cold shoe is something I never use. I simply have my trigger directly screwed in to the screw knob you see in the pic. Also, I will download the file you have on Flickr for the editing. I may need the raw or larger file though. Do you have dropbox?

[rickztahone]

Here you go Pat. Its uploaded through photobucket so quality takes a hit.
http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o387/simplydiscus1/Rick%20Edited%20pics%20for%20members/PatsAngelGroup_zpsfd37fa43.jpg (http://s341.photobucket.com/user/simplydiscus1/media/Rick%20Edited%20pics%20for%20members/PatsAngelGroup_zpsfd37fa43.jpg.html)

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8653/16038286401_077534b359_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qrfpMk)DSC_6515 (https://flic.kr/p/qrfpMk) by phusband56 (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
and before to compare

[Second Hand Pat]

I like the results of your edits Ricardo. I see you copied part of the background to remove the fish (right?) and not sure how you removed the scratches. I do have dropbox and will grab the raw file next time I have the camera attached to the computer.

On the shoebox are you referring to the five pictures to the left of the main item picture? or is this the bracket http://www.amazon.com/Fancierstudio-Bracket-Swivel-Umbrella-Tilting/dp/B003TYDBYQ/ref=pd_bxgy_p_text_y?

[rickztahone]

I like the results of your edits Ricardo. I see you copied part of the background to remove the fish (right?) and not sure how you removed the scratches. I do have dropbox and will grab the raw file next time I have the camera attached to the computer.

On the shoebox are you referring to the five pictures to the left of the main item picture? or is this the bracket http://www.amazon.com/Fancierstudio-Bracket-Swivel-Umbrella-Tilting/dp/B003TYDBYQ/ref=pd_bxgy_p_text_y?

No, that is a straight up umbrella and flash bracket. The whole bracket needed for that softbox is called a Bowens S mount bracket (http://www.amazon.com/Speedlite-Bracket-Adapter-Holder-Softbox/dp/B00DATYL4Y/ref=sr_1_54?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1419291920&sr=1-54&keywords=s+mount+bowens) but there are a whole bunch of them. So, if that is a whole "kit", then that is a much better choice because you know they go with each other, if that makes sense. Shoot the seller an email and see what they say.

[rickztahone]

Pat, keep in mind that a softbox will not improve aquarium shots that much, if at all. I tend to go bare bulb on aquarium shots and shoot at the ceiling directly, or even bare speedlight over the aquarium itself. Shooting from the sides will always cause some kind of glare or shadows that aren't that desirable. So, if you are getting these things for that, then I may suggest getting another cheap flash, or trigger system. If you do plan on broadening your photography, then a softbox is a great tool to have at your disposal. Just FYI

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, I see how the softbox is rather useless for aquarium shots unless you place the softbox over the speedlight where both are sitting on top of the tank and have the speedlight pointed up into the softbox allowing the light to be reflected back into the tank. Not sure if this will work. Also I am the only one who takes pictures at family event so see the softbox useful for that. Anyway it will be here tomorrow.

Also I will send you a link tomorrow to the raw file of that picture if you wish to mess with it or after Christmas if fine to as there is not rush.

[rickztahone]

Ricardo, I see how the softbox is rather useless for aquarium shots unless you place the softbox over the speedlight where both are sitting on top of the tank and have the speedlight pointed up into the softbox allowing the light to be reflected back into the tank. Not sure if this will work. Also I am the only one who takes pictures at family event so see the softbox useful for that. Anyway it will be here tomorrow.

Also I will send you a link tomorrow to the raw file of that picture if you wish to mess with it or after Christmas if fine to as there is not rush.

did you get the one that I linked to initially? I really hope it comes with the bracket.

[Second Hand Pat]

Yup :D

[rickztahone]

Great. Right on Christmas eve, what a treat. Do you have a tripod? You will need a tripod with a screw connection in order to mount the bracket. The one that comes with the bracket has two sizes. You can remove the silver piece by turning the thumb screw and flip the screw receptor part for another sized screw as well, just in case. Once you have everything set up, try these setting:

Manual on the camera: this is almost a must in off shoe photography
ISO 100-200
Shutter speed 1/60 (for starters. If the ambient light is too bright, turn it up)
Apeture f/8

Apeture and SS work seperately in these situations. Apeture controls the actual exposure of your subject. The shutter speed controls the ambient light let in.

If your subject is too bright you can do a few things, turn down the flash (which should also be on manual, unless you trust TTL and exposure compensation), move the flash back, or stop down apeture.

You will want to keep your subjects really close to the softbox to create nicer even shadows. The further away you place the softbox, the more defined the shadows will get.

I will leave you with just those tips for now as to not overwhelm you.

[Discus-n00b]

Speaking of tripods I'm considering dropping some dough on a nice one and a nice ball head. Have a bunch of cheap ones, thinking of getting one to last a lifetime basically and something more sturdy. That and to hold all of the new weight I acquired yesterday with my star tracker lol. I'm just so bad about pulling the trigger even though I know it will eventually happen, maybe I'll sleep on it a night haha.

[rickztahone]

Matt, I suggest a tripod with no center column. The column adds unnecessary instability. I've had a really right stuff bh40 and it unfortunately failed on me a few months ago. To this day I can't recreate the fail and may have been a user error, but I swear I remember correctly locking it down. I haven't researched ball heads in a while so not sure if there are any new ones out.

[Discus-n00b]

Weird, I was actually looking at a RRS combo with the BH40, I know they reworked them fairly recently not sure if you had the earlier model or the new one. Was it the ball part that failed and dropped the cam or was it the plate/clamp on top? I was also looking at no center column. Just ball head directly to the apex (leveling base later). And Carbon Fiber, never owned a CF tripod before. I just figure with thousands of dollars worth of gear sitting on top of it, it may be one of the best investments I make.

[rickztahone]

I'm really not sure which part failed on me. I've tried to recreate the fail on top of my bed with no success lol. Freak accident I suppose. I dropped my A99 w/grip & Sony 70-200 and external mic. My heart stopped that day. Since that day I find it difficult to recommend the ball head but still do because I can't rule user error out of the equation

[Second Hand Pat]

So the softbox arrived today and I put it together but think it needs a dedicated stand vs using a tripod. I sent a email to fotodiox asking about this. I think this is the stand I need but I surely do not need two of them http://www.amazon.com/Fotodiox-Cushion-Carrying-Lighting-Fixtures/dp/B008BBVLG2/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1419718092&sr=1-3&keywords=fotodiox+softbox+stand.

[brewmaster15]

Speaking of tripods I'm considering dropping some dough on a nice one and a nice ball head. Have a bunch of cheap ones, thinking of getting one to last a lifetime basically and something more sturdy. That and to hold all of the new weight I acquired yesterday with my star tracker lol. I'm just so bad about pulling the trigger even though I know it will eventually happen, maybe I'll sleep on it a night haha.


I have several tripods that I use and most really tend to be beefier than most would need as I am usually shooting wildlife and birds.. I need maximum stability

This is my tank...
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/554073-REG/Manfrotto_058B_058B_Aluminum_Studio_Pro.html

with
https://www.keh.com/347165/tripods-bogen-3038-ball-head

Its overkill for most of my lens... but its really rock solid. Yes I actually hike around with it a bit.

al

[brewmaster15]

For my long Hikes..I settled on a vanguard Tracker tripod and ball head which I have really found to be compact enough and light enough to hike with and still be stable for all but my biggest lens...

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=bl_sr_photo?ie=UTF8&field-brandtextbin=Vanguard&node=502394

This ball head... http://www.amazon.com/Vanguard-SBH-250-Magnesium-Ballhead-Sliding/dp/B003BQ71MA/ref=sr_1_20?s=photo&ie=UTF8&qid=1419725948&sr=1-20

is excellent for its price..

The legs I use are from the Tracker LT-32 and very good build. Not sure they make this model any more, as its been a few years now.. but its great as it collapses down to just over 2 feet. The Vanguard equipment is a really good buy for some good equipment.

I have their heavy duty monopod as well with the same SBH-250 ball head.... very useful piece of equipment!

I've been using this now a few years as my main set up.


The Bogen /manfrottos in the previous post, those I Have had over a decade now it perfect craftsmanship and durability.

[Discus-n00b]

13.5lbs folded weight, whew Al I hope you didn't hike to many times with that haha. That's why I was looking into Carbon Fiber. I'd like to start taking some actual trips out for landscapes and such, and the benefits of CF are hard to beat for that. Especially backpacking. Definitely more expensive though. The one I'm looking at is a 40lb load rating, folds to 2ft, and weighs just a hair over 3lbs. I could get smaller fold length but not sure I want to go 4 leg sections. The 3 sections just seem beefier. I have a few other cheaper tripods, aluminum, they work fine for camera/lens but just looking for something a bit more. A more advanced tripod I guess, its probably past due.

I love Manfrotto brand and similar, but I'm really liking what I'm reading on Really Right Stuff. Its expensive but its 100% USA made, better service (from what I read....at least for US customers), and a quality product.

[brewmaster15]

The one I'm looking at is a 40lb load rating, folds to 2ft, and weighs just a hair over 3lbs That does make it easier to carry more gear! When I bought the vanguard I really wanted to go carbon, but had to compromise. Used to be camera gear was all I bought...then I had Kids... love them immensely, but they definetly put a dent in the gear budget!

I spend alot of time out hiking with my gear... One thing I can tell you is for hiking the tripod weight is important but don't overlook the backpack... you want a really good fitting high quality backpack...one with room to spare for gear, clothes, and photo stuff. I have several packs that I rotate depending on where I will go and what I do. On a long hike a good monopod is often your best friend, so I always have one strapped to my pack... they make excellent walking stick in pinch!

Instead of carbon , I opted to get a decent metal pod, and splurge on the packs.... not that I would not love a good carbon tripod mind you.;) Now my money goes to fencing gear for my son and music lessons for each! That fencing gear just soaked me $400 for equipment!


That heavy duty tripod is great for car based photography, but its luggable.:) Tell you what.. theres no beating it on a windy day!

-al

[rickztahone]

Pat, I looked back to my post and unfortunately I asked you if you already had a tripod. I meant to ask you if you had a light stand which is what you need to make these setups work. You can find a lot of these light stands for rather cheap. I get them locally for around $20 each and have at least 8 stands lying around at any given time. Try not to go really cheap on them as they do matter, but not enough to go super high end. Here is one on Amazon as an example: Here (http://www.amazon.com/Cowboy-Studio-Quality-Aluminum-Adjustable/dp/B003PEUA30/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1419783661&sr=8-1&keywords=light+stand)

[Second Hand Pat]

I have one sitting in my cart on amazon Ricardo and I understand why you do not want to go low end on these...stability manners.

[rickztahone]

I have one sitting in my cart on amazon Ricardo and I understand why you do not want to go low end on these...stability manners.

yes, manners are great, but they also "matter" ;)

Most of these light stands are exactly the same one just rebranded. They all are chinese made stands which is why I say to not break the bank with these. Even the cheap ones serve their job well.

I also have some more heavy duty ones, and weights for stands if I go on location to do a shoot. Spending a little more on these is a must because they tend to be a bit beefier. Once again, sorry for not being clear, I'm sure it would have been so much easier to have the tripod in the cart the first time around :(

[Second Hand Pat]

Well, I actually have a couple of tripods and my handy hubby is building a way to mount the softbox into the tripod so we shall see how that works. lol.

[rickztahone]

Well, I actually have a couple of tripods and my handy hubby is building a way to mount the softbox into the tripod so we shall see how that works. lol.

I actually have done that as well, I will save you trouble and tell you it is inconvenient, lol. Just spring for the light stand or if you have to use it now, make your husband it hold the whole rig, lol.

[Second Hand Pat]

I actually have done that as well, I will save you trouble and tell you it is inconvenient, lol. Just spring for the light stand or if you have to use it now, make your husband it hold the whole rig, lol.

He volunteered for that and his idea and implementation worked but all you need to do is move one of the legs a bit and the whole thing will come crashing down.

[Second Hand Pat]

I played with the speedlight and the tefe's this afternoon. I have gotten way more picky on the pictures I am keeping. Also finding it is crazy hard to focus in a moving target.

[Discus-n00b]

Thats how it goes Pat! I probably never post 1% of the pictures I actually take even though they would be decent pictures for most.

[Second Hand Pat]

Thats how it goes Pat! I probably never post 1% of the pictures I actually take even though they would be decent pictures for most.

Thank Matt, just a little rant. :D

[rickztahone]

Thats how it goes Pat! I probably never post 1% of the pictures I actually take even though they would be decent pictures for most.
I think you mean you only post about 1% of your photos. ;-)


Thank Matt, just a little rant. :D

It is a rant that many photographers make as they progress in the hobby. My success rate has actually gone up over the years, but I am a lot more selective of my shutter pressing now-a-days. So, win all around.

[Discus-n00b]

I probably don't even make that 1% mark is what I was trying to say lol. However like you I'm more selective with what even makes it past the LCD screen on my camera these days.

[Second Hand Pat]

OK, more butterfly pictures. The first one is my least favorite

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8603/15973236719_9c7c4d4cf2_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qkv1M6)DSC_6806 (https://flic.kr/p/qkv1M6) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7570/16157406021_b6f706a1cf_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qBLVTT)DSC_6809 (https://flic.kr/p/qBLVTT) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7572/15973536407_ddf1d36429_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qkwxS8)DSC_6811 (https://flic.kr/p/qkwxS8) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

Best of the lot I think

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8665/15973231579_751311cc85_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qkuZft)DSC_6818 (https://flic.kr/p/qkuZft) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[brewmaster15]

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8665/15973231579_751311cc85_c.jpg

Thats a keeper.

[Second Hand Pat]

I think so to Al. :D

[rickztahone]

6818 is the best for a few key reasons.

1- It is better exposed than the others
2- It has a sense of symmetry
3- It is one of the sharpest.

As you start photographing more, and you start reading up more on photography "rules", you will find that the rules are there as a guide, but in turn make photographs look more pleasing (in most instances, but not all).

For instance, in this shot, a square crop does not do much for these subjects. It places them squarely in the middle of the frame, another rule you typically do not want to break.

Had I taken or edited this shot, I would have left the format in its original aspect ratio (typically the best ratio to keep photos at, even when scaling down).

I would have photographed the scence so that the butterflies were on the top left section of the frame.

This would have caused the butterflies to make a leading line through the frame. Leading lines are a bit difficult to explain with subjects as subtle as this, but picture a picture of a landscape. Now picture an old log that has good features in the forefront. This log, if placed correctly, can become an integral part of the composition of the overall frame because it leads the viewer in to the frame in a pleasing manner.

It really all roots down to composition. I would suggest reading up on the subject and many of the things I'm saying will start to make a little more sense.

Again, these rules are there more as guidelines than actual rules in the traditional sense. I break them all the time, however, I knowingly break them when I have to for either a more creative shot, or an out of the ordinary shot.

At the end of the day, this is a great shot, but, it could have been even better. That is what I am tring to say with this post :)

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, here's the original and yes, I have not really read up on the rules or guidelines. I will in time.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8645/15972824280_aa0dd3cc57_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qksUb5)DSC_6818 (https://flic.kr/p/qksUb5) by phusband56 (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

Oh yeah, there is a much better shot there. With an original aspect ratio crop, you would get a better composition. You would crop from the top left corner. You would basically cut out part of the left and top corner proportionally. This of course would leave the weird right branch(?) on the right hand side which I would clone if it was my shot.

Notice that this shot makes it so that your subject is almost blended in to your background. There are small things you can do to make them pop just a little more. You can add some contrast and sharpen a bit. In shots where your subject is relatively blended in, you never really want to do B&W. Just for future reference.

[Second Hand Pat]

A bit better

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7503/16160957595_df42e66cf5_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qC68DV)DSC_6818 - Copy (https://flic.kr/p/qC68DV) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

You are starting to get it :). Ideally, we would love a subject who doesn't blend in as much to the background. On the field, the only thing I can think of that would help them pop more would be to use flash with a snoot and shooting wide open so that everything else is blurred out, but that is just a thought, and no guarantee that it would help draw your eye to it. Keep this in mind, your photos should always have somewhere where your eye is drawn to. Almost always, this item is your main subject. At least it should be. Your eye should be able to roll over the shot without fully stopping on anything else but the main subject. If it does, there is a chance that the item is a disturbance and distraction to the overall shot.

Again, this is a general "rule" (guideline)

[Second Hand Pat]

Thanks Ricardo :D

[Discus-n00b]

I'd like to say I was ringing in the new year at some crazy bash but no....I was outside in 32F alone taking pictures #nerd LOL Was looking for comet Lovejoy, just really difficult to capture when its this close to a bright moon and with the equipment I have. I cannot WAIT to get my star tracker up and running. I think tonight is pushing me over the edge for that new tripod. The aluminum no name brand tripod works great indoors and for general purpose, but it was shaking like crazy tonight and thats the worst with stars. Problem is my wishlist is longer than just a tripod. I'd love to pickup something around a 16-25mm 2.8 or maybe even a 24mm 1.4? I want something really fast. Can santa come back?? At any rate heres one I got before the clouds ran me off. Moon just kills everything. New moon comes in Jan 20-21 so i'm hoping the weather is good.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7581/16136353956_1c1b3be49d_o.jpg

[rickztahone]

Matt, oddly enough, I was just having this conversation with a friend that only does astrophotography. I really never saw the need for a 24 1.4, but after reviewing his needs, we figured that this lens would be perfect for his needs. It allows you to shoot wide open, keep your shutter speed in check so you don't get motion blur from the rotation and you do not have to push your ISO so high

[brewmaster15]

As you start photographing more, and you start reading up more on photography "rules", you will find that the rules are there as a guide, but in turn make photographs look more pleasing (in most instances, but not all).

For instance, in this shot, a square crop does not do much for these subjects. It places them squarely in the middle of the frame, another rule you typically do not want to break.

Had I taken or edited this shot, I would have left the format in its original aspect ratio (typically the best ratio to keep photos at, even when scaling down).

I would have photographed the scence so that the butterflies were on the top left section of the frame.

This would have caused the butterflies to make a leading line through the frame. Leading lines are a bit difficult to explain with subjects as subtle as this, but picture a picture of a landscape. Now picture an old log that has good features in the forefront. This log, if placed correctly, can become an integral part of the composition of the overall frame because it leads the viewer in to the frame in a pleasing manner.

It really all roots down to composition. I would suggest reading up on the subject and many of the things I'm saying will start to make a little more sense.

Just an add on note on this Ricardo, and I hope you don't take it the wrong way. What you said here is absolutely 100% true... For some kinds of photography.But there are many types of photography. You have to keep the goal of the picture in mind. If the picture is art , I absolutely agree with you. But not all pictures are Art. Some pictures are documentary, scientific,Portrait or, marketing and advertising, detail oriented. It depends on the goal of the photographer. Coming from a science and Biology background, I spent a decade documenting lab experiments, microscope images, and procedures as well as out and about. I have taken many picture to document things as well as for aesthetics.

Just want to clarify that as the photographer, you have to decide what you are attempting to convey. Hope that makes sense to everyone.

al

[brewmaster15]

I'd like to say I was ringing in the new year at some crazy bash but no....I was outside in 32F alone taking pictures #nerd LOL Was looking for comet Lovejoy, just really difficult to capture when its this close to a bright moon and with the equipment I have. I cannot WAIT to get my star tracker up and running. I think tonight is pushing me over the edge for that new tripod. The aluminum no name brand tripod works great indoors and for general purpose, but it was shaking like crazy tonight and thats the worst with stars. Problem is my wishlist is longer than just a tripod. I'd love to pickup something around a 16-25mm 2.8 or maybe even a 24mm 1.4? I want something really fast. Can santa come back?? At any rate heres one I got before the clouds ran me off. Moon just kills everything. New moon comes in Jan 20-21 so i'm hoping the weather is good.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7581/16136353956_1c1b3be49d_o.jpg

Matt, The stars may have been the goal here.. but the moon illuminating the trees looks awesome to me. I really like the siloette of the branches and the stars are not too washed out by its light.

Sometimes we shoot for one thing and it just doesn't work out, however,you can still end up with a great photo.

If you ever get the chance... visit the Everglades National park in Dec-Feb.. go all the way to "flamingo" at the tip. The days you will be have a thousand birds to photograph, and scenery that will blow your mind, but the nights. They are something special.. no light pollution there.. Just broad skys above...its amazing. If you do go, visit 9 mile pond at night. Park in the lot, turn on the headlights facing the water... then walk down to the pond, your camera will be greeted by hundreds of pairs of red eyes...alligators. Like stars. I didn't have the opportunity to photo it yet but it will be something special when I do.

al

[rickztahone]

That makes perfect sense Al. Thanks for adding that.

[Discus-n00b]

Heres one from that same night. Clouds and fog started to roll in, along with firework smoke. Created some really strange colors going on. I haven't touched the colors on this at all in photoshop. Would of been a good shot around Halloween.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8619/16004522777_ab580f244a_b.jpg

Sometimes I feel like I will never complete my wish list for this hobby lol. Either I want a lens, or a slider, or a new tripod, ND filters....its always something and never enough money in the budget. I'm sure you've all felt the same before.

[brewmaster15]

I like the red green scheme.. but I think cropped like this would be cool too...


http://forum.simplydiscus.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84407&d=1420383705



Sometimes I feel like I will never complete my wish list for this hobby lol. Either I want a lens, or a slider, or a new tripod, ND filters....its always something and never enough money in the budget. I'm sure you've all felt the same before. Tell me about it, I have my had my eye on a a pentax 100 mm wr macro lens and a New Body the K3 now for awhile. combined they will run me a little over $1700-1800 . maybe a little less if I catch a sale...I might be able to swing one or the other if we eat hot dogs and beans, and boxed mac and cheese for the next few months.Lol. I could also sell some of my other gear, but I really hate doing that..For me the the hobby is more than the picture...its the gear itself.,,silly I know.
al

[rickztahone]

...
Sometimes I feel like I will never complete my wish list for this hobby lol. Either I want a lens, or a slider, or a new tripod, ND filters....its always something and never enough money in the budget. I'm sure you've all felt the same before.

I've never felt this way before, ever, lol.

[Second Hand Pat]

You guys are scaring me with the wish list thing...but I already want a macro lens.

Al, I like the cropping on Matt's picture. It gives the picture one focal point vs two.

[Discus-n00b]

I'm the same way Al, I don't want to eat hot dogs for months....and I don't even have growing kids to feed! Its definitely a more expensive hobby than fish IMO. The dolly/slider I want runs upwards of a grand, good prime lenses will be upwards of a grand (A decent macro can probably be found for a cool $300-500), tripod and ballhead I'm looking at is close to that. Theres more on the list too thats the stuff I want the most though. I'd love to find a glidecam or stabilizer at some point as well. Its pretty crazy. Luckily the GoPro4 Black got crossed off the list at christmas. I try to limit it to about 1 large photography purchase a year, use some of the christmas bonus to help out. Then comes the problem of, what do I need/want first lol. A fish or coral order would be easy pennies compared to an order from B&H haha.

I don't crop photos like these often, what you see is what came out of the camera. I'll crop fish pics occasionally. I was originally pointing at the road to try and capture cars going down the road with those colors. To get the light streaks. It was one of those drop down to the road real quick and shoot because there is a car coming. Didn't turn out as well as I hoped, car lights are to bright in this one and I was only on a 5 sec shutter I believe (for the sky) when I needed more to let the car fully pass.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8577/16009737850_ecb6ec0e24_b.jpg

[rickztahone]

You guys are scaring me with the wish list thing...but I already want a macro lens.

Al, I like the cropping on Matt's picture. It gives the picture one focal point vs two.

Pat, to give you an idea of my wishlist, even though I have a bunch of equipment already, my list still remains long:

-a second a99 ($2,000) as a backup to replace my a77 backup. I'd rather have 2 full frame bodies rather than 1 and 1.
-Lenses - I still need a Carl Zeiss 135 1.8 ($1,800), upgrade my Sigma 24-70 for a CZ one (another $2,000), Sony 16-35 (another $2,000). I have lenses that cover these focal lengths, but I have noticed that while on the job, the zooms serve a better all around purpose, although I love shooting with primes. These paid jobs have shifted my liking of primes over zooms to incorporate more zooms in my lineup. Which means $$$
-Would love a better ND Filter system better than my square slide in ones from HiTech 3 stacks $200
-Strobe upgrades, this is where the money is at as well, I currently use speedlights to do on the go paid shoots, but I would love to buy a couple of strobes for the home studio. Einstein E640's with modifiers, close to $1500. Luckily these come with the nice digital flash meter, so that eliminates an additional part I must have.

That is only the surface of my list. As you can see, you can easily run up a good amount of money :)

[Discus-n00b]

Do you use the 4x5" ND filters Ricardo? Do you not like them?

My list goes something like this, keep in mind I'm trying to get a bit into video/timelapse as well.
Dynamic Perception dolly system - $1400-1700
24mm F/1.4 - $1600 (Maybe $549 if I go off brand which are still good and probably what I'll do)
16-35mm f/2.8 - $1700
I'd like something around 200mm f/2.8 - $800
Carbon fiber tripod + ballhead + plates - $1200
Glidecam - ~$500
New computer (Photo and video storage/editing in mind) - PC rebuild would be $1500-2000, Mac Laptop - $2000 at least

And like Ricardo thats just scratching the surface, still want filters, and other small accessories. LOL looks like hot dogs for dayssssssssssss!

[brewmaster15]

MATT..Re:B&Hphoto
Do you hate getting that thick catalogue in the mail too? Its torture!
al

[Discus-n00b]

Always Al, I'll throw it right in the recycle.....but then I just look at it all online so its really no help.

[rickztahone]

MATT..Re:B&Hphoto
Do you hate getting that thick catalogue in the mail too? Its torture!
al


Always Al, I'll throw it right in the recycle.....but then I just look at it all online so its really no help.

haha. I flip through that at work and my wish list keeps growing....

Matt, that is a nice wishlist.

I had the HiTech 90 I believe they were called. Had them for a few years, but realized that I didn't use them as much because the distance from the lens, to the holder, to the glass was enough to allow ghosting in some shots in landscapes. They react harshly to sunlight, whether in or out of frame. Additionally, when you stack them with 3 to get the most stopping power, you get a color cast that is difficult to correct. It can be corrected to look almost natural, but not quite.

Keep in mind, this was my first venture in to ND photography, and lanscape shots aren't my speciality, so I couldn't justify the high price tag of an expensive system. However, now that I have had the cheaper system (under $100 including holder), I believe my next move will be towards one similar to this:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/752927-REG/B_W_1066177_77mm_110_Solid_Neutral.html

and I plan on getting stepping rings to go down from the largest size down so as to only have one screw on filter:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/11688-REG/B_W_65041214_72mm_to_77mm_Step_Up.html

Now that I realize it though, my largest diameter lens is 82, so my ND filter is going to be even more expensive :(

[Discus-n00b]

Yeah. I have one of those Lee filter holders with a 4x4 polarizer and I was going to get some of their 4x4 ND filters. Was just curious.

[Discus-n00b]

I'm currently shopping. Heading out west Jan 22, we have a job out in San Francisco and I'm part of the 2 man team driving a van with our important equipment across country to the show and back (cheaper than shipping freight costs or rental fees). Looking forward to it because the furthest west I've driven was Austin for NADA. Been to NM and interior Cali so looking forward to this trip, see a bit of the country and mark some more states off my list. Can you believe I've never seen the Pacific ocean while in CONUS? First and only time I saw it was in Costa Rica. Not sure if we'll get much time to sightsee other than what we see along the way, hope to hit Grand Canyon on the way back. Anyway, I figure its a perfect opportunity to buy the ND kit I've been wanting, just in case. Will probably be buying that tripod as well. Almost got sucked into buying a lens today as Canon updated their refurb site with KILLER deals, but they are a hot commodity and flew off the shelves. Probably for the best. I figure a nice new sturdy tripod and a set of ND filters will check a few boxes off the wish list.

Ricardo, currently until Jan 31 http://www.2filter.com/ has 10% with code NEWYEAR2015. Might be a good idea to look at filters now, that's why I'm jumping. I'll be saving around $50 compared to BH. 3 soft GND (.3-.9) and a Lee Big Stopper plus some other odds and ends I need. And I believe they are an authorized B+W dealer.

[rickztahone]

Thanks Matt for the link. The one I was actually looking at is a bit more expensive there than the one on B&H. Regardless, I am strapped for cash right now. I just messed up my bumper earlier today going to work and now have to fix that :(

[Second Hand Pat]

You guys really like the pictures? I felt the focus was better and lighting are really good.

[rickztahone]

Yes, much better. However, try to keep in mind that the best shots of discus is when they are swimming towards you, not away. A few could have been improved by better timing. Settings-wise though, spot on.

[Discus-n00b]

Agree. I really do like them as well. Love the lighting in them. What were the approx settings there? Seems like you captured a good bit of tank lighting as well and not just the speedlight. Or maybe you just have the flash dialed in perfectly.

[Second Hand Pat]

Matt, you want the camera settings or speed light settings?

[rickztahone]

The best ones are 6967 & 6940, although i'm not sure what that black dot is on the top fin.

Matt, her ISO helped her get less strobe power going and the somewhat slower shutter speed let in a little more ambient lighting 1/60. f/4 was a good f/stop Pat, but I believe 5.6 or even f/8 would have nailed the super sharp focus. Although, you would have to crank up the ISO even more. Not very noisy files though considering you were close to 1000

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, the ISO was set at 640. I will play with the fstop next time.

[rickztahone]

Ricardo, the ISO was set at 640. I will play with the fstop next time.

I actually think you did extremely well here. Only thing I think would have helped would have been the timing. Again, you typically want the discus to be showing his head swimming towards you but at an angle so you can see the side of the discus. I hope that makes sense. Kind of like the main discus on your avatar.

[Second Hand Pat]

Well, remember Al mentioning taking pictures for different reasons, these pics are reference pictures to show a point in the development of the fish.

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo and Matt, thanks for the encouraging words. You guys are really helping me along on this journey. :D
Pat

[rickztahone]

Pat, after having gone through your own little practice corner, how do you feel about making this take the place of flash photography section?

Or, do you think it would be better to just approach each member with their own set of practice points so it is more catered to their individual needs?

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, best to tailor each practice thread to the member I think.

[rickztahone]

Got it. Keep in mind, the practice we can run is very limiting for a few reasons, but the main one is gear. However, going through aperture stops, and shutter speed priority and ISO bouncing is the only 3 I can think of to incorporate in to a practice session. Then you get in to the more specialized shooting conditions.

[Second Hand Pat]

For more specialized shooting perhaps best to recommend a photography forum beyond aquarium fish that is.

[Second Hand Pat]

OK, using a few of yours and Matt suggests from yesterday.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8584/15668471344_7e03501f47_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pSz1DE)DSC_7009 (https://flic.kr/p/pSz1DE) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7529/16290056562_32769f0cbc_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qPuNhb)DSC_7005 (https://flic.kr/p/qPuNhb) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8672/16104761579_1a7c43a7ab_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qx87x6)DSC_7000 (https://flic.kr/p/qx87x6) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

LOVE this shot:
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8672/16104761579_1a7c43a7ab.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/photos/129594174@N08/16104761579/)
DSC_7000 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/129594174@N08/16104761579/) by phusband56 (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[Second Hand Pat]

Thanks Ricardo, I really like this little angel. It is a wild Xingu angelfish. Note that the fstop of f8 and ISO is 800. The focus seems spot on to me and the pics are not grainy.

[rickztahone]

Agreed. Noise isn't a problem at all here. I'm surprised you got to f/8. You were flashing?

[Second Hand Pat]

Agreed. Noise isn't a problem at all here. I'm surprised you got to f/8. You were flashing

Yes, with a speed light. Have to play with placement to avoid shadows

[rickztahone]

Oddly enough, I would consider your shots better than my shots because yours can actually pass off as natural light. They are really great and you should be proud of them.

[Second Hand Pat]

Oddly enough, I would consider your shots better than my shots because yours can actually pass off as natural light. They are really great and you should be proud of them.

Oh wow Ricardo, thanks :D

[Second Hand Pat]

Ready for some more cat pics Ricardo :)

[Second Hand Pat]

My goals today was to work on composition and getting the focus where I wanted it which was on the face of the cat.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8572/16180878259_4760d97cfb_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qDRenD)DSC_7135 (https://flic.kr/p/qDRenD) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7334/16365366471_f9c25bce53_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qW9MhT)DSC_7145 (https://flic.kr/p/qW9MhT) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8562/16179699430_b090ba145a_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qDKbX1)DSC_7149 (https://flic.kr/p/qDKbX1) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

I lighten this one up a bit.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7446/16179453278_6085a822af_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qDHVM1)DSC_7166 (https://flic.kr/p/qDHVM1) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[Second Hand Pat]

Not to sure about these. The green weed in the foreground distracts.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7337/16180863139_66c713651c_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qDR9SX)DSC_7175 (https://flic.kr/p/qDR9SX) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7318/16180861509_97a97ff170_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qDR9oR)DSC_7176 (https://flic.kr/p/qDR9oR) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

Cat looks annoyed in this one
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8680/16367070215_93230bb827_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qWivKM)DSC_7178 (https://flic.kr/p/qWivKM) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

Bring 'em :)

edit: I need to stop replying without checking page numbers! lol

[rickztahone]

You are correct, the green weed is a distraction, but like I mentioned to you in the tortoise shots, sometimes you can't account for the environment, and it is better to shoot as is, then not at all.

With that being said, there are 2 that I like more than the others. 7176 because of the format that you chose to display it at. The angle, the subjects gaze and the composition of its head is good. My other pic would have to be 7145. Harsh sun, but nothing blown out in the highlights. The white area behind the subject is a bit distracting and I'm glad you didn't go for the lower vantage point, because it would have been a lot more distracting. I like that this almost feels like a candid.

With that in mind, I am a fan of candid shots, I am also a fan of subject connection with the photographer, but, with candids, there is a fine line between an interesting candid, and a shot that should have been binned. Within your series, not just this one, I would encourage you to be more selective of your shots. You are getting more comfortable with the camera now, and you need to start developing your photographic eye. In order to do this, you need to have forethought when you photograph, and if you have similar shots, chose one to display. This will save you a ton of time later in your photography career by training early on. Do not get me wrong though, the "non-displayable" shots still need to be taken, because without them, you won't know what makes one a keeper, and what doesn't. However, you have been on a fast pace in your training, and you are progressing nicely, and I want you to have that in the back of your head when you are shooting.

For instance, 7175 could have been scrapped because it is so similar with 7176. 7176 is clearly the winner here for the reasons I described above. Same goes for 7178. You could have kept 7178 and simply cropped off like you did with 7176 and it would look like exactly the same shot. So, in the future, try to move around more, and offer different perspective. Try something you've never tried before, say like, pushing your camera so close to the cat, and having the sky as the background. Think outside of the box, and see what shots you like. Soon, you will start developing a style all of your own and you can start molding your craft.

Once again, I tell you all of these things to encourage you because I see so much potential in you ;)

[Second Hand Pat]

Thanks Ricardo, I went to take pictures of something else and the cat decided it was his turn. I sort of take advantage of opportunities so this was one of them. I did "sort of" try and plan the shots as much at the cat would cooperate. It become a little difficult to move when you are flat on your tummy.

Also what I am seeing with each of these little photo opts is your comments seem to be getting more "big picture" which is pretty cool I think. :)

[rickztahone]

I'm glad you see it that way Pat. I will take you on a journey through our Assignments agenda over at Dyxum. This will cover:

Basic Assignments:
Rule of Thirds and Golden Mean
Leading Lines
Foreground Interest
Perspective
Shape/outline Silhouette
Use of Fill-in Flash

Intermediate Assignments:
High Key
Low Key
Softness
Primary Colour
Symmetry
Pattern
Texture

We go on to more advanced assignments as well. On Dyxum, you can not progress to the next stage unless your assignment submission is approved by one of us mods. We will focus on the Rule of thirds first ;)

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, check your inbox.

[rickztahone]

Ricardo, check your inbox.

;)

[Second Hand Pat]

A rough application of the rules of thirds.

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, a few from tonight. Focusing is becoming second nature. Trick tonight was speed light position.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8677/16630430785_848643b71e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/rkziFg)DSC_7654 (https://flic.kr/p/rkziFg) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8570/16444639719_b0fb16c4d5_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/r4a5t2)DSC_7648 (https://flic.kr/p/r4a5t2) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

The white dots are bubbles from the HOB filter
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8683/16604474186_7851e4fe29_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/rihgFG)DSC_7642 (https://flic.kr/p/rihgFG) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8600/16629350021_569892444e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/rktLpp)DSC_7629 (https://flic.kr/p/rktLpp) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8618/16443287458_98dbe1ee18_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/r439ub)DSC_7611 (https://flic.kr/p/r439ub) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[Discus-n00b]

Looking good Pat. I personally find the first most pleasing as far as balanced light goes, however if you've ever seen my photos I'm a big fan of that dramatic sharper light like your third pic. Washes out the color just a bit, but I "cheat" in post processing (again a bit more advanced and further on past basic technique) and add a bit of the color back in as well as hide all of the bubbles (talk about a tedious task), definitely not a throw away image there. The others are decent but some are dark, shadows, light shows through the fish, etc. This is where another light source/flash might come in to be used as a fill off to the side. Not one to illuminate the fish or stop the motion like the one above might do per say (though it does this to an extent), but take out that translucence or the shadows on the body. Discus are a funky fish, they either need to be turned perfectly or you start getting shadows or that translucence.

[rickztahone]

These are good Pat, but I would like for you to invest in a cheap modifier for your flash. You are almost clipping on the shots where the light source is good. Some are dark as Matt suggests, but 1 and 3 are spot on. Too bad about the bubbles. I could take care of that, but it would take a while, lol.

[Second Hand Pat]

Looking good Pat. I personally find the first most pleasing as far as balanced light goes, however if you've ever seen my photos I'm a big fan of that dramatic sharper light like your third pic. Washes out the color just a bit, but I "cheat" in post processing (again a bit more advanced and further on past basic technique) and add a bit of the color back in as well as hide all of the bubbles (talk about a tedious task), definitely not a throw away image there. The others are decent but some are dark, shadows, light shows through the fish, etc. This is where another light source/flash might come in to be used as a fill off to the side. Not one to illuminate the fish or stop the motion like the one above might do per say (though it does this to an extent), but take out that translucence or the shadows on the body. Discus are a funky fish, they either need to be turned perfectly or you start getting shadows or that translucence.

Thanks Matt, of the five pictures the third is my favorite also. I am finding it hard to find a good position with the speed light with this group of fish. Not sure why. :( Sounds like another speed light maybe useful or bouncing the speed light off a bit of gutter mounted slightly above the speed light to provide more even illumination.


These are good Pat, but I would like for you to invest in a cheap modifier for your flash. You are almost clipping on the shots where the light source is good. Some are dark as Matt suggests, but 1 and 3 are spot on. Too bad about the bubbles. I could take care of that, but it would take a while, lol.

No worries about the bubbles Ricardo. Can you go into more detail about the modifier you mention?

Thanks guys for the assist. Appreciate it.
Pat

[Second Hand Pat]

Think I need a macro lens

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7285/16452285578_feb37f9ce4_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/r4Qgjb)DSC_7681 (https://flic.kr/p/r4Qgjb) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[Discus-n00b]

I actually really like that Pat. Love being able to see another in the background and the tree roots. My only complaint would be that tree root in the upper right, probably unavoidable in the moment but once you see it its hard to un-see it kind of thing. A macro would be nice, but I get a sense of its world here. Not bad for such a small fish, wish the fish were just a bit sharper but its not to bad at a smaller resolution like that. If you went to crop it or view original size that's where you would really see it. Lighting on the fish looks excellent to me.

Beautiful fish btw, always wanted some of those.

[Second Hand Pat]

Thanks Matt, this might be a little better. I like this photo too. Just wish the focus was a bit sharper.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7294/16454443609_d7db50d8e6_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/r52jPB)DSC_7681 (https://flic.kr/p/r52jPB) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

Like Matt said, that is a great shot. I really like the lighting, very moody.

As far as the modifier I mentioned? It can be something as simple as a piece of 8x11.5 paper on top of the tank. A diffuser is anything that has pass through capabilities. A good diffuser that I have had in the past is the Gary Fong one.
http://www.amazon.com/Gary-Fong-Collapsible-Speed-Sphere/dp/B00FSG1INY/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1424839351&sr=8-1&keywords=gary+fong+lightsphere

I really wouldn't pay that ridiculous price tag though. I bought one used for about $30 and ended up selling it for the same price. While I did like it, and saw the benefits of it, I'd much rather shoot without another thing hanging off of my kit. It adds bulk to your overall kit that just plain got on my nerves. So I sold it. However, in your situation, you would be doing stationary flash positioning and it would work out well. You can alternatively, make your own diffuser :).

Here's a quick thought, and keep in mind I have not done this AT ALL, but I do not see why it wouldn't work:

Get a small bowl, preferably some kind of rubbermaid tupperware. Cut out a slit that fits the flash head perfectly. Line the inside of said bowl with aluminum foil. Still use some kind of paper in between the top of the tank and the flash. This gets your flash off the tank a little more and spreads the light more. The paper helps the diffusion further. You can use wax paper as well instead of the 8x11.5.

Don't you have a modifier as already though? If so, make some kind of bracket and point it straigh down to your tank and see how that looks. With this last shot though, you aren't having clipping proglms at all. Looks great to me.

[rickztahone]

Just in case you do not know what "clipping" is, that is when a spot is so bright (or dark) that you lose detail within that area because it is too extreme. Typically, even if something is bright and on the brink of clipping, you can recover it in post a little.

[sdrexler078]

Ok Rick. I think I'm ready for this. I just bought a new dslr. I've always used my phone but I really wanted a dslr so I did it and it's confusing. I've read books and manuals and have been practicing daily already. I got a Nikon D3200 Digital SLR Camera With AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-55mm 1:3.5-5.6G VR Lens. What other info do you need to teach me how to master this? I've only been using it for 2 weeks now in manual mode so as far as experience that's it. And eventually I'd like to get a good zoom lense for landscape but for now that's my starter camera and lense.

[rickztahone]

Ok Rick. I think I'm ready for this. I just bought a new dslr. I've always used my phone but I really wanted a dslr so I did it and it's confusing. I've read books and manuals and have been practicing daily already. I got a Nikon D3200 Digital SLR Camera With AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-55mm 1:3.5-5.6G VR Lens. What other info do you need to teach me how to master this? I've only been using it for 2 weeks now in manual mode so as far as experience that's it. And eventually I'd like to get a good zoom lense for landscape but for now that's my starter camera and lense.

pm sent :)

For those interested, I directed sdrexler to an open thread I have in the Photo center where we can practice the basics and get a better feel for shooting with ANY type of camera. You can find the thread here:
http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?118402-Lets-get-to-practicing!

[Second Hand Pat]

Nothing special. My back yard. I just realized that the water line is a huge distraction in this photo.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8627/16699522892_140fe51957.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/rrFqmu)DSC_7687 (https://flic.kr/p/rrFqmu) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

I like the shot Pat. The horizon line is crooked which should be corrected ;) (CW). The hanging leaves need to be either more prominent with a part of the tree showing or they should probably be avoided. As it stands, they are disjointed. I love where you placed the horizon line though. Most of the time people will put the horizon right on the center of the frame. TFS

[Second Hand Pat]

Better...

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8561/16081246383_b9d93e4d86_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/qv3AhF)DSC_7684 (https://flic.kr/p/qv3AhF) by plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/), on Flickr

[rickztahone]

For me? Much better. I like that you didn't pull the shadows in this. It would have looked too unnatural. Way to go. Your horizon looks better here as far as straightness, but you get close to the middle of the frame.

[Second Hand Pat]

More practice Ricardo. If I get another quiet evening...

[rickztahone]

Ok Pat, enough rest for you. Next, what I would like for you to do is to train your eye further. I would like for you to practice in a technique called 'foreground interest'.

This excersize is for you to look for not only a main subject, but also a secondary one. Your goal will be to find an interesting subject, but you must have a foreground interest to accompany this subject.

Let me give you an example:

If you check out your last photo here, that is a very nice landscape on its own. However, you've somewhat framed it with secondary objects. The small pier is a good subject for this scene because they have a sense of natural connection.

Let me give you another example:

You are at the beach and the beach scene itself could be a great looking shot. However, as you are framing up the shot, you see a small crab scuttling along. This subject has become your main subject now, and the far off lanscape has become your secondary subject. It works in inverse as well because there is a connection amongst the two. The shot of the crab itself would be nice as well, but putting him in a setting can be a more powerful shot than stand alone.

Your goal will be to find something similar in the next week or so.

Do not limit yourself to landscapes as you can do this with almost anything so long as the subjects are interesting. I do need for you to find interesting subjects though. We are trying to refine your "eye" and having to search for that shot is one of our main goals here.

Let me know if you need help with anything.

[Second Hand Pat]

Ricardo, I may already have some examples of this. The photos are not great in themselves but you can see if they illustrate what you are saying.

[Second Hand Pat]

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7610/16788235769_ac8a56df1d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/rzw6AR)DSC_7852 (https://flic.kr/p/rzw6AR)plh (https://www.flickr.com/people/129594174@N08/)

[rickztahone]

Young lady, you are doing something we call mining :). At first, I did not believe this was a good example of what I was referring to, but on closer look, we see the alligator in the back scene. There is a lot of negative space here however and we want to compose this a little better. A lower stance may have got you that, but it is difficult to tell without seeing the shot. Also, the partial duck on the left is distracting. You need to resize to crop him completely out or clone it out.

My assignment for you is still the same however. I want you to get out there with this particular task at hand so that you refine your eye and start looking ofr interesting subjects. This would have been a good one had you taken it for this specific assignment. I want you to be able to pintpoint the techniques you are executing while doing them :). Try again.

[Second Hand Pat]

Maybe a bit correct on the mining part Ricardo. :p I took this picture with composition in mind. I was stuck to taking the picture from the seawall (in a park) so getting down to the subjects level was not an option. Anyway you can see why I had not bother to publish it.

Anyway I shall see what I can come up with in the next week. Time for a walk about.
Pat

[rickztahone]

Maybe a bit correct on the mining part Ricardo. :p I took this picture with composition in mind. I was stuck to taking the picture from the seawall (in a park) so getting down to the subjects level was not an option. Anyway you can see why I had not bother to publish it.

Anyway I shall see what I can come up with in the next week. Time for a walk about.
Pat

;)

Just to be clear, I do not think it is a bad picture. It can be improved, but there really is something there. Some photos, there just isn't anything really there. I'm fairly certain I can tell you when such a shot comes across the desk without you taking it badly. So far, that hasn't happend :)

[rickztahone]

Also, how has the off camera flash and modifier been working out for you?

[Second Hand Pat]

Also, how has the off camera flash and modifier been working out for you?

Pretty good. The fish in my avatar was a result of that.

[Second Hand Pat]

;)

Just to be clear, I do not think it is a bad picture. It can be improved, but there really is something there. Some photos, there just isn't anything really there. I'm fairly certain I can tell you when such a shot comes across the desk without you taking it badly. So far, that hasn't happend :)

I didn't think that shot was all that interesting except for the gator. It did represent a real danger to those birds however.