we4wieners 110g

[we4wieners]

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?111556-My-110g-Beginner-Discus-Tank

[we4wieners]

I originally started this thread in the beginners section. Of like to post my updates do I though it would be more conducive to move it to this section.

[we4wieners]

http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/Mobile%20Uploads/20150112_120255_zpsbaf22531.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150112_120255_zpsbaf22531.jpg.html)
New 3" Blue Diamond from Hans.
I'm slowly removing all livestock other than discus, loaches, tetras, and corys. Planning an order from Hans Thursday.

[we4wieners]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyrgDxPoVD4&feature=youtu.be

[we4wieners]

http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3036_zps4b954b4a.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3036_zps4b954b4a.jpg.html)
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3040_zpsca0fa252.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3040_zpsca0fa252.jpg.html)

[Lilly]

So I see so many things wrong here I do not know where to begin:( First off let me tell you I am in no way trying insult or pick on you, my only intention is to educated you .

First off your tank is way overstocked. This means you have more fish then the 110 gallons of water handle. The waste they are creating is polluting the water with Nitrate. Do you own a liquid test kit? API Master Test Kit for Fresh water. Nitrates need to be kept below 20ppm ...less then 10ppm is better for discus.
The stress is evident when you look at how dark your discus are, stress bars and peppering all signs they are stressed and not doing well. The water quality is also causing the tail and fin rot on your geo and veil tail angel and those are just the few I can identify.

Next you have 2 small blood parrots in this tank...they will not be able to compete for food as their mouths make it very hard to eat. Good you got ride of them and the Uaru?

Next you have clown loaches that are also showing stress...they are deep orange and black when healthy. Did you know they grow very large and need hiding places, hollow logs are good, so they are comfortable. You should re home them as well.

What are you feeding and how often? What is your WC routine? Do you use well water or city water? What temp is the tank?

You have a beautiful tank...now you need to get the fish healthy...the people here can help with that:)

[we4wieners]

So I see so many things wrong here I do not know where to begin:( First off let me tell you I am in no way trying insult or pick on you, my only intention is to educated you .

First off your tank is way overstocked. This means you have more fish then the 110 gallons of water handle. The waste they are creating is polluting the water with Nitrate. Do you own a liquid test kit? API Master Test Kit for Fresh water. Nitrates need to be kept below 20ppm ...less then 10ppm is better for discus.
The stress is evident when you look at how dark your discus are, stress bars and peppering all signs they are stressed and not doing well. The water quality is also causing the tail and fin rot on your geo and veil tail angel and those are just the few I can identify.

Next you have 2 small blood parrots in this tank...they will not be able to compete for food as their mouths make it very hard to eat. Good you got ride of them and the Uaru?

Next you have clown loaches that are also showing stress...they are deep orange and black when healthy. Did you know they grow very large and need hiding places, hollow logs are good, so they are comfortable. You should re home them as well.

What are you feeding and how often? What is your WC routine? Do you use well water or city water? What temp is the tank?

You have a beautiful tank...now you need to get the fish healthy...the people here can help with that:)
Appreciate it. Parrots gone, Uara being picked up Sunday. Loaches are 5-6 yrs old, wont rehome them. The angel that has fin rot, was removed from an African specied tank and had absolutely no fin on him at all, none. Just laid sideways in tank because he couldn't move. Hence his fin condition. I believe he has healed up extremely well.. in a years period. I do WC's every 2 days...50%, sometimes every 3 days. Fed 3 times a day...homemade BH, Cobalt Flakes, ALs FDBW, Mysis, etc. Yeah, I own many test kits. My nitrates are darn near 0. Thanks for your input. Ill try to increase WC schedule to daily.

[torch]

What kind of lighting are you using LEDs and settings?

[we4wieners]

Current Truelumen Pro LED Sticks. I have the 3 sticks on it Deepwater(marine blue) 453nm, Fusion 8K & 453nm, and Diamond White 12K. Just purchased this light last week. Each stick is dimmable. Since the video posted above Ive added more white broad spectrum light.

[Lilly]

Appreciate it. Parrots gone, Uara being picked up Sunday. Loaches are 5-6 yrs old, wont rehome them. The angel that has fin rot, was removed from an African specied tank and had absolutely no fin on him at all, none. Just laid sideways in tank because he couldn't move. Hence his fin condition. I believe he has healed up extremely well.. in a years period. I do WC's every 2 days...50%, sometimes every 3 days. Fed 3 times a day...homemade BH, Cobalt Flakes, ALs FDBW, Mysis, etc. Yeah, I own many test kits. My nitrates are darn near 0. Thanks for your input. Ill try to increase WC schedule to daily.

I am so glad that you re homed the parrots and the Uara is going as well. That is great! What temp.are you keeping the tank? If the temp is cool it could cause the color that I see on the discus. sb 84-86F They are nice fish, but there is something wrong in the tank for them to be that color. Have you wormed them? With all the different fish they may have worms. Do you have a LFS that you can get some Hikari PraziPro. This medication will kill all kinds of parasites. Do not add any other medication when the PraziPro is being used. Follow the directions on the label for dosing. Loaches do not have scales so you need to remove them to another tank when medicating the main tank. You can medicate them at 1/2 dose in the tank you have them in.

Are you using carbon in the filter? Carbon should only be used to remove medication from the tank.

Good luck can't wait for you to see the difference :)

[we4wieners]

No carbon. I wormed them prior to placement to DT. I have a feeling the black background isn't helping either. My temp is at 82' Have to struggle to increase temp. Will add another heater.

[Lilly]

That is a good place to start...slowly bring the temp up to 86-88. This and keeping the nitrates below 10ppm. :)

[we4wieners]

My nitrates are pretty much unreadable according to my API kit (which is relatively new). I am bringing the temp up and noticing a difference already. Didn't take much. I added another heater and Im at 84' now.

[Lilly]

How are things looking today?

[we4wieners]

The fish are completely different. It seems as if a few degrees made a world of difference. It's steady at 85'. I have my injured discus in hospital tank and isn't getting any worse but not sure if he's getting any better either. Treating with meth blue and Furan2 and daily 90% WC's. Give him another couple weeks in HT.

[Lilly]

Awesome news :-)
Poi
Make sure you have the qt tank warm as well.

Quick question on nitrates. ..when you do the test are you shaking the bottles vigorously ...add bottle 1, 10 drops shake vial 30 seconds. ..add 10 drops bottle 2 shake vial for a minute. ...if the solution in the bottles is not
shaken vigorlously before doing the test you will get a false reading....all those fish ...should be seeing more nitrate:-)

[we4wieners]

Awesome news :-)
Poi
Make sure you have the qt tank warm as well.

Quick question on nitrates. ..when you do the test are you shaking the bottles vigorously ...add bottle 1, 10 drops shake vial 30 seconds. ..add 10 drops bottle 2 shake vial for a minute. ...if the solution in the bottles is not
shaken vigorlously before doing the test you will get a false reading....all those fish ...should be seeing more nitrate:-)
I've been using API for years. I am pretty familiar with their procedures. I am still relatively low.

[we4wieners]

As informed by members, I was too stocked with different species. As suggested, I started rehoming my other species to only a discus tank with dithers, amazons, lemon tetras, penguins, and corys. I am giving away or have already given away most of what is nonspecific. My existing discus have taken on an entirely different look. They are so much more active with dominance testing all over and their colors are really brighter. I am looking for a home for my veil tail angels and synodontis. I have 3 large CL's that Ive had for many years. I just wont part with them. they have lived with these discus for quite some time and have fit in the pecking order. Only keeping jurupari with the discus as well as the CL's. I ve also bumped up my wc's to every day, but sometimes every other day. My temp was suggested to be increased to 85'. I did that as well. Who ever said I don't take direction very well? LOL.... Kinda psyched to watch the change take place right before my eyes. Plus, I am going to cull the lil guy. Wanna spend some time with him tonight and try to convince him it's not personal and it wont hurt. Ive never done this before, so I am abit hesitant....but I will take advice. As a fireman, I see all kinds of morbid stuff, but culling seems downright difficult. I suppose I'll get over it though. thanks for the advice forum! Its certainly working.

[Lilly]

Please don't cull the little one. ...with the changes you are making you may see a change. ..who cares if it is littleas long as its healthy:-)

[Second Hand Pat]

Please don't cull the little one. ...with the changes you are making you may see a change. ..who cares if it is littleas long as its healthy:-)

Lilly, that's the problem. It is not healthy.

[we4wieners]

Ill try to get a pic and you guys judge for yourselves.

[we4wieners]

The lil' fella is all the way on the left mid tank. He was added with most of the existing discus at the same time. They all grew and he didn't. So, is he sick or unhealthy? BTW, the big Uaru has been rehomed.
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3138_zpsd123452a.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3138_zpsd123452a.jpg.html)

[Second Hand Pat]

we4wieners, you mentioned him in your video a while back. You said he is thin but eats like a champ. He is thin thru the body with a pinched forehead. Al also suggested culling the lil' fella. It is up to you. Personally for me it is not worth the risk.

[we4wieners]

we4wieners, you mentioned him in your video a while back. You said he is thin but eats like a champ. He is thin thru the body with a pinched forehead. Al also suggested culling the lil' fella. It is up to you. Personally for me it is not worth the risk.
Understood Pat. I appreciate your input as I do everyone's with this. I feel an obligation as a hobbyist to ensure the safekeeping of all livestock. However, if there is a chance he may put the tank at risk I feel I must agree to cull. I am not dead set on making a decision just yet. He does ACT healthy but he does look pretty darn rough.

[Lilly]

Looks like parasites. ... I would do a couple rounds of PraziPro. ...treat the whole tank....up to you...who did you buy them from?

[Lilly]

Hi
How are the fish doing?

Love to see new picks!

[we4wieners]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0egrlYV1XRc&feature=youtu.be

[Lilly]

Wow what a difference:) Nice job...I would try and re-home the earth eaters as you have added the new discus and increased the bio load again...keep doing the frequent large water changes and you should see happy healthy fish!

[Departure]

Looks really nice, well done

[we4wieners]

Thanks for the advice. It has made a world of difference.

[we4wieners]

Just an update. Doing daily WC's at 50-75%. In doing so, I started getting some BBA growing. I am assuming my phosphates may be high, never checked them. All the livestock are really active and Ive had eggs laid several times in the last few weeks. Not quite ready to act on the eggs. The corys are eating the eggs.
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3370_zps7suc25i3.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3370_zps7suc25i3.jpg.html)
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3386_zps7dgi7ltv.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3386_zps7dgi7ltv.jpg.html)
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3382_zpshr2xf1db.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3382_zpshr2xf1db.jpg.html)
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3380_zpssiqdxl54.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3380_zpssiqdxl54.jpg.html)
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3369_zps7x0eheds.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3369_zps7x0eheds.jpg.html)
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3348_zps1e021bb5.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3348_zps1e021bb5.jpg.html)
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3388_zpsgskc6mcb.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3388_zpsgskc6mcb.jpg.html)

[pcsb23]

Just an update. Doing daily WC's at 50-75%. In doing so, I started getting some BBA growing. I am assuming my phosphates may be high, never checked them. All the livestock are really active and Ive had eggs laid several times in the last few weeks. Not quite ready to act on the eggs. The corys are eating the eggs.BBA is not caused by phosphates. It is caused by fluctuating levels of CO2 and/or poor circulation. Because you are doing daily water changes, the changes water (I'm guessing tap?) will contain a goodly amount of CO2, BBA reacts to this quicker than the plants. In essence your daily water change is causing this :)

There are a number of ways to combat this:
Age your water ensuring all excess CO2 is driven off
Use excel or easycoarbo (or any glutaraldehyde) and overdose carefully to start with
Manually remove it - either way you should remove as much as possible before starting remedial action
Change less water daily
Change water less frequently
Use injected CO2
Increase circulation
Direct attack with H2O2

Changing less water, be it frequency or amount, won't sit easily with most discus keepers.

Some of the above need to be used together, such as manually removing as much as possible. Using excel or similar and direct attack with H2O2 will deal with the BBA but won't resolve the long term issue.

[alron2]

What is BBA?

[pcsb23]

What is BBA?black beard algae (some call it black bush algae - same difference) :)
http://www.aquariumalgae.blogspot.co.uk/2006/06/black-beard-algae-bba-red-brush-algae.html

[we4wieners]

BBA is not caused by phosphates. It is caused by fluctuating levels of CO2 and/or poor circulation. Because you are doing daily water changes, the changes water (I'm guessing tap?) will contain a goodly amount of CO2, BBA reacts to this quicker than the plants. In essence your daily water change is causing this :)

There are a number of ways to combat this:
Age your water ensuring all excess CO2 is driven off
Use excel or easycoarbo (or any glutaraldehyde) and overdose carefully to start with
Manually remove it - either way you should remove as much as possible before starting remedial action
Change less water daily
Change water less frequently
Use injected CO2
Increase circulation
Direct attack with H2O2

Changing less water, be it frequency or amount, won't sit easily with most discus keepers.

Some of the above need to be used together, such as manually removing as much as possible. Using excel or similar and direct attack with H2O2 will deal with the BBA but won't resolve the long term issue.
Thank you for the advice. I'll remove the dwood and remove as much as I can. Ill introduce more circulation and attempt to age my water. Other than it being unsightly, i heard is harmless. True? How should I chose excel in a 110?

[pcsb23]

Thank you for the advice. I'll remove the dwood and remove as much as I can. Ill introduce more circulation and attempt to age my water. Other than it being unsightly, i heard is harmless. True? How should I chose excel in a 110?Yes, harmless just unsightly as you say. As for dosing excel - if you dosed the full tank it would get very expensive, very quickly! What I would do is get a syringe and directly apply it to the affected areas. But as you are intending to remove the driftwood, once you have removed as much as poss, put the wood over the tank, and then syringe the excel onto the affected areas, leave it for 5 mins or so and replace in the tank.

[rickztahone]

http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af341/we4wieners/DSC_3386_zps7dgi7ltv.jpg (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/we4wieners/media/DSC_3386_zps7dgi7ltv.jpg.html)


Nice looking tank and setting. I would caution you to keep an eye on the discus above. The cloudy eye can be a sign that it is going to get sick.

[manbearpig]

On the BBA side. I combated some a few years ago and found out that putting excel in a syringe and spraying it directly on the BBA is enough to kill it. It will turn red over a period of a few days and then release and get it with a net.

[we4wieners]

Nice looking tank and setting. I would caution you to keep an eye on the discus above. The cloudy eye can be a sign that it is going to get sick.
Thank you Ricardo. I actually just got treating him him for worms over the past few weeks. I'll continue to watch him. Thanks again!

[manbearpig]

Yes, harmless just unsightly as you say. As for dosing excel - if you dosed the full tank it would get very expensive, very quickly! What I would do is get a syringe and directly apply it to the affected areas. But as you are intending to remove the driftwood, once you have removed as much as poss, put the wood over the tank, and then syringe the excel onto the affected areas, leave it for 5 mins or so and replace in the tank.

Disregard my last comment! Pays to read all the previous comments.

[pcsb23]

Disregard my last comment! Pays to read all the previous comments.Nothing wrong with some positive re-enforcement :)