I want to do Discus, but want to know Running Costs: Water, More Water, Food, Heat

[MuckyFish]

Hi,

This could be my first post or at least my first thread I think.

So, I would like to give discus a try and have been wanting to do this ever since I read about their breeding behavior. Before I start to tackle this I want to get an idea of the running costs.

I think I would start with a 60G tank for 6 individuals. You know that if I want to breed I will need to have other tanks or I may start with a larger one. But I need to cost with something even if its not perfectly accurate.

What does a tank of 60G cost to heat in terms of watt hours per month to approx 84F in 40F 50F 60F 70F conditions that has a lid on top. I am looking for indications as I realize ambient temperature and surface, area are going to be a factor.

Does it change much for glass vs acrylic tank material?

Does insulating the tank make a big difference?

Water changes, for costing purposes lets be pessimistic and assume I am growing out juveniles of 2". I will probably start with 4" or 5" but this is for costing.

What is that going to need in terms of water changes as a percent and what frequency is typically recommended?
What would 6 adults require in terms of water change per week as percent?

750Gallons of water is going to cost $8 (USD)?

Food costs?

What is the cheapest I could feed juvies during grow out?
6 adult discus per month?
Is anyone doing a homemade recipe that really works like Weis does? We are talking lab grade ingredients and no mammalian heart or organs. What does the advanced stuff cost?

[ESXiGuy]

I don't think under any circumstances you will be able to raise 6 juvenile Discus to 6" for less than $800. If you want to show off something nice at the lowest cost, start with a brand new tank and buy a group of adults from a forum sponsor and be good to go from Day 1.

My degree in Economics is pretty useless overall but it helps solve problems such as these:

1 - No way you can grow Discus better and cheaper than someone in Asia.
2 - Opportunity cost of them to raise juvenile Discus is by far the most expensive - especially the 50% daily water changes people seem to be doing at the minimum. Some people when they do 3 feedings daily - this means 3 water changes daily.

I think the exercise you are doing is pretty cool actually - some day I would like to do the grow out juvis for the challenge, fun and sense of accomplishment.

For cheap stands you can go with Titan EZE stands at Dr. Foster. Just metal frames to hold the tanks.

For cheap tanks, Petco does the 1 dollar per gallon tank sale a few times per year. You can pick up a 29 gallon and a 55 gallon. Buy the equipment that would power the 55 gallon but run it in the 29 gallon. Smaller tank will cost less to power, less water to change, more efficient feedings, etc. When the juvis outgrow the 29, move them to the 55. The 29 then works as a breeding/quarantine/hospital tank.

Everyone's heating bill is different but it seems all the US domestic Fish farms are in Florida and not Minnesota. ;) You'd have to find out what your cost per kilowatt hour is from your utilities and then use a device to measure how long and how often your heater runs.

If you have to ask how much acrylic tanks cost compared to glass, you can't afford the acrylic. ;) (I use glass tanks by the way!)

I would love to see others responses but I am pretty sure I am correct that you cannot raise Discus for cheaper than you can buy adults. This might be different for breeders who build an operation for economy scale out but the fact that almost every forum sponsor imports Discus tells you everything about the financial feasibility of raising your own to full size.

[dprais1]

check this out

http://www.gcca.net/55-tips-and-tricks/192-power-consumption-and-the-aquarium

[William Palumbo]

Basically Discus are not for u if u are concerned about the price. BUT if u are determined and looking to breed them. Start with a PROVEN pair. More money up front, but forego a year worth of WCs and food/feelings , to maybe get a actual spawning pair. Wrap Ur tanks with Reflectex insulation. Tight glass tops. It helps!..Bill

[dprais1]

Wrap Ur tanks with Reflectex insulation. Tight glass tops. It helps!..Bill

more true than you realize, especially in a cold basement

[Rudustin]

This is a very difficult question to answer. It depends on where you live, house, apartment, condo etc., what your water bill looks like normally, what kind of water do you have well or municipal water, do you have a finite budget, how many water changes do you plan to do per week, what kind of lighting do you want. Seems to me that no one can precisely answer your question without more information from your side. Rufus P.S. I don't think about the cost frankly because I just love keeping discus and it is the only hobby I have so I devote a great deal of time and care to my discus without looking at the check book. They are a great joy for me and I spend hours taking care of them. That can't be measured in time or money.

[DISCUS STU]

Do your basic research but if your that concerned about cost then you will probably not enjoy this part of the hobby. There are less expensive fish to keep, like Angels, that don't need as much care, maintenance, and cost.

[DiscusRob]

Actually the op is doing a cost analysis as they have another thread asking about hobbyist resale value, where besides here to sell, etc.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?119909-Current-Market-for-Hobbyist-Sales&highlight=

[John_Nicholson]

While Bill is correct in that uying a proven pair can save money I still suggest buying small and raisnig them out. Raising discus is a skill that has to be developed. Before you start raising babies to sell to others you first need to raise your own. If you pay attention and also listen to us here you will successful and learn a hell of a lot that you probably think you already know and I do not mean that in a bad way. Like the old saying goes you don't know what you don't know. If you are going to have any real success you will be doing a least one large water change a day.

-john

[Twistofer]

MuckyFish...Like everyone has said, you need to do your homework. A simple spreadsheet in MS Excel can help you calculate the costs. I have to agree with John in that you may want to master raising a few small fishes first. Saying that, I wonder if you have the time for the multiple feedings and tank cleanings. Might I suggest that you get the basics of keeping an adult pair or two. That way you master the husbandry, water care, etc. first. Once you have mastered that I'd say, "Go For It!"

[MuckyFish]

So DiscusRob calls it right. I am doing cost analysis. I want to know what this is going to cost me and whether I can reasonably afford it, financially and perhaps also from a time perspective. There is also a whole number of other questions to ask or research too. Not least of which is the ethics of recreational water usage in the drought. That aside if I breed and raise fish I need to know that I can sell them.

Everyone on these forums says do your research, and so here I am.

Electricity we can answer with a simple pessimistic view of wattage and assume that the heater is always on. I was initially looking at it from an energy perspective and then cost the energy but that is just too complicated.

Water I think there are more water changes involved than I was anticipating but costing it is going to be fairly straight forwards.
Food, I should probably re ask the food question in the food subforum. This hasn't got a mention so far in this thread.

I appreciate the suggestion to go with the purchase of a pair but I can see the experience of raising 2 inch juvies worthwhile as well.

I will do a spreadsheet, I would have done one anyway but as there is some interest in that from one of the posts in this thread I'll either put it on a Google Doc or put an excel sheet on Github.

[DiscusRob]

Mucky, I'm in the planning stages of a discus display tank, never mind breeding, I currently have 235 gallons of some really rare Lake Victorian Cichlids, I know the pains and pitfalls that come with breeding and selling said fish, buyers are needed to begin with, look into local fish clubs, I've tried but anyone into africans are way south of where I live, so it can be hit or miss, do your research, do the math, and prepare for losing your a@# till you get established and get favorable reviews, can be hit or miss, you won't make a living doing it, that I know. Good Luck.

[strawberryblonde]

From where I'm sitting in Idaho, if you're thinking that breeding and selling is going to recoup some of your expenses, think again.

I've found it far cheaper to just settle on one tank of nice discus and to never breed mine. Unlike some other fish, discus don't generally breed successfully if they are left in a group tank, so that eliminates the possibility of having to spend huge amounts of money for the extra water changes, electricity and feed for tanks full of fry.

So what I'm saying here is that if you want to have a nice tank of adult discus in your home and enjoy them, buy some nice 4" sub-adults who will grow out in the first 18 months. Once the 18 months are up you can cut back on water changes and feedings and just plain enjoy them. You'll have the rewards of having grown them out yourself and no worries about the added expense of breeding.

Save as much as you can on electricity by insulating the back of the tank and keeping tight lids on it.

Feed beefheart flakes instead of frozen beefheart to further cut costs.

It's never going to be cheap in this hobby, but it doesn't have to break your pocket book either. =)