Discus Aggression and Basics

[jeff12]

Do discus fight? Do they need territories and stuff or can they live together peacefully? Do they like swimming up and down or to side to side? Does discus require daily water changes for their growth? Could it be weekly water changes? How much water do you change? What do they eat and what do they prefer, frozen/live foods or pellets and flakes? Are discus really picky because I have read that they seem to be the most difficult to keep? I have kept mbuna cichlids before so how much difficult are they compared to mbuna cichlids? What other tips of discus should I know?

[Eddie]

You can find the answer to all these questions by reading the stickies.

[briztoon]

You can also watch this video.

https://youtu.be/VXe3VKh7qF8

[John_Nicholson]

The above is right but here are the very, very basics.......temp 82, water has to be kept clean, they need lots of high protein food to reach their potential, because of the diet they produce a lot of waste, this requires lots of water changes. Most successful people change water daily. Depending on bioload between 50% and 100% daily. Most use bare bottom tanks to raise them in. They are much cleaner and no your plants will not help to keep your water clea. In fact the gravel will significantly hurt your water quality. Yes we all strted with planted tanks and then learned out leason. Only buy healthy quality discus from a good source. You will save tons of money in the long run going this route. Discus ar cichlids, yes they will fight. When adults, if healthy, they will spawn. The would discus population is not tied to if you raise that spawn, life will go on.

-john

[strawberryblonde]

Do discus fight? Do they need territories and stuff or can they live together peacefully? Do they like swimming up and down or to side to side? Does discus require daily water changes for their growth? Could it be weekly water changes? How much water do you change? What do they eat and what do they prefer, frozen/live foods or pellets and flakes? Are discus really picky because I have read that they seem to be the most difficult to keep? I have kept mbuna cichlids before so how much difficult are they compared to mbuna cichlids? What other tips of discus should I know?


Do discus fight?
Yes, they are cichlids so sometimes they are going to nip, nudge, bash and bruise each other. This mostly happens while establishing a pecking order when they are new and what there is pairing and mating behavior in the tank. It can also happen to some degree when they are eating. It is why most people buy groups of at least 5-6 discus at a time - the larger the group, the more likely that they aggression will be evenly spread amongst the fish.

Do they need territories and stuff or can they live together peacefully?
They live together peacefully and don't need separate spaces in a tank. They are very unlike African Cichlids in this area of behavior.

Do they like swimming up and down or to side to side?
They aren't very picky about which direction they swim in. They like to swim back and forth most of the time, and then they'll switch it up and swim up and down sometimes. Mine are in a tall tank and have grown into the habit of swimming up and down.

Does discus require daily water changes for their growth?
YES!!

Could it be weekly water changes?
NO! You will have sick and dying discus in your tank if you neglect their water changes or try to only do once a week water changes.

How much water do you change?
I personally change 90% daily. Some people do well with 80% daily and others do 100% daily. In my smaller tanks I do 90% twice a day when I'm growing out my discus.

What do they eat and what do they prefer, frozen/live foods or pellets and flakes?
Discus will eat nearly anything, but for optimal growth and health they need high quality, high protein foods. During growth (the first 18 months of life) they need several feedings per day. I stick with 5-7 per day for discus over 2" in length. They need 3 feedings per day for adult discus.
The foods can be a variety of discus flakes, discus pellets, frozen beefheart, frozen prime reef foods and freeze dried worms. For the freeze dried worms I always recommend using blackworms instead of bloodworms.

Are discus really picky because I have read that they seem to be the most difficult to keep?
Discus are picky - absolutely. Compared to other tropical fish they can seem very difficult to keep. But, if you come at it with an open mind and are willing to follow the few rules that they require, then they really aren't difficult at all.

I have kept mbuna cichlids before so how much difficult are they compared to mbuna cichlids?
Mbuna's are pretty easy compared to discus.

What other tips of discus should I know?

1) Keep Nitrates as low as possible and never let them rise above 5ppm.

2) When in doubt, change more water.

3) Feed them often and make it high quality food. Then vacuum out the leftovers or do a quick water change (especially if you are feeding frozen foods!)

4) No gravel! No plants!

5) Paint the outside bottom of your tank white and keep it bare bottom till your discus are full grown, then add a thin layer of sand.

[jeff12]

Do discus fight?
Yes, they are cichlids so sometimes they are going to nip, nudge, bash and bruise each other. This mostly happens while establishing a pecking order when they are new and what there is pairing and mating behavior in the tank. It can also happen to some degree when they are eating. It is why most people buy groups of at least 5-6 discus at a time - the larger the group, the more likely that they aggression will be evenly spread amongst the fish.

Do they need territories and stuff or can they live together peacefully?
They live together peacefully and don't need separate spaces in a tank. They are very unlike African Cichlids in this area of behavior.

Do they like swimming up and down or to side to side?
They aren't very picky about which direction they swim in. They like to swim back and forth most of the time, and then they'll switch it up and swim up and down sometimes. Mine are in a tall tank and have grown into the habit of swimming up and down.

Does discus require daily water changes for their growth?
YES!!

Could it be weekly water changes?
NO! You will have sick and dying discus in your tank if you neglect their water changes or try to only do once a week water changes.

How much water do you change?
I personally change 90% daily. Some people do well with 80% daily and others do 100% daily. In my smaller tanks I do 90% twice a day when I'm growing out my discus.

What do they eat and what do they prefer, frozen/live foods or pellets and flakes?
Discus will eat nearly anything, but for optimal growth and health they need high quality, high protein foods. During growth (the first 18 months of life) they need several feedings per day. I stick with 5-7 per day for discus over 2" in length. They need 3 feedings per day for adult discus.
The foods can be a variety of discus flakes, discus pellets, frozen beefheart, frozen prime reef foods and freeze dried worms. For the freeze dried worms I always recommend using blackworms instead of bloodworms.

Are discus really picky because I have read that they seem to be the most difficult to keep?
Discus are picky - absolutely. Compared to other tropical fish they can seem very difficult to keep. But, if you come at it with an open mind and are willing to follow the few rules that they require, then they really aren't difficult at all.

I have kept mbuna cichlids before so how much difficult are they compared to mbuna cichlids?
Mbuna's are pretty easy compared to discus.

What other tips of discus should I know?

1) Keep Nitrates as low as possible and never let them rise above 5ppm.

2) When in doubt, change more water.

3) Feed them often and make it high quality food. Then vacuum out the leftovers or do a quick water change (especially if you are feeding frozen foods!)

4) No gravel! No plants!

5) Paint the outside bottom of your tank white and keep it bare bottom till your discus are full grown, then add a thin layer of sand.

Thank you for going through each question LOL.

Are domestic discus on the market today all hybrids? Would it be okay for them to mate with other discus species?

[John_Nicholson]

Well really none of them are hybrids. DNA testing done by the univeristiy of Georgia showed that heckels are a sub-species but everything else is single species.

-john

[strawberryblonde]

You can get some not so pretty discus if you get a badly matched pair, but other than that, it's ok for them to produce fry because they are different strains, not different species.

For now don't worry about the whole breeding thing. If the day comes that you decide to breed discus then you'll want to go read up in the Breeding section of the forums for information on how to get started. =)

[jeff12]

Well really none of them are hybrids. DNA testing done by the univeristiy of Georgia showed that heckels are a sub-species but everything else is single species.

-john

So for example Giant Flora, Altun Flora, and Golden Checkerboard Pigeon are all their own species? Would breeding them together result in hybrids? Are they found in the wild? I'm confused about the DNA and origin of domestic discus and coming from Mbuna breeding hybrids is a big no no.

[briztoon]

Giant Flora, Altum Flora and Checkerboards aren't different species. They are man made variants.

Think of it in human terms. Human Beings are one species, yet we come in all different shapes, sizes and colour. Nature in a way, has line bred humans from different parts of the world to look different. Mostly these differences have resulted from two main factors, the climate and environment. People from hot, bright and sunny parts of the world developed darker skin because darker skin protects from the sun. Where as people from cold climates wear more clothes to protect from the cold, and because the skin is not exposed to the sun it does not have to protect itself from burning and loses the dark colouring. Or people from jungle environments are generally shorter as being tall is a disadvantage when moving through thick, low vegetation.

You can selectively breed many different species for specific traits. Take Bettas for example. Fancy, pet shop Bettas look nothing like wild bettas. Fancy bettas come in many different colours, patterns and fin types. They have been bred over many, many years for certain colours or patterns or fin types.

Same with discus. They have been selectively bred for certain patterns and colours.

[GrayLadyPat]

Jeff, welcome to the Discus World!

Being a relative newcomer to discus myself, let me give you a few bits of advice from a "newbie" perspective...In my case, I had some thrust upon me and had to learn fast. I'm still learning, and even a few years after discus #1, I still won't attempt breeding and fry raising. In fact, for me personally, I will never breed my own. I willl simply keep them and enjoy watching them greet me when I come home...or get up... or walk to the fridge...or lelt the dogs out... or simply look over at the tank to see them all staring at me like they want something...lol

1. Read... there is so much good information here, and it's all in the stickies and prior postings from people like me. Everything from tank size and configuration to what color poop means what is here. Don't be afraid to ask questions, but in general, if someone's asked it, the answer is most likely here already.
2. Listen to the experts! Some of them may be a bit "salty" in their replies, but I have never gotten bad advice from any of them. There are decades of experiences in these pages.
3. Learn how to keep discus before you learn how to breed discus. They're not difficult, but they are labor and time intensive. If you've never had them before, it's very wise to start out with $50 fish instead of investing in $500 fish (personal opinion alert.) I guarantee you that you will have fish die, and for no apparent reason. Until you can keep them alive, happy and healthy, you can't add all the "stuff" you have to do extra for breeding and raising fry. Besides, learning how to keep them first will also give you the experience you need to know what strains you want, what to look for in a breeding pair, and how to tell if they really are breeding or just acting pretty for you.
4. Change the water...every day if you can, but if you can't change it more than once a week, try something less needy. (Not being snarky here, just truthful...discus need good water!) If there is something wrong with the water, your discus friends will let you know by not thriving. There's a very true saying here, that goes: When in doubt, change the water, even if you've already changed it today."


As for your questions, the posters above have given you some very good information, so I won't try to add to them.

The biggest piece of advice I can give, though, is don't give up! They are worth every moment you spend.