Chemical filtration for discus tank?

[Cookie_discus]

Hi Do you guys have any chemical filtration for your discus tank. If yess, whst kinda chemical filtration? I know some people said carbon is harmful for them but beside carbon is there any other that is safe to use on discus? I only have bio filtration and filter floss in my Eheim 2215 now.

[warblad79]

Purigen

[John_Nicholson]

Still does not replace the need for water changes.

-john

[Filip]

I use purigen since my tank is sand bottom with some plants in it.
I do 80-90% daily Wc but still purigen goes from white to brown and need to be recharged in 1-2 months.
So I think it only helps a bit as a supplement to my Wc regime and my overall filtration.

[strawberryblonde]

I used Purigen for a short while way back when my tank was brand new and had high levels of potassium in the water column. Once the new tank thing settled itself I removed the purigen and have never used any chemical filtration at all. Heck, I change the water every day so anything beyond a well seeded couple of sponge filters would be a waste of time and money. LOL

[DISCUS STU]

I stopped using any carbon along time ago and found the amount of hith to drop in relation to that. As John said, "nothing replaces water changes".

Carbon as in the expensive stuff like Chemipure and ChemiZorb. No need for this stuff which never worked as advertised for me anyway.

Because of this site I'm using Purigen but don't really know if I need to and may discontinue its use.

[pitdogg2]

Still does not replace the need for water changes.

-john

Nope it will never do that Agree ^^^^^^

I use both Carbon in the tanks and Purigen and Poly-Filter in my aging tank. I have never had any adverse reactions from Carbon, I think that came about because some felt that with its use they would not need to do water changes.

[farebox]

I overstocked my tank with discus, so to provide the best clean environment possible, I have Purigen reactor running and an UV 24/7. As John stated nothing is better than WC's. So I religious do 50%+ WC every three days. I love my fish, so I spent some bucks on what may be called "extras" and I can't tell you if all this stuff is really needed because I'm a firm believer in water changes for my tank. I have it so use it. My tank is always crystal clear.

[GrayLadyPat]

I do run carbon in my filter, but for a very valid reason. My city water is "purified" with a system that causes a byproduct that is harmless to humans and most animals but harmful to aquarium fish. Unfortunately, carbon is the only thing that will remove it. If there were any other alternatives, I would be using them, however having said that, I have yet to have any HITH problems.

I do switch out the carbon every other week. If you do end up using some sort of carbon filtration, watch your finkids very carefully.

oh, and change the water ;)

[Cookie_discus]

So carbon seem like not a good thing for discus? I will try purigen and see if is gonna make any difference.

[warblad79]

So carbon seem like not a good thing for discus? I will try purigen and see if is gonna make any difference.

I have them both in my tanks and I don't think it will make a difference at all but 100% water changes makes a lot of difference to me especially when growing out fry and maintaining healthy fish. There's a lot of misconception when it comes to filtration, people think good filtration would be enough to keep discus healthy but they are wrong and you will see them quite often in the disease section.

[Cookie_discus]

So only water change is the simply and effective way to maintain them right?

[Jack L]

you will see that opinion a lot here and elsewhere. it is NOT a discus thing, but this is a Discus board. but fact is, even if we did a full water change every 5 minutes, it is STILL a drop in the buck compared to water changes in nature. the reasoning is detailed by David E. Boruchowitz, in one of his books i read, in short, there is a TON of water moving through the space an aquarium would occupy.

so you have to use filtration to help out.

i stopped using carbon a long time ago, it didn't do anything IME. I know i've read not use it in Discus tanks, but don't recall the justification.
I have purigen running now about 5x the recommend amount. the ONLY thing i have seen purigen do is remove driftwood tannins from the water. their other claims have not shown up in ANY of the testing i did. specifically to help with nitrates.

[Jack L]

I use purigen since my tank is sand bottom with some plants in it.
I do 80-90% daily Wc but still purigen goes from white to brown and need to be recharged in 1-2 months.
So I think it only helps a bit as a supplement to my Wc regime and my overall filtration.

hi filip, i'd be interested in any testing you did that supports purigen claims. i have it, it turns dark, but i don't see any difference in my parameter w/ or w/o it. it DID remove tannins though.

[warblad79]

Think of it as a backup, just in case if you miss your daily water change or taking a long week vacation.

[jdhuyvetter]

I use ChemiPure, carbon and peat. All in filter bags in the sump. Never really tested a scenario of, with, vs., without the different filter bags. I never had a problem with that combo and old habits die hard.

[Cookie_discus]

Thanks for all the advise guys it is really helpful. Got one more question about the filter. I have a 2215 for my 50 gallon and have two adult discus in there. I am thinking of add a small hydor 425 powerhead to have more flow because I think the 2215 not strong enough.

[Filip]

hi filip, i'd be interested in any testing you did that supports purigen claims. i have it, it turns dark, but i don't see any difference in my parameter w/ or w/o it. it DID remove tannins though.

No jack , i havent done any accurate experimental testing with and without purigen on nitrates to see if there is some difference.
Since i dont have tannins in water and it still goes brown i just think (or better yet) hope so , that it does remove the DOCs ,as it claims to do .

BTW. i got 3 bottles of purigen (thats 3 times recomended dose per gallon water) packed in 3 large DIY Organza bag pouchs to make a bigger exposure with water but im sure purigen- reactor will be much more effective .

[Filip]

Thanks for all the advise guys it is really helpful. Got one more question about the filter. I have a 2215 for my 50 gallon and have two adult discus in there. I am thinking of add a small hydor 425 powerhead to have more flow because I think the 2215 not strong enough.

i have done the same . Since my canister flow is too weak i add a backup additional powerhead filter.
The 300 GPH powerhead is atached with air hose to make a blast of air bubbles and i have it wrapped in thick layer of filter floss material so it helps a lot with mechanical removal of waste .
Just be sure to point and organize the flow in manner that leaves a quite spot without flow for discus to rest ,since they dont like strong currents all around the tank .
Mine is pushing the water in the back , so it leaves the front of tank with low flow for discus to be comfortable.

[Cookie_discus]

I will give it a try on the hydor 425 and see what's gonna happen.

[Cookie_discus]

I just got two male adult discus two days ago they are 5-6'' size. Yesterday was they both are doing good but today one of them is keep darken his body and then back to normal. He keep on doing that for the whole day and also When I feed him he will be lighten right away and he eat no problem. The other is darken his body also but just few times then he never darken again the whole day.

Temp is 83.4 but the previous owner told me he keep them at 88-89.
PH is 7.3
KH is 3
NO3 10ppm

Havent got my GH test kit yet so i dont know about GH. I have ADA light brown soil for substrate so I am wondering if is the soil darken him and thinking of pull it out and go with sand or bb.

[Filip]

i would change to sand or BB just for the sake of discus and further longterm succes with them .
I dont belive they are darkening just becouse of the dark substrate since they are newly introduced discus in an old established enviroment.
if you put them in a comunnity tank with other fish in it ,they will need time to adjust to other bacterias,parasites or other nasties other fish carries with them.
Maybe they are also adjusting to the new water parameters and new temp. level.

To ease them ,i would put them out - rearange the tank to sand or BB followed by 100% WC and once you get them back to new clean enviroment do a regular daily large WC-70-80% ,at least until they come together again and brighten their colours.

Its good to open a new thread with detailed info(there is a tank questionnary on forum )of your tank and fish in it with pictures , so that you can get more accurate advices from moderators or other more experienced discus keepers here.

[Cookie_discus]

I open an new thread on general discus. I just wanna get more advice lol. I do have three flying fox with them but not sure if I need to remove them since the temp is too high for then. For the soil how do i remove it on safety way without harming anything of them?

[Filip]

I open an new thread on general discus. I just wanna get more advice lol. I do have three flying fox with them but not sure if I need to remove them since the temp is too high for then. For the soil how do i remove it on safety way without harming anything of them?

You remove all the fish in a bucket with an airborne or a small pump and a heater.
You pour out gravel, wipe and clean everything down,change 100% water,wait couple of hours for water to dechlorinate and warm up and then you put back the fish in a fresh and healthy enviroment.

You'll notice immediate change on active and happier behaviour of discus after this change.

[Filip]

I meant an airstone up there not an airborne :)

[pitdogg2]

I use ChemiPure, carbon and peat.

Wouldn't carbon and chemipure defeat the purpose of the peat?

[Cookie_discus]

Is not going be a problem if I change 100% of water? Lol

[Filip]

Is not going be a problem if I change 100% of water? Lol

No.Just as long as you add dechlorinator and wait for couple of hours with filters and heaters running to get the water stabilised and outgassed.

[warblad79]

I do it all the time straight tap 100% WC with my juvies without adverse effect but make sure add Seachem Safe or other dechlorinator to be safe.

[Cookie_discus]

My tank is only two months old but is been fully cycled already so is it still safe do i and yes i add prime every time i change the water. By the way my tank PH is 7.3 due it lowered by the soil and my tap is 7.8-8 so if I remove the soil and change all the water the tank PH is gonna be higher so do I need to do acclimation to match the PH before I put the fish back to the tank?

[strawberryblonde]

Changing water doesn't harm your bio-filter. So yes, it's perfectly safe to do a 100% water change at any time. I do 90% every single day on my tanks.

Since your pH will be rising in the tank, there's no need to acclimate the discus. The only time you need to be careful is when you are putting fish from a higher pH tank into a lower pH tank.

Once the soil is out, please don't add any buffers like pH down to your water. Allow it to settle at its natural pH and the fish will be fine with it.

[Jack L]

Changing water doesn't harm your bio-filter. So yes, it's perfectly safe to do a 100% water change at any time. I do 90% every single day on my tanks.

Since your pH will be rising in the tank, there's no need to acclimate the discus. The only time you need to be careful is when you are putting fish from a higher pH tank into a lower pH tank.

Once the soil is out, please don't add any buffers like pH down to your water. Allow it to settle at its natural pH and the fish will be fine with it.

do you do that much with city water?

[strawberryblonde]

I do! Just plain old city water straight from the tap.

[Filip]

I do! Just plain old city water straight from the tap.

And the results are stunning,as we all can see from your pics and posts. :)

[Jack L]

I guess I was thinking the amount of chlorine in the water could impact the bb

[strawberryblonde]

That's what decholorinators are for. ;)

[Jack L]

I was picturing people doing 100% WC and then throwing in prime, or throwing in prime and then adding in water. I would think that some chlorine would hit the BB, not sure how sensitive BB is

[strawberryblonde]

It's not that sensitive.

I'm old school with a lot of things, and to this day I rinse the outside (only the outside, no squeezing!) of my sponge filters in my sink using the sprayer attachment on my faucet. The levels of chlorine in tap water are so low that you're not going to do serious harm to it with a simple rinse, or with the tap entering the tank.

For my tank, I begin adding the water, then toss in 1/2 teaspoon of Safe.

[Cookie_discus]

So what I need to do is pour the soil first then drain all the water out right? Also when after I refill the tank and I dose the prime in it then do I need to wait for like 15 to 20 mins before plug in the filter or just plug in right away? Since there is full of heavy materials so I am wondering if that gonna kill the bacteria in the filter.

[strawberryblonde]

1) Remove your fish from the tank. Place them in a spare tank or in buckets with a heater and air stone.

2) Begin draining the tank. If you use something like a python siphon to drain your tank, you can run the tubing outside to your yard and then suck all the soil out of the tank through the Python.
If you use buckets to remove water, you'll need to drain the tank all the way to the bottom and then scoop out the dirt.

3) Once the dirt is out, rinse the tank to remove any bits of dirt in the corners and then wipe it dry.

4) Paint the outside bottom of your tank with white paint. Let it dry, then refill with water.

5) Put your filters back into the tank, add the heaters, check the temp to be sure it's 82F and then place your fish back into the tank.

Your done! The fish will lighten up and look better and it will be much easier to keep your tank clean as a whistle for them.

Once you've learned how to care for your discus are have become comfortable with them, you can get some ideas from folks here on how to add decor to the tank. But for now, keep it simple and give yourself time to get used to your new discus.

[Filip]

So what I need to do is pour the soil first then drain all the water out right? Also when after I refill the tank and I dose the prime in it then do I need to wait for like 15 to 20 mins before plug in the filter or just plug in right away? Since there is full of heavy materials so I am wondering if that gonna kill the bacteria in the filter.

Yes ,take out all the substrate than change 100 % water.
I pour prime or safe right before i start pouring tap water so its in the water all the time while tank is filling with water. After im done i start filters without waiting.
A little chlorine or else wont harm the bacteria in the filter.

Remember.After you went BB youll have to do daily changes and sihon dirt out becouse you might experience a mini cycle , due to a huge amount of bennificial bacteria you lost along with your substrate.

[blueluv]

Purigen
May I see a pic of how you have your purigen set up ? Thank you

[jdhuyvetter]

Wouldn't carbon and chemipure defeat the purpose of the peat?

Probably, but I had it, so I used it. I have since improved my water change system and I have gone back to RODI water for water changes. Once I use the last of the peat, I will just go back to carbon and Chemipure.

[farebox]

Hi Blueluv, here's an video of my Neextreef MR-1 Reactor using purigen: https://youtu.be/i7i6hfpcg3Y

[DJW]

Hi Blueluv, here's an video of my Neextreef MR-1 Reactor using purigen: https://youtu.be/i7i6hfpcg3Y

farebox, this looks like an excellent filter system. How did you modify the MR-1 reactor to keep the purigen from escaping?

[Jack L]

i just have mine on the tray in mesh bags, it gets enough flow to turn the beads dark evenly. in photo its where the 3rd arrow is. floss, then purigen then onto return chamber



http://forum.simplydiscus.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=92221&d=1448737901

[farebox]

Okay got a tip from afriend:
Re: Purigen Media reactor

Quote Originally Posted by ESXiGuy View Post
Any advice on preventing the purigen from blowing into the tank?
Buy a couple of extra sponges for the MR1 reactor. Sandwich a piece of fine mesh screen material between two of the sponges and then place this at the bottom of the reactor. Place the Purigen into the reactor. Then do the same thing for the top of the reactor (with two sponges and fine mesh screen) and screw the top on. I did this and it makes a pretty good reactor for Purigen provided that the flow rate is not too high. You only need a flow rate of about 0.5 gal/min to get the benefit of the Purigen for a tank up to 100 gal.

I purchased some polyester screen material online for this purpose (250 micron). Ask if you want to know my source for it.

I have used the MR1 reactor modified this way and it keeps all of the Purigen beads out of the tank.

Paul

Re: Purigen Media reactor

farebox,

Mesh screen obtained from: www.compsuco.com

Part number: U-CMYBK-250 C (polyester mesh screen 250 micron, black)

I like the polyester screen because it is very easy to cut it accurately so that it fits without leaking Purigen. Also, it is very durable and can be cleaned and reused many times.

Hope this helps.

Paul

So far all working good with no problem, also when I first start the reactor for the first time place an old coffee mesh filter below the output hose to collect any loose purigen for awhile.

[Cookie_discus]

Okok thanks a lot guys this is really helpful. I know how to do now.

[Cookie_discus]

1) Remove your fish from the tank. Place them in a spare tank or in buckets with a heater and air stone.

2) Begin draining the tank. If you use something like a python siphon to drain your tank, you can run the tubing outside to your yard and then suck all the soil out of the tank through the Python.
If you use buckets to remove water, you'll need to drain the tank all the way to the bottom and then scoop out the dirt.

3) Once the dirt is out, rinse the tank to remove any bits of dirt in the corners and then wipe it dry.

4) Paint the outside bottom of your tank with white paint. Let it dry, then refill with water.

5) Put your filters back into the tank, add the heaters, check the temp to be sure it's 82F and then place your fish back into the tank.

Your done! The fish will lighten up and look better and it will be much easier to keep your tank clean as a whistle for them.

Once you've learned how to care for your discus are have become comfortable with them, you can get some ideas from folks here on how to add decor to the tank. But for now, keep it simple and give yourself time to get used to your new discus.

For the soil after I remove it, can I rinse it and use it again when I need it next time?