introducing fish

[Bc chick]

When I order my discus I will be ordering some Neons and rummies as well. I will be quarantined them in separate tanks. When it is time to introduce them do I put the discus in with the neons and rummy's or other way. Does it make a difference?

[MD.David]

As I have said on many other posts and I am a strong believer in "Discus only bare bottoms tanks", but many do as your suggesting.
I'm not really sure on how long to quarantine other other little guys, other members may have a better idea.


When I order my discus I will be ordering some Neons and rummies as well. I will be quarantined them in separate tanks. When it is time to introduce them do I put the discus in with the neons and rummy's or other way. Does it make a difference?

[LizStreithorst]

You'll be better off with Cardinals than Neons. Neons can't take the high temps of a Discus tank and they are often eaten by the Discus.

[Bc chick]

Thanks guys. No answer to the original question?

[cedar]

I too tried neons, they ate them and they couldn't take the heat....as far as I know, which is not much, little guys in first then big guys.

[rickztahone]

Yes, it makes a difference. Put in dither fish first and let them establish in the tank. This is no guarantee that the discus will not gobble them up, but it helps.

[Filip]

When I order my discus I will be ordering some Neons and rummies as well. I will be quarantined them in separate tanks. When it is time to introduce them do I put the discus in with the neons and rummy's or other way. Does it make a difference?



The point of QT is to protect and prevent your stock from cross contamination issues and save as much stock as you can when mixing different sources.

In your case discus is more mportant and pricey group to protect ,so IIWY I would take out and put one ( least favorite) discus as a test fish with tetras in their QT tank for a 2-3 week trial period . if the worst case scenario happens you can throw away contaminated discus and tetra group and still save the rest of the discus batch for your main display tank . Prior testing I assume you already know that 2 groups should be kept separate and in QT for at least 1 month period , to regain strength and boost their mmune systems that were compromised due to a transport and adjustment in your water and surroundings.

HTH and answers your original question .

[Bc chick]

Yes, it makes a difference. Put in dither fish first and let them establish in the tank. This is no guarantee that the discus will not gobble them up, but it helps.

k just wondered who should be introduce into whos tank. Ill have two tanks up and running before they come. One will be qt and the other will be the future home. Then qt will become hospital tank.

[Bc chick]

The point of QT is to protect and prevent your stock from cross contamination issues and save as much stock as you can when mixing different sources.

In your case discus is more mportant and pricey group to protect ,so IIWY I would take out and put one ( least favorite) discus as a test fish with tetras in their QT tank for a 2-3 week trial period . if the worst case scenario happens you can throw away contaminated discus and tetra group and still save the rest of the discus batch for your main display tank . Prior testing I assume you already know that 2 groups should be kept separate and in QT for at least 1 month period , to regain strength and boost their mmune systems that were compromised due to a transport and adjustment in your water and surroundings.

HTH and answers your original question .

Great thx

[William1]

I have a related question. My LFS owes me two skunk cories and I may want to add some more cardinals. What is the best way to introduce them to my existing discus tank? Do I set up a QT tank and observe these fish for a month or so and if all is good, then put them in the tank. I don't want to take one of my prized wilds and use him as a (word?) fish by putting him in the QT tank to test it. Is that what is recommended? I understand that I shouldn't just take them home and drop them in my discus tank, but is observing them by themselves in the QT tank ok?

[pitdogg2]

I understand that I shouldn't just take them home and drop them in my discus tank, but is observing them by themselves in the QT tank ok?

in a word NO. The problem is that some fish can be carriers and NEVER show signs of sickness or parasites but then a new guy comes along and wammo big problems. that is why you need a "stunt fish" not stunted think stunt man. If that fish after several weeks shows no signs of any problems then in most instances you are safe to introduce to the main tank.

[William1]

Well, that's a drag. I'm not using one of my discus as a test fish. That ain't happenin. I don't even need the skunks. I have enough corys, but the guy at my LFS insists he can't just give me credit, he has to give me the replacement fish.

[Filip]

I have a related question. My LFS owes me two skunk cories and I may want to add some more cardinals. What is the best way to introduce them to my existing discus tank? Do I set up a QT tank and observe these fish for a month or so and if all is good, then put them in the tank. I don't want to take one of my prized wilds and use him as a (word?) fish by putting him in the QT tank to test it. Is that what is recommended? I understand that I shouldn't just take them home and drop them in my discus tank, but is observing them by themselves in the QT tank ok?

if you don't want to use only one of your prized wilds as a stunt / hero / test fish with any new arrivals then you'll end up risking them all together.

[cedar]

I learned that lesson the hard way, you must use a test fish.

[MD.David]

As I read over this entire thread, it's just starting to sound more and more like a bad to worse idea.
If your wanting to fix the whole lot in then I would suggest discus are not for people like this, do African cichlids.
The end result (most likely) of what is going to be attempted is:
The discus will eat all the little guys, the little guys will have a bacteria the discus are not immune to and thus later they will die eventually as well, but not before living out a very sick 2-6 months.
This entire endeavor is just a very bad idea.
Some of us have learned the hard way.

[NeiMan]

Well, that's opened my eyes, stunt fish eh ? So how does that work when setting up a tank if it's best to add the dither fish first ? Or am I missing something ?

[Filip]

Well, that's opened my eyes, stunt fish eh ? So how does that work when setting up a tank if it's best to add the dither fish first ? Or am I missing something ?

No , it is best to add discus alone first in new sterile cycled environment , and put the diether fish in other QT tank.After a month - two you put the ugliest - scape goat discus in to the QT tank with diether fish for at least 2-3 weeks test period .If everything goes well you introduce diether fish in your discus tank .
If the things goes south , you get rid of QT diether fish along with tour ugliest and now infected discus , and you are happy cause you still have your discus tank full of 9 beautiful discus to enjoy.
That is if you stick to your plan of keeping 10 discus as you said in your tank journal thread.

[DJW]

k just wondered who should be introduce into whos tank. Ill have two tanks up and running before they come. One will be qt and the other will be the future home. Then qt will become hospital tank.

Is the tank that is to be the future home for the discus a pristine tank that is being cycled up with ammonia, or are there already fish in it? Are there fish in the other tank?

[NeiMan]

Filip, Thankyou for explaining that. Got it now. Discus 1st, ugly discus fish in with dither fish.
Top man Filip


No , it is best to add discus alone first in new sterile cycled environment , and put the diether fish in other QT tank.After a month - two you put the ugliest - scape goat discus in to the QT tank with diether fish for at least 2-3 weeks test period .If everything goes well you introduce diether fish in your discus tank .
If the things goes south , you get rid of QT diether fish along with tour ugliest and now infected discus , and you are happy cause you still have your discus tank full of 9 beautiful discus to enjoy.
That is if you stick to your plan of keeping 10 discus as you said in your tank journal thread.

[William1]

As I've seen many times on this forum, there are differing opinions. One guy says put the dither fish in first, then add discus. One guy says have two tanks with both types of fish, then put your least favorite discus in the dither tank to test it out. And if the hero discus gets sick you kill him and all the dither fish. Seriously? I did the first option with my guys and everything is perfect. Maybe I got lucky. So, if you don't want to donate one of your prized discus to science, you can't add fish to your existing tank. First of all, just transferring the hero fish to another tank by himself will stress him out, how many times have I read that discus are a schooling fish and do best in company of six fish or more? Putting him in a tank by himself will stress him out from the get go. And then you kill all the fish in that tank. I would like to add some more cardinals, but I'm in no hurry. Some of these thoughts are counter intuitive to me. If you have healthy fish, they are healthy fish. Are some saying the dither fish may have some latent disease hiding inside of them that will infect your discus, even after a couple months of being perfectly fine on their own? That is what I don't get.

[Filip]

Yes Will , that's exactly what I'm saying.
It is very common and has happened many times to many of us here two perfectly healthy groups of fish to cross contaminate each other after mixing .

BTW on different opinions on stocking.
You can put the other fish first also , no stone carved rules about it . But in that case it would be wise to do the opposite , that is QT discus for at least 1 month and then again put 1 test discus from QT to display for 2-3 weeks trial period.

[Bc chick]

Is the tank that is to be the future home for the discus a pristine tank that is being cycled up with ammonia, or are there already fish in it? Are there fish in the other tank?

future discus tank is empty atm. What I need to know is when I get my discus if I can get a cycle sponge from the supplier does this eliminate having to cycle my tank? If it does then I plan to just have the tank filled ready and waiting for the fish. If it doesn't eliminate this process then I will cycle the tank with ammonia before getting the fish. The quarantine tank is up and running I had to move two of my tiger barbs in there as they were nipping at my angel so that's the only thing I have in the tank at the moment. Also referring to how many discus to keep in a hundred gallon tank because that's how big my future tank is. I hear people that keep 6 to 8. Can they stay in a hundred gallon tank when they're adults or will they eventually need to be moved? Also when you're first starting out with discus is there a difference whether you start off with a 2 & a half inch or three and a half incher?

[Filip]

future discus tank is empty atm. What I need to know is when I get my discus if I can get a cycle sponge from the supplier does this eliminate having to cycle my tank? If it does then I plan to just have the tank filled ready and waiting for the fish. If it doesn't eliminate this process then I will cycle the tank with ammonia before getting the fish. The quarantine tank is up and running I had to move two of my tiger barbs in there as they were nipping at my angel so that's the only thing I have in the tank at the moment. Also referring to how many discus to keep in a hundred gallon tank because that's how big my future tank is. I hear people that keep 6 to 8. Can they stay in a hundred gallon tank when they're adults or will they eventually need to be moved? Also when you're first starting out with discus is there a difference whether you start off with a 2 & a half inch or three and a half incher?

Getting sponge from the same water discus came from is an exelent idea and it will get you cycled from the first day . You'll still have to do daily large WCs at least for the first month for Bio bacteria numbers to catch up the discus bioload .

General rule for keeping fullgrown discus is 10 gallons per discus .So you can start with 13-15 discus in the initial phase and select the best 10 of them along the growing period to end up with nice and evenly growth 10 discus batch.
Its safer to start with biggest discus that you can afford especially since you are first time discus keeper.
The smaller they are the more sensitive immune systems they have , and thus things can turn bad easier if you are not certain about what you are doing.

[Bc chick]

Getting sponge from the same water discus came from is an exelent idea and it will get you cycled from the first day . You'll still have to do daily large WCs at least for the first month for Bio bacteria numbers to catch up the discus bioload .

General rule for keeping fullgrown discus is 10 gallons per discus .So you can start with 13-15 discus in the initial phase and select the best 10 of them along the growing period to end up with nice and evenly growth 10 discus batch.
Its safer to start with biggest discus that you can afford especially since you are first time discus keeper.
The smaller they are the more sensitive immune systems they have , and thus things can turn bad easier if you are not certain about what you are doing.

What kind of discus is your pic of

[LizStreithorst]

Excellent advice. His avatar pic is of two beautiful Turks.

[Bc chick]

Excellent advice. His avatar pic is of two beautiful Turks.

does that mean red turk? Beautiful colors

[William1]

I'd go with eight. Good number for your size tank. I have a 120G with eight and that is enough all the way around. Remember, you have to feed them and clean up after them. They eat a lot, which costs money, and sometimes I think my tank is a litter box they make so much yucky stuff you have to siphon off. And I change water every day, twice some days.

[Bc chick]

I'd go with eight. Good number for your size tank. I have a 120G with eight and that is enough all the way around. Remember, you have to feed them and clean up after them. They eat a lot, which costs money, and sometimes I think my tank is a litter box they make so much yucky stuff you have to siphon off. And I change water every day, twice some days.

yeah ive been strugglin between 8 n 10 so hard not to be greedy

[Jack L]

under-stock instead of overstock

there are plenty of threads on best practice q-tank. search for a sticky on it. here is one
http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?123148-Discus-quot-R-quot-US-Quarantine-Recommendations-for-Fish-Purchased-From-Us&highlight=quarantine

just resist the temptation to skip it, or shortcut it. i've lost Discus to doing so.

size fish: smaller are cheaper, if you prefer to see them develop, buy smalls, but you won't know how good they are until grown up later.

and yes, bigger are tougher, but regardless you need to practice proper husbandry, so big or small, you have to do the work.

[Bc chick]

under-stock instead of overstock

there are plenty of threads on best practice q-tank. search for a sticky on it. here is one
http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?123148-Discus-quot-R-quot-US-Quarantine-Recommendations-for-Fish-Purchased-From-Us&highlight=quarantine

just resist the temptation to skip it, or shortcut it. i've lost Discus to doing so.

size fish: smaller are cheaper, if you prefer to see them develop, buy smalls, but you won't know how good they are until grown up later.

and yes, bigger are tougher, but regardless you need to practice proper husbandry, so big or small, you have to do the work.

Oh dont worry i plan on following qt to a t

[Filip]

Thanks on compliments about my EX discus and my advice Liz .
Bechick- Yes they are /were Red Turquoise discus .Very nice specimens from the Israeli Danzinger discus farm .
Will you are right . 8 would be optimal for playing on the safe side .10 is max. recommended at that tankage particularly for a begginer .

[Bc chick]

Does the 1 to 10g ratio still apply to qt tank?

[Filip]

Does the 1 to 10g ratio still apply to qt tank?

Its a rule of a thumb for keeping grown up discus 6-7 ninches . If you buy 2-4 inchers you can certailnly double that ammount .

[Bc chick]

So someone can qt 5 in a 10g?

[Akili]

So someone can qt 5 in a 10g? If they are Adults then no but you getting Juveniles of 2 inch size then yes.Since you getting Discus for first time they can go straight to the tank that you are going to house them if that tank happens to have no other fish.

[Filip]

So someone can qt 5 in a 10g?

20G is considered minimal QT size for a discus .
What i was trying to suggest that you can raise your new 2 to 4 inch 10 .discus in a 40-50 gallons of water for a couple of months instead of using the whole capacity.
You can bend every rule here and there , but you cant strech it to infinity :-) .

[Altum Nut]

So someone can qt 5 in a 10g?

Not recommended unless you have 5 x 1 inchers.
I would not go less then 20g for 5 x 2 inch quarantine/grow-outs for a short period...maybe a month.

...Ralph

[Bc chick]

Thanks guys

[William1]

No, don't go ten gallon tank. Be sensible. Bigger is always better. Twenty nine gallon tank minimum for any discus keeping. Breeders go twenty long for a pair. Im not real hip on that, but I'm not in it for the money.