Stressed and scared Discus

[rahul5781]

Hi All,
I am new to keeping Discus... With great help from some of the senior members of SD we finally setup our discus tank.. We got 13 juvenile from 2 good sources... Finished quarantine for both the batches.. Now they are all in th main tank.. The problem is they are very very scared... And run and hide behind the filters once we come in front of the tank or walk by... But once we leave they all come and eat the food.. And move around.. It's just that when they see ur or some movement they just run like crazy... Now a few of them color has turned a little black.. It's been 2 weeks since they are all together... Please help us with your expert suggestions..

[MD.David]

Color turning black is NOT good!
Need more information please.
Size of tank?
Planted?
Sub strait?
How much do you change your water?
Is the tank cycled?
Your filter setup?
How long tank up and running?
How many fish?
What kin of water?
•well?
•ph?
•city water?

This will help other members trouble shoot your issue.
But to me it sounds that they are very vey stressed over something that's going on with your water quality.
When a discus turns dark it's a very very bad sign.

[Second Hand Pat]

Beside the questions David is asking is the tank bare bottom? If yes, is the bottom and sides painted? Also do you have a window between you and the tank? Your shadow will freak them out if you walk between the tank and window. Another consideration is there any sunlight coming in the window? The light hitting you when you walk thru the sunlight can set them off also. Get some other considerations.
Pat

[William1]

For a short while, I was looking in the windows at my tank from the outside of the house to see if they were coming out without me around. It is normal. You didn't say how long they've been in their new surroundings, but I would suggest patience. (not patients). Be kind of careful in your movements around the tank at first. I once had a post titled 'how can I overcome skittishness?' With patience and consistent good care. Don't stress out or overreact. That is bad for fish and keeper alike. Have fun!

[Ryan925]

For a short while, I was looking in the windows at my tank from the outside of the house to see if they were coming out without me around. It is normal. You didn't say how long they've been in their new surroundings, but I would suggest patience. (not patients). Be kind of careful in your movements around the tank at first. I once had a post titled 'how can I overcome skittishness?' With patience and consistent good care. Don't stress out or overreact. That is bad for fish and keeper alike. Have fun!

I used to have to tip toe passed my tank. It's in a very high traffic area plus have a 5 year old that runs everywhere he goes.

Now it seems hardly anything spooks them. Only time I really startle them is closing the blinds on the nearest window too quickly.

Other than that I have to move them out of the way when I have my hands in the tank.

[Mattgoanna]

Maybe it has something to do with the number 13!
Suspect Pat is on the right track - light from above or other and non painted bare bottom will upset them every time.

[Filip]

Give them your best maintenance I.e. WCs and cleaning and just observe them for now . They can very likely regain their health and confidence by themselves within an week or two .
Post back again if they stop and refuse eating or their health and behavour deteriorates further.

[rahul5781]

Color turning black is NOT good!
Need more information please.
Size of tank?
Planted?
Sub strait?
How much do you change your water?
Is the tank cycled?
Your filter setup?
How long tank up and running?
How many fish?
What kin of water?
•well?
•ph?
•city water?

This will help other members trouble shoot your issue.
But to me it sounds that they are very vey stressed over something that's going on with your water quality.
When a discus turns dark it's a very very bad sign.

Hi David,
Size of tank? 42 x 18 x 18 ( all 3 side covered with white sticker)
Planted? Bare bottom
Sub strait?
How much do you change your water? 3 time a week 40%
Is the tank cycled?
Your filter setup? I have a sponge Filter and a Canister filter with ada filter media
How long tank up and running? 4 weeks
How many fish? 13 Juveniles
What kin of water? RO treated water - TDS is at 84
•well?
•ph? PH is at 7
•city water?
LED lighting

102104102105
102106

[rahul5781]

Beside the questions David is asking is the tank bare bottom? If yes, is the bottom and sides painted? Also do you have a window between you and the tank? Your shadow will freak them out if you walk between the tank and window. Another consideration is there any sunlight coming in the window? The light hitting you when you walk thru the sunlight can set them off also. Get some other considerations.
Pat

Hi Pat,

Yes there is window opposite to the Tank. Ok let me try and cover the window for a while till these guys settle. Its been 2 weeks since they have come into the main tank. I am planning to do an 80% water change in a couple of days. Lets see if the situation improves.

[FishFanMan]

It looks like you have a bit of bacterial bloom in the tank. With juvies and multiple feedings per day, I can see why you have a bloom if you're not doing big WC one or twice a day. I see you don't have a prefilter sponge on your canister. So you should be opening up the canister daily to clean your mechanical filter in there. What's your nitrate and ammonia level? I think your water is off and that's what is upsetting your juvies IMHO. Are they eating voraciously, they should be at that size. Personaly, I think you should grow them out in a smaller tank to make WCs easier and much more frequently. One last observation, you may want to raise your canister filter up a bit and shorten the hose. That will reduce head pressure and increase flow for better filtration. But I would to 100% wc now and do it daily. Water should be crystal clear. Good luck.

[Ryan925]

It looks like you have a bit of bacterial bloom in the tank. With juvies and multiple feedings per day, I can see why you have a bloom if you're not doing big WC one or twice a day. I see you don't have a prefilter sponge on your canister. So you should be opening up the canister daily to clean your mechanical filter in there. What's your nitrate and ammonia level? I think your water is off and that's what is upsetting your juvies IMHO. Are they eating voraciously, they should be at that size. Personaly, I think you should grow them out in a smaller tank to make WCs easier and much more frequently. One last observation, you may want to raise your canister filter up a bit and shorten the hose. That will reduce head pressure and increase flow for better filtration. But I would to 100% wc now and do it daily. Water should be crystal clear. Good luck.

Good call. I also thought the water looked pretty cloudy.

OP you said tank has been running 4 weeks and fish in it 2 weeks? Are you having ammonia and/or nitrite readings? If your tank was able to cycle in that 2 weeks prior to adding fish it may be cycling again with the addition of all that food and feces being added.

[MD.David]

IMHO, I would suggest it's a water quality issue.
Listen mate, I don't mean to be rube but start changing water!... Everyone here is saying change water, this is the fourth member I have commented on where their issue is not enough water changes.
Change 90% twice a day for the next four days, I bet 10 quid you have no more issues.

[rahul5781]

OK Fishman man, Ryan, David... I will do more water changes from now on.. I will be doing 90% tomorrow and continue 60% for a few days .. And see... Thanks guys... Really Appreciate it...

[bluelagoon]

Obviously,like mentioned your tank isn't cycled yet.It takes 4-6 weeks at least.Meanwhile,you will need to do extra large daily WC's up to 100%;aged water is better and only feed twice a day til you have no more nitrite reading.The tank is in what looks to be a bright lite high traffic area.

[Ryan925]

OK Fishman man, Ryan, David... I will do more water changes from now on.. I will be doing 90% tomorrow and continue 60% for a few days .. And see... Thanks guys... Really Appreciate it...

I'd recommend 80% daily at least especially if you have ammonia and nitrite readings.

My tank was established and cycled for months before I did a substrate change. After the change first thing I noticed was cloudy water and that's when I also had ammonia and nitrite readings suddenly. I did large daily WCs for about a week until my BB was able to catch back up and has been fine since.

I'd really suggest you test your water params daily until you get things in check.

[MD.David]

Here we are again, a person that just doesn't get it.
I'm done helping people that continue this resistant ideology of the value of water changes.



OK Fishman man, Ryan, David... I will do more water changes from now on.. I will be doing 90% tomorrow and continue 60% for a few days .. And see... Thanks guys... Really Appreciate it...

[rahul5781]

Hi All... After doing lots of water changes... These guys are much better now... Thanks David and rest of the members who had posted there suggestions... Really Appreciate

[Akili]

Hi All... After doing lots of water changes... These guys are much better now... Thanks David and rest of the members who had posted there suggestions... Really AppreciateNice to know !! You have to keep up with water changes,juveniles do better with consistent water changes.

[Filip]

Hi All... After doing lots of water changes... These guys are much better now... Thanks David and rest of the members who had posted there suggestions... Really Appreciate

Happy to hear they got better Rahul . Just keep up the good maintenance and they should do just fine.

[discusymphysodon]

Rahul,

Can you tell me where you bought your discus from.

[gnichols123]

Here we are again, a person that just doesn't get it.
I'm done helping people that continue this resistant ideology of the value of water changes.

Can I enquire how one does a 90% water change (particularly in a planted tank)? Doesn’t doing this stress the fish out - especially if it is being performed on a regular basis?

I have a planted discus tank (180L) and would love someone to tell me how to maintain NPK and micronutrients when doing regular (2+) water changes per week.

[Lido]

I am no microbiologist I can not advise you on how it works, it just does! I think the guys with heavily planted tanks are doing smaller than 90% maybe like 50% but they are doing them and the microbiology works.

My fish in particular get stressed more if I miss a water change. I am sure it isn't their favorite thing having the water to nearly nil, but they bounce back within minutes of the water going back in and are happy as a clam!

[Neptune]

Can I enquire how one does a 90% water change (particularly in a planted tank)? Doesn’t doing this stress the fish out - especially if it is being performed on a regular basis?

I have a planted discus tank (180L) and would love someone to tell me how to maintain NPK and micronutrients when doing regular (2+) water changes per week.

The million dollar planted discus tank question!:evilgrin:

I use root tabs but they do nothing for the NPK in the water column.

[rickztahone]

Can I enquire how one does a 90% water change (particularly in a planted tank)? Doesn’t doing this stress the fish out - especially if it is being performed on a regular basis?

I have a planted discus tank (180L) and would love someone to tell me how to maintain NPK and micronutrients when doing regular (2+) water changes per week.

In simple terms, this method does NOT work in a planted tank which depends on fertz. You have to make a choice whether or not the discus are more important or the plants.

This is why many people grow out their planted tanks and grow out their discus in a separate tank. A fert dosing regimen will not work if you keep stripping the nutrients on a daily basis.

With that said, the plants themselves serve as a good nutrient user and many times help the need for more frequent water changes. However, keep in mind that the plants themselves create knooks and crannies that trap detritus which once again cause your nitrates to rise.

It is a delicate balance, and one that I would leave to more advance aquarists. I almost tried it but after seeing how much work planted tanks with dosing/co2 injection and maintenance actually took, I backed out.

[Filip]

Can I enquire how one does a 90% water change (particularly in a planted tank)? Doesn’t doing this stress the fish out - especially if it is being performed on a regular basis?

I have a planted discus tank (180L) and would love someone to tell me how to maintain NPK and micronutrients when doing regular (2+) water changes per week.

Discus are not stressed at all if the new water has the same parameters and it is properly aged for outgassing an ph stabilizing purposes. They are hungry and can eat right after it so i guess that would mean that they take it well .

About the micro and macro ferts . PPS- pro method of daily dosing right after a waterchange would be the best bet IMO to combine with discus and their daily 90% waterchanges . Just put the ferts right after the WC and the plants will have their minimal daily needs fullfilled until the next waterchange after 24 hours .

[Willie]

Can I enquire how one does a 90% water change (particularly in a planted tank)? Doesn’t doing this stress the fish out - especially if it is being performed on a regular basis?

I have a planted discus tank (180L) and would love someone to tell me how to maintain NPK and micronutrients when doing regular (2+) water changes per week.

I think you've hit the nail on the head. You cannot do large water changes in a planted tank. Yet young discus, like the ones in this thread, will not survive and grow without large, frequent water changes. So when large water changes were done, the discus immediately responded. When the large water changes stop, this situation will recur. So we counsel not to raise young discus in planted tanks. But everyone believes that their situation is different.

Look at the photo section at the main forum and you'll see pictures of large water changes. I do 100% daily and there's absolutely no stress. The water quality in my tank never change. The quality of the fresh water is the entire Minnesota Valley Water Drainage System, which is fed by the Mississippi River. When the fish in my breeders start to clean their cone, they get a 100% water change immediately. They typically spawn within 2 hours later and the eggs hatch under pristine conditions. No stress.

Can you keep discus in a planted tank? You can if you stick to adults that have little to no more growth left.

Willie