need advice.

[honorer]

hi guys, im from jakarta,
this is the first time im keeping discus fish, today i have bought 5 discus size 3-3,5", plan to add more fish later.
question is, can i keep it together with arowana fish and stingray ?
tank size is 2,75 meter x 1,5 meter x 0,5 meter, sump filtration with 6000lph water pump. medium strong water current on the tank.

am i need to move it to the just a discus on it, or leave it like that setup guys.

here is the video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrDMIxZ2j8k

[Kyla]

ive known arowana to grab and kill fish that couldnt fit in their mouths... id be wary about keeping discus with them because of this possibility. thats a massive tank and i feel that the little group of discus would feel calmer in a smaller space. i know ive seen pics of discus and aros in the same tank but its just not something i would personally try.

[William1]

I don't think you are going to find many, in fact any, people on this forum who think plunking a handful of discus into that tank is a good idea. But, I could be wrong. It's a free world. My opinion is just a whisper in the wind of cyberspace. Discus are just fish. Kind of pricey, but there will always be more. If you choose to make them a food source for other fish, or fertilizer for your mums, who can stop you? That said, I would make another plan.

[atlantadiscus]

Only thing missing from that tank is a school of red belly Piranha!

[Ryan925]

only thing missing from that tank is a school of red belly piranha!
lmao!

[LizStreithorst]

The theory is that that the Arawona inhabit the the top of the water, the Rays are mostly on the bottom, and the Discus hang out in the middle. I don't think that there is enough room in the middle for the Discus. Also, there a lot of Arawona in there. It would be way cool if you could make this work. All the fish need the same water parameters. I know you must have paid a bundle for that tank. IMO it's not tall enough to give the Discus a space to feel comfortable in the middle with those predators swimming right on top of them.

Let us know how it works out for you.

[Filip]

Hi honorer . You got a nice swimingpool for fish going on there :).
Im very curious about how do you filter this pool , how do you wipe it , how much water do you change and are WCs automated etc. ?

As for discus with arowana and stringrays . I dont have any experience my self , but from what i have seen and read about from the net , people ussualy keep a big batch of discus fish with only one arowana or a stringray.
The reasoning behind is that such a big and hectic fish as Aros can make discus feel insecure and jumpy and keeping only one Aro along with many discus sort of lower this Discus insecure feeling .

Anyway you have an interesting tank and fish combo. and i would like to follow this experience of yours if you open a journal thread in our section for introducing tanks .

[atlantadiscus]

Yes,please tell us about your filter-that is some awesome current flying across the top layer of water.

[Filip]

Yes,please tell us about your filter-that is some awesome current flying across the top layer of water.

This is kind of awkward since OP stated his flow is only 1500 GPH for a 500 gallon tank .Thats only 3 turnovers per hour.
Pretty poor circulation IMO and yet the water surface on the video splashes more than on the reef tanks .

[honorer]

ok thanks for the comment all,

this tank filtration consist of..maybe more closed to wet and dry system i think,
sump tank size is 1,2meter x 0,6 meter x 0,5 meter, just only 2 chamber.. water input from the tank throught 3 layers fine spoon into the first chamber that contain bioball and spoon on dry area, and japmat, 1 kg K1, momotaro bio house on wet area.
return pump with 1 aquasyncro 6000lpm, the output pipe is on water surface so water flow is created inside the tank. if i using 2 pump for return, water flow inside the tank is too strong, so to overcome low circulation turnover im doing 2 times wc per week, 50% every wednesday and 80% every sunday,

problem is, discus fish cant make it because the flow, most of the time they swim heavily against water flow, and they are to slow to scramble eat against aros and rays.
i think need to modified the output pipe to reduce water flow inside right so they can swim comfortable.

[Filip]

You can just use a spraybar on your output to distribute the flow more evenly through the tank .
I got 500 gpg canister with a spraybar + 300 gph power head = 800 gph alltogether ,almost same as yours on my 65 gallon tank and my water is still not too turbulent for discus to swim in it.

[honorer]

You can just use a spraybar on your output to distribute the flow more evenly through the tank .
I got 500 gpg canister with a spraybar + 300 gph power head = 800 gph alltogether ,almost same as yours on my 65 gallon tank and my water is still not too turbulent for discus to swim in it.

i did.. has been trying to change the output with 45 deg elbow, and therenot much water current anymore,
tomorrow i add pvc pipe to move the pump output to the other tank side.

now im thinking about it food, what is the best for given condition,
i need food that aros and ray dont like it but acceptable for discus to growth
my only option about pellet is

1. New Life Spectrum Spectrumax Finicky Fish Formula
2. Tetra bit
3. medi aqua fish food
4. saki hikari grow / Konishi

i dont know if possible or not discus fish feeded with pellet for koi fish:confused: forget it about BF because i cant make it..

here is the update after 24 hours on my tank.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaz8W5NMZ_I

[Filip]

I would put Tetra discus bits from your above mentioned alternatives.
I would feed them heavily for discus to eat enough on every meal and would turn the filters off while feeding for discus to feel more confident in catching food .
Koi pellets? They might be possible but not sure they are recomended . If they were for discus they wouldnt have been named "Koi pellets" , thats just my personal oppinion .i wouldnt use them as a staple diet , thats for sure .

[honorer]

i think is impossible to keep discus on this tank without make them stunted, they dont want to eat tetrabits, only accept freeze blood worm, an they are too slow to compete with aros for food.

so im making the new tank just for discus,
only 1m x 0,6m x 0,5m size,

102604

[Fishes]

If you know who The King of DIY is, you can check out his old videos where he basically had one Asian Arowana, 2 BD Stingrays, and maybe like 6-10 discus all in a 4 ft x 4 ft tank that worked pretty well.

[MD.David]

I see your long fish with a big mouth are going to eventually have a pancake dinner.

[Kyla]

i think giving them their own tank is an excellent decision.

[Filip]

i think is impossible to keep discus on this tank without make them stunted, they dont want to eat tetrabits, only accept freeze blood worm, an they are too slow to compete with aros for food.

so im making the new tank just for discus,
only 1m x 0,6m x 0,5m size,

102604

I honor your decession honorer :). You seem like a dedicated fish keeper with this move .
it was the only right thing to do right from the start of this thread ,but its great that you figure it by your self .
Good luck raising your discus , and keep on asking questions here and learning about discus .

[honorer]

If you know who The King of DIY is, you can check out his old videos where he basically had one Asian Arowana, 2 BD Stingrays, and maybe like 6-10 discus all in a 4 ft x 4 ft tank that worked pretty well.

yes sure its work on him, because there is only 1 aro on the tank,


I see your long fish with a big mouth are going to eventually have a pancake dinner.

no its size is doesnt fit on aros mouth


i think giving them their own tank is an excellent decision.

actually separated discus on their own tank is not satisfy me,
its make me headache to arranged the space available for new tank, and become more work to me bacause i need to installing the plumbing so all tank can using the same sump.



I honor your decession honorer :). You seem like a dedicated fish keeper with this move .
it was the only right thing to do right from the start of this thread ,but its great that you figure it by your self .
Good luck raising your discus , and keep on asking questions here and learning about discus .

the only thing that scares me is the stunted discus :(
i fell my discus is not getting enough food since the first day on my tank.

[Kyla]

i have another suggestion. get a large clear plexiglass or acrylic sheet that spans the width of the tank and extends upwards past the water's surface. u could place this sheet across the tank, maybe 15 inches back from the front glass, and then put only the discus in the front "tank" area and the larger rays and aros could live in the back "tank". u may need to get creative with water flow but a spray bar could help to bring flow where u want it. u could keep the front water movement minimal for the discus and direct more outflow to the large back area for the aros and rays. this way u could look into the tank and see all the fish and they would appear to be "together" in the tank and u would only need to maintain one single system. u could also feed them separately to ensure the discus got enough to eat. u could drill some holes in the divider to allow flow across it as well. it might take some creative thinking but i bet u could make it work :)

[camthi609]

I second Kyla's option. I've had arowanas before and they are very fast growing carnivore, and having them out numbered the discus in the tank is an invitation to disaster. I've had 10 discus in a tank w/my arowana before and before long, he was looking at them as f00d. The difference ratio should be 10 dis to 1 aro but still, once the your aro is passed the 15" mark, I would not trust anything in it's sight less then doubled the size of his jaws.
i have another suggestion. get a large clear plexiglass or acrylic sheet that spans the width of the tank and extends upwards past the water's surface. u could place this sheet across the tank, maybe 15 inches back from the front glass, and then put only the discus in the front "tank" area and the larger rays and aros could live in the back "tank". u may need to get creative with water flow but a spray bar could help to bring flow where u want it. u could keep the front water movement minimal for the discus and direct more outflow to the large back area for the aros and rays. this way u could look into the tank and see all the fish and they would appear to be "together" in the tank and u would only need to maintain one single system. u could also feed them separately to ensure the discus got enough to eat. u could drill some holes in the divider to allow flow across it as well. it might take some creative thinking but i bet u could make it work :)

[Filip]

Great idea Kyla .
Semi closed tank in a tank ,or in a pool in this case :) . That way the discus gets piece from the beasts , low flow , enough food , and you get to maintain only your current system .

[honorer]

i have another suggestion. get a large clear plexiglass or acrylic sheet that spans the width of the tank and extends upwards past the water's surface. u could place this sheet across the tank, maybe 15 inches back from the front glass, and then put only the discus in the front "tank" area and the larger rays and aros could live in the back "tank". u may need to get creative with water flow but a spray bar could help to bring flow where u want it. u could keep the front water movement minimal for the discus and direct more outflow to the large back area for the aros and rays. this way u could look into the tank and see all the fish and they would appear to be "together" in the tank and u would only need to maintain one single system. u could also feed them separately to ensure the discus got enough to eat. u could drill some holes in the divider to allow flow across it as well. it might take some creative thinking but i bet u could make it work :)

no its not work kyla, i dont like see my tank got divider like that,
i think discus is not yet aclimated on the tank, lately they all swim all around the tank, chasing the food,
but i already make the other tank, so i think way not to used it.

[honorer]

to day all fish moving to the new tank, i think its not big enough for 12 discus :(
they all on the tank corner, not acclimated yet, is the same behavior like previous, need a week for they become active:confused:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIYhKM9BW7E

[honorer]

updating my fish after 24 hour on they own tank


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpVlMvFIUyk

[Kyla]

they should come around. the tank is very simple and clean, and it looks big enough for ur discus in the video... how many gallons does it hold?

[honorer]

they should come around. the tank is very simple and clean, and it looks big enough for ur discus in the video... how many gallons does it hold?

about 78 us gallon kyla

but look like 1 a tiny melon is not right, red color on it body become pale, not all just a patch,
is it sick, should i move it to quarantine tank kyla?
what should i do guys, i concern about my rays because discus tank and aros/rays tank is used the same filtration :huh:

[Second Hand Pat]

about 78 us gallon kyla

but look like 1 a tiny melon is not right, red color on it body become pale, not all just a patch,
is it sick, should i move it to quarantine tank kyla?
what should i do guys, i concern about my rays because discus tank and aros/rays tank is used the same filtration :huh:

You can put your discus on sponge filters however keep in mind two things; first off you have already cross contaminated the discus and the rays and second, the sponge filters will not be cycled. Pulling the discus off the main sump will make it easier to treat in the future if needed.
Pat

[Filip]

You can put your discus on sponge filters however keep in mind two things; first off you have already cross contaminated the discus and the rays and second, the sponge filters will not be cycled. Pulling the discus off the main sump will make it easier to treat in the future if needed.
Pat

Great advice here given from Pat , Honorer . I would try to separate the filtration in the discus tank too . That way you can do 90% daily changes , bump up temps, put salt and treat medications if further needed.
So far just keep them in a perfectly clean enviroment , Change a lots of water daily and observe their further behavour.

[honorer]

Great advice here given from Pat , Honorer . I would try to separate the filtration in the discus tank too . That way you can do 90% daily changes , bump up temps, put salt and treat medications if further needed.
So far just keep them in a perfectly clean enviroment , Change a lots of water daily and observe their further behavour.


You can put your discus on sponge filters however keep in mind two things; first off you have already cross contaminated the discus and the rays and second, the sponge filters will not be cycled. Pulling the discus off the main sump will make it easier to treat in the future if needed.
Pat

im thinking to separate the filtration, but dont know what filtration to use.
dont have a space available for the sump, what if the overhead filters, or just using sponge filters.

all discus is eat like usual except 1 the melon is on problem, it stomach so big like had been eating, color is pale, and always hanging on tank corner.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4L_Kw9OXgBE

any sign of sick fish looking at the vid bros ?

[Second Hand Pat]

If the red melon's belly is swollen then it may have bloat. Generally you add Epsom salt to the water at one or two tablespoons per 10 gallons for 24 hours as it is a laxative and aids in passing stuff. Not sure how to do this with without dosing everything. http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?25743-Difference-between-Epsom-salt-and-regular-salt.
Pat

[Filip]

They look OK to me from the Video honorer , except maybe for the 2 discus in the back ( melon and pigeon) that barely moved during the whole video.

You can use 2 sponge filters , Hob or a canister , whatever you have on hand , just make sure to put seeded sponge from the main filtration along with the new materials .

[honorer]

If the red melon's belly is swollen then it may have bloat. Generally you add Epsom salt to the water at one or two tablespoons per 10 gallons for 24 hours as it is a laxative and aids in passing stuff. Not sure how to do this with without dosing everything. http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?25743-Difference-between-Epsom-salt-and-regular-salt.
Pat

thanks pat,
1 melon and 1 pigeon that look like on trouble, has been return to the LFS this morning.
i changing it with the other fish other strain to complete the collection on my tank.
i dont have time to treat a sick fish.:D


They look OK to me from the Video honorer , except maybe for the 2 discus in the back ( melon and pigeon) that barely moved during the whole video.

You can use 2 sponge filters , Hob or a canister , whatever you have on hand , just make sure to put seeded sponge from the main filtration along with the new materials .

i have make a new sump for the discus tank, maybe tomorrow will be connected.

and this is the video today,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39J0gbaAQL0

[Filip]

Great video Honorer. They look more coloured from the previous video and seems to like their new surroundings and water . They look promising batch of discus , and you have made the right decision giving them their own tank and taking care of their needs separately from the monsters that you have in the other tank (pool) :)

I have yet to see a LFS that takes back sick discus in his own tanks . Although he made you a big favour , I think his move was highly unprofessional , especially if he plop them back for sale in the tank with his other discus .

[honorer]

Great video Honorer. They look more coloured from the previous video and seems to like their new surroundings and water . They look promising batch of discus , and you have made the right decision giving them their own tank and taking care of their needs separately from the monsters that you have in the other tank (pool) :)

I have yet to see a LFS that takes back sick discus in his own tanks . Although he made you a big favour , I think his move was highly unprofessional , especially if he plop them back for sale in the tank with his other discus .

no filip, LFS guys dont put the sick discus back for sale,he quarantine the sick fish with the other,


update my fish today

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUu72P5F39M

filtration is using sump for its own. feed the BB from biomedia on the old sump.
dont know i feeding them enough food or not, feeding regime is FBW on the morning, tetrabits on afternoon, and at night with FBW again.
i dont like they body shape, i think not so rounded.:confused:
i will add the more strain on thursday,

[honorer]

updating my discus


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4t6GkIYMWSg

has been add 3 more golden discus yesterday, sizes 3", same size with the melon before,
now melons is more than 3", so i think all my discus is growing:)

[Filip]

They look good Honorer. I like the shape of your biggest checkerboard discus.

However I'm concerned about their heavy breathing in the video and also their idle behaviour .
If this video is not taken right after a big Water change or some other change that stressed them in some way and caused the heavy breathing and their stiffness, I would be concerned about their health .
Otherwise your tank and water look very clean .

[honorer]

just update my fish..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPBXxKddIRQ

not good in shape, just recovering from the bad water condition after im doing a trip for a week,
bacuse one fish is died make the water become more worst.

they lost the appetite before, now appetite is not fully recover, 90% wc is done every 2 days, has been treat them with 1ppm PK for 2 days, and increase the temp to 30 deg c.
hope they will recover soon.

[Filip]

Hope that they will recover from the shock soon Honorer.
Some of them shaped up really round and nice .
What's the 1 ppm PK treatment ?
Are you referring to Pottasium permanganate?

[honorer]

Hope that they will recover from the shock soon Honorer.
Some of them shaped up really round and nice .
What's the 1 ppm PK treatment ?
Are you referring to Pottasium permanganate?

ops my fault, we call pottasium permaganate is PK here, so yes its PP.

no i dont like the shape filip, it more look like oval shape or triangle shape than round shape.
what your suggest for make it better filip, how i can increase the appetite ?
is 30 deg c temp is enough or more higher ?

[Filip]

Just elevated temps and fresh water should be enough to get their lost appetite back IMO ,Honorer .Observe their poop colour too .
I have kept temps. to 32-33 C for + 2 weeks without any issues, trying to enhance appetite .
Discus can withstand even 35-36 C for a couple of days-weeks , but you have absolutely no reason to do that , its just for your reassurance.