How to cycle discus tank for high bioload?

[DOJOLOACH23]

I was reading the sticky on bioload and while I understand this, I have one question I couldn't find the answer for:

- If I am to start a new 55 gallon bb tank, lets assume I have had the tank running for a month. How will it go if I just randomly add in 8-10 juvie 3" discus? That is a high bioload for an otherwise zero bioload tank? Assuming Ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates are all at zero.

When starting the cycle do I need to place food in the tank to start growth of beneficial bacteria on the sponge filters and HOB filter (So the food breaks down for the bacteria to consume)? Or do I cycle with some fish, then remove those fish so the filters bacteria levels are high enough to account for the large increase in fish waste from the group of discus?

I know discus like to be kept in groups so I can't just add one discus at a time.

Can anyone provide clarity or a link on this? I couldn't seem to find a thread

[pitdogg2]

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I've used both Dr. Tims and Marineland which Dr. Tim developed for Marineland before he went out on his own.

I've heard good about the Fritz #7 but it has been years since I used it. It is different than it was 30yrs ago.

You could also add PURE ammonia to your tank until the bio sets up it take a lot longer. With the additives its pretty instantaneous but I would not change water for at least a week to let the bacteria get set up and established. Make sure your tank has had water conditioner before adding additives. I would set up AQ and three days later add bacteria then fish same or next day.

[Phillydubs]

You should research cycle methods... typically there is a fish cycle as you mentioned, you sue some "starter" fish per say and get them in there to feed the BB and do water changes. Most people say not to go this route because then you could be contaminating the tank before you even begin.

The fish-less cycle would be one like mr P. Dogg explains above. You use either a packaged chemical such as the links he provided or some people feed it with just household products the old school way.

Either way you need to feed and build the bacteria, either with chemicals or live creatures...

Once you have established this and can test it based on your levels and how fast the amonia diminishes then you know if the tank is cycled and ready...

Also, some people will start with some form of BB from where they get the fish, they will ask the breeder or supplier to send a "seeded sponge" again, some may say a risky move cause now you are using someone elses BB, but others say if you are only adding fish that are used to that BB then it works if its mixed with other fish could cause issue if those new fish since they have never been exposed to whats in that sample.

Once you add a group of fish, no matter what, it will be a shock to the system and you should always be ready to stay on top of big water changes in the early weeks/months of a tank starting

[DOJOLOACH23]

Thanks for the replies, so far I have this as my setup and procedure:

I read a lot about some members afraid of cross contamination from "sue" fish, other filter bacteria, etc. This seems a bit excessive to me if my other tanks are perfectly healthy. Although no fish from big petshops to say the least!

-Clean tank using 99% rubbing/isopropyl alcohol (which should just evaporate and only need a light rinse), vinegar water to clean hard water deposits on top and around rim. Rinse tank again.
-Put existing beneficial bacteria from other tank filters onto the new filters in the 55BB to help kickstart bacteria. I know this could be a source of cross contamination as well, but I feel like it is somewhat overkill? (I currently have these filters running on an empty 20 gallon with fluorite substrate now)
-Run filters on 55BB tank, sponge filters, airstones, heater, etc.
-Put proper amount of ammonia in (yet to be determined) to help promote more beneficial bacteria growth to manage the higher bioload of more fish.
-Wait for ammonia to cycle to nitrites, then to nitrates.
-50% Water change
-Check nitrates level to check safety level.
-Add in one Dojoloach from my other tank (He will be a growout buddy with the discus because I want to see him get BIG, also extremely hardy)
-Watch water for a few days
-Water change to get ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates zero'd out.
-Add 6-10 2-3" Juvenile discus of a domesticated strain from internet source.

I can see this process taking 3 weeks since I am starting with a bit of preexisting beneficial bacteria.

I also understand that nomatter what amount of bioload my beneficial bacteria in the tank can handle, as long as I do water changes I will be OK. But too much water changes won't let the bioload develop enough.

Does this all sound decent?

[Hart24601]

Fishless cycle is the best as you can set how much bioload the tank can process. For example you dose ammonia to 1ppm and wait until it's at 0 and you have nitrates. At this point you can dose 1ppm and if the next day it's 0 you know the tank can process 1ppm ammonia a day. If you suspect a high bioload you can increase this to 3 or 5 ppm per day.

If the tank can process 5ppm ammonia per day that is a lot and you can be sure it's way overkill. Probably best to stick with 1ppm, but as I stated that is the great part of fishless cycle with ammonia, you know how much the tank can handle.

[Fish Tank Travis]

I agree with the fishless cycle. I have used it before and it does take a while, but it's the best way to ensure that you will have sufficient BB colony and not cause harm to any fish.

The way I found to do it, and the way I did it, is to get everything cleaned completely and set it up. Fill with dechlorinated water. Then, using pure ammonia from a hardware store, dose ammonia up to 4ppm. Now, just let it sit and wait for the BB colony to start. Test your water every other day until you start to see your ammonia dropping. Once this happens, test your water every day and redose the ammonia up to 4ppm as needed. You will see a nitrite spike. After a while you will start to see the nitrite decrease and nitrate increase. Keep dosing the aquarium up to 4ppm ammonia daily, or at least every other day, during this process. Once the BB can convert 4ppm ammonia completely into nitrate within a 24 hour period, your finished. Then, you will want to do a series of large water over the next 24-48 hours, not all at once, to bring the nitrates down to near zero. Once the nitrates are down to almost zero, you can add the fish. This whole process can take 6-8 weeks but it's the best all around and natural process you can use.

[CammieTime]

Do the best you can with the above procedures and you should be fine. Instant bacteria in a can aka Tetra Safe Start may be placebo effect.

[Willie]

When your tank starts to cycle, you'll see a big bacterial bloom. The water will get very cloudy. When it clears, typically within 24 hours, the tank is cycled. You can make chemical measurements, but it's just as easy to eyeball it.

Or you can just get a cycled sponge from someone in your area. I usually offer newbies sponges from my tank.

Willie

[Ash92]

When your tank starts to cycle, you'll see a big bacterial bloom. The water will get very cloudy. When it clears, typically within 24 hours, the tank is cycled. You can make chemical measurements, but it's just as easy to eyeball it.

Or you can just get a cycled sponge from someone in your area. I usually offer newbies sponges from my tank.

Willie

Hi I'm cycling my tank now and it's bin 3 day 4 days tomorrow and my water has gone cloudy but surly my water isn't cycled yet? I use water life ammonia and nitrite formula it contains beneficial bacteria

[Filip]

Hi I'm cycling my tank now and it's bin 3 day 4 days tomorrow and my water has gone cloudy but surly my water isn't cycled yet? I use water life ammonia and nitrite formula it contains beneficial bacteria

Leave the botteled Bacteria for 2-3 days without any WCs to give it a time to colonize your filter materials .
After that 3 day period change 90-100% dechlorinated water and your water should becone crystal clean , if the botteled bacteria product is working .

[Willie]

Hi I'm cycling my tank now and it's bin 3 day 4 days tomorrow and my water has gone cloudy but surly my water isn't cycled yet? I use water life ammonia and nitrite formula it contains beneficial bacteria

I can't speak to your bacterial cycle without more information. But as a Ph.D. microbiologist, I can tell you that bacteria in a bottle in nonsensical.

Willie