Jack Wattley Discus in Miami, FL

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Hi all,

I'm looking to add some red Discus to my 180gal and currently DiscusUSA is low on stock. A friend talked to me about their recent visit to Jack Wattley Discus in Miami, Florida. Funny that I never found them in my previous searches but they sound really good to me. Talked to Gabe there and everything needed to ship to me checks out fine.

Anyone have any thoughts or experience with this supplier?

Thanks,
Kenny

[dilldiscus]

Hi all,

I'm looking to add some red Discus to my 180gal and currently DiscusUSA is low on stock. A friend talked to me about their recent visit to Jack Wattley Discus in Miami, Florida. Funny that I never found them in my previous searches but they sound really good to me. Talked to Gabe there and everything needed to ship to me checks out fine.

Anyone have any thoughts or experience with this supplier?

Thanks,
Kenny

I hear the discus from him are good quality at a good price. I might buy my first discus from him soon.

[Lido]

Jack Wattley is a legend in Discus. If you look for a book on these fish, he probably wrote it. He was the go to man for knowledge on the fish in the 1980's. I know a lot has changed since those books but none the less. He has good quality fish and a sound operation. I wouldn't hesitate to buy from him.

[Willie]

Jack sold his business to Gabe almost 25 years ago and no longer has any connection. Gabe is an importer and also raises discus from other people's fry.

Nothing against Gabe, but my recommendation is to go with the sponsors here. If they ship less than top quality discus, everyone on this forum is going to know about it. They have to be super careful on quality to stay in business.

Willie

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Jack sold his business to Gabe almost 25 years ago and no longer has any connection. Gabe is an importer and also raises discus from other people's fry.

Nothing against Gabe, but my recommendation is to go with the sponsors here. If they ship less than top quality discus, everyone on this forum is going to know about it. They have to be super careful on quality to stay in business.

Willie

Thanks Willie,

I'm restricted by my shipping logistics and local import requirements. I first looked into the sponsors in Florida but couldn't find one that had a good stock of domestics (non-wilds). Unfortunately none of the other sponsors would work for me. It's too bad since I'd love to order from Kenny's Discus who was my top choice.

[DYDave82]

Adrian, check out my tank journal. My trials and tribulations have been a bit embarrassing but the latest videos are getting better. I nabbed some Red Pandas from Gabe and they have been great. Amazingly peaceful temperament and really hardy, thank goodness. My only complaint is a very little bit of peppering on a few of their noses.

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Adrian, check out my tank journal. My trials and tribulations have been a bit embarrassing but the latest videos are getting better. I nabbed some Red Pandas from Gabe and they have been great. Amazingly peaceful temperament and really hardy, thank goodness. My only complaint is a very little bit of peppering on a few of their noses.

David,

I'll check it out, thanks.

EDIT: wow those Red Pandas look beautiful. How is their color now, are they still turning more yellow or did their deep red color come back? What do you think caused the color change?

[warblad79]

Jack sold his business to Gabe almost 25 years ago and no longer has any connection. Gabe is an importer and also raises discus from other people's fry.

Nothing against Gabe, but my recommendation is to go with the sponsors here. If they ship less than top quality discus, everyone on this forum is going to know about it. They have to be super careful on quality to stay in business.

Willie

Someone mentioned at FB Gabe was using Jack wattley's name for his leverage.

[DYDave82]

David,

I'll check it out, thanks.

EDIT: wow those Red Pandas look beautiful. How is their color now, are they still turning more yellow or did their deep red color come back? What do you think caused the color change?

A slight change in diet and placement in a much larger (appropriate sized tank) made the their colors shift to the intense red in the latest video (also the blue light helps their color pop -- but the previous video was under a red light so the change is legit=). I have been very happy with Gabe's stock and his customer service. Why he doesn't sponsor here, one could only guess. I will say that after all I've learned here it is clear that his discus are mostly imported. Are these Pandas direct descendants of Wattley's -- probably not. I do enjoy them though. My advice at this point is to be sure to settle on one breeder/ importer as it can be very time consuming and stressful to mix recklessly.

[Lido]

Jack sold his business to Gabe almost 25 years ago and no longer has any connection. Gabe is an importer and also raises discus from other people's fry.

Nothing against Gabe, but my recommendation is to go with the sponsors here. If they ship less than top quality discus, everyone on this forum is going to know about it. They have to be super careful on quality to stay in business.



Willie

Hey willie, I didn't know he had no connection anymore. That's good to know. I'll PM you about something regarding discus.

[adrian31@outlook.com]

A slight change in diet and placement in a much larger (appropriate sized tank) made the their colors shift to the intense red in the latest video (also the blue light helps their color pop -- but the previous video was under a red light so the change is legit=). I have been very happy with Gabe's stock and his customer service. Why he doesn't sponsor here, one could only guess. I will say that after all I've learned here it is clear that his discus are mostly imported. Are these Pandas direct descendants of Wattley's -- probably not. I do enjoy them though. My advice at this point is to be sure to settle on one breeder/ importer as it can be very time consuming and stressful to mix recklessly.

I considered the drawback of ordering from a different supplier this time around. Still waiting for some videos from Gabe of his larger reds to see if he has some that I want.

[F-cotterell]

We ordered some striated turqoise from Gabe. The fish arrive in excellent shape and were more than we expected. He sent us a six inch male and he is gorgeous. He rules the tank. We will be ordering from him again soon.
Fred

[adrian31@outlook.com]

We ordered some striated turqoise from Gabe. The fish arrive in excellent shape and were more than we expected. He sent us a six inch male and he is gorgeous. He rules the tank. We will be ordering from him again soon.
Fred

Sounds nice. Do you have any pictures you could post?

[TexMoHoosier]

Jack sold his business to Gabe almost 25 years ago and no longer has any connection. Gabe is an importer and also raises discus from other people's fry.

Jack Wattley is 93 or 94 now. He and Gabe are still friends, but I think he has been retired for a long time.

I've never heard anywhere that he was importing and selling other peoples' fry. I do know that he at least breeds some as he's mentioned his hatchery several times and I even bought one of a pair that he was not getting what he wanted out of. He keeps a lot of Jack's classic lines going like his classic turqs. I believe coeruleas and some pandas are also Wattley originals, which Gabe still has.

I have nothing but good things to say about Gabe. I've bought all of my discus from him and have been very happy with them. He is personable and has always been responsive.

[Poppa Ryno]

Yes Jack is retired. Yes the company sold to gabe after a long friendship & partnership. Yes gabe still breeds his own fish. Last time i spoke with gabe he was NOT importing. Gabe has multiple hatcheries between florida & NJ.

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Yes Jack is retired. Yes the company sold to gabe after a long friendship & partnership. Yes gabe still breeds his own fish. Last time i spoke with gabe he was NOT importing. Gabe has multiple hatcheries between florida & NJ.

Gabe told me he was visiting another one of his hatcheries to see if he can fulfill my order, since I'm looking for seven Discus >5.5" or larger. He's supposed to send me videos/pics today of what he has.

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Wattley Discus Update: I selected eight discus from the pics & videos Gabe sent me, which I received yesterday:

Three 5.5"-6" Rafflesia
Three 5.5"-6" Red Marlboro
Two 6" Blue Leopard Panda Cross

Upon unpacking I was a little surprised to see that I received the actual fish I had selected from them. I still have to examine them more closely today, but upon initial inspection before putting their lights out they are beautiful - shape & colors. And really large. The two Blue Leopard Panda Crosses are the largest at a little over 6"- sparse red spots on white, really nice. I will post pics of all in a couple of days hopefully.

At this point I am giving Wattley Discus a big thumbs up. Gabe there certainly delivered for me.

I previously received two shipments of Discus from DiscusUSA a few months ago. They tried to be helpful I think but I was not satisfied with about half the fish I received from them for a number of reasons. Even at this early stage I can rate Wattley Discus over them in key areas of importance.

[DISCUS STU]

I don't know if there's anymore for me to add but I've been dealing with Gabe at Wattley's for many years at this point. Obviously I'm a supporter and have purchased many fish from Gabe whom I've always found to be very helpful and generous with him time and attention.

In the last month I've also purchased a wild Blue Heckel and Green Tefe Discus from him, both are great and I'm glad he's picked up wilds as well. I've also purchased some great adolescent Altum Angels from him at affordable prices, which can't always be said for other suppliers that also sell false, phony Altums.

When I was there a little while ago he was busy taking pictures of his fish to send to a customer in Canada so they could get a better idea of what they would buy. This type of thing definitely works for me.

[DatDiscusDude]

Sounds like you got some nice fish, I am looking forward to seeing pictures... Those fancy panda crossed named guys you got sound very nice and different... Stop teasing! Lets see!

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Sounds like you got some nice fish, I am looking forward to seeing pictures... Those fancy panda crossed named guys you got sound very nice and different... Stop teasing! Lets see!

This is a pic of my fish while still at their store, he said it was ok to post it here. The two in the foreground are the actual ones I have. Their name is actually 'Leopard Blue Panda Cross'

107960

[DISCUS STU]

This is a pic of my fish while still at their store, he said it was ok to post it here. The two in the foreground are the actual ones I have. Their name is actually 'Leopard Blue Panda Cross'

107960

Really nice. I saw this tank when I was there a few week ago.

[DYDave82]

I have to say after a couple months of having Wattley's Red Pandas; they are by far my favorite discus. And despite their already great size when I received them (about 4.5" ; I ordered 3" btw and he hooked me up) they are still growing at a nice clip. My other discus, in another tank is all DiscusUSA growing super but at this point I wonder if they will ever reach the Pandas in color brilliance. I'm not sure where all the wattley push back comes from -- at this point -- I have zero negative things to say about his fish.

[Ryan925]

Wattley Discus Update: I selected eight discus from the pics & videos Gabe sent me, which I received yesterday:

Three 5.5"-6" Rafflesia
Three 5.5"-6" Red Marlboro
Two 6" Blue Leopard Panda Cross

Upon unpacking I was a little surprised to see that I received the actual fish I had selected from them. I still have to examine them more closely today, but upon initial inspection before putting their lights out they are beautiful - shape & colors. And really large. The two Blue Leopard Panda Crosses are the largest at a little over 6"- sparse red spots on white, really nice. I will post pics of all in a couple of days hopefully.

At this point I am giving Wattley Discus a big thumbs up. Gabe there certainly delivered for me.

I previously received two shipments of Discus from DiscusUSA a few months ago. They tried to be helpful I think but I was not satisfied with about half the fish I received from them for a number of reasons. Even at this early stage I can rate Wattley Discus over them in key areas of importance.

Look forward to seeing them.

And after reading this thread ...man there are some haters here....

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Look forward to seeing them.

And after reading this thread ...man there are some haters here....

Hi Ryan,

My daughter is supposed to take some pics tonight.

RE: haters: I do get that feeling myself. For myself I'm just rating my personal experiences. And I know these will vary for others. The main points I considered were advertised vs actual size of fish, price, and whether fish had visible defects that never resolved over time.

[smsimcik]

Look forward to seeing them.

And after reading this thread ...man there are some haters here....

I've read this whole thread and I'm not sure what haters you're referring to. Seems like everyone on here loves Gabe and his fish.

[Ryan925]

I've read this whole thread and I'm not sure what haters you're referring to. Seems like everyone on here loves Gabe and his fish.

Maybe I read something different but it looked to me certain posts were making accusations about Gabe from what they heard or read on the almighty facebook

It would seem to me people that have first hand experience with him has great things to say...

Anyway don't want to hijack this thread with more of the same nonsense that goes on here. I don't think that's fair to Kenny.

Look forward to seeing those fish Kenny

[adrian31@outlook.com]

Maybe I read something different but it looked to me certain posts were making accusations about Gabe from what they heard or read on the almighty facebook

I definitely get that Ryan, imo just so long as they don't cross the line.

[adrian31@outlook.com]

I posted pics of my new fish at the end of my other thread in the Tank Journals section:

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?126455-My-10-Discus-arrived&p=1255769#post1255769

[Ryan]

Maybe I read something different but it looked to me certain posts were making accusations about Gabe from what they heard or read on the almighty facebook

It would seem to me people that have first hand experience with him has great things to say...

The issue is that Gabe used to sell the fish as Wattley fish, with certificates, even though they were not being bred by him. They were imported from Asia. It was false advertising, and IMO it's unethical to misrepresent something you're selling. Jack Wattley made a name for himself by being a discus pioneer and creating the bases of many of the most popular strains today, and all Gabe is doing is using that name to move fish. He's not putting in the same work and dedication that Jack did to maintain those lines.

It'd be like Stendker importing/reselling Asian fish and then touting their amazing German-bred quality.

Almost all of the US discus breeders who actually used to raise and sell their own stock eventually switched to importing and tried to pass the fish off as their own. There's no need to lie about that stuff. I have way more respect and trust in a business that is honest with me about the product they're selling.

[adrian31@outlook.com]

The issue is that Gabe used to sell the fish as Wattley fish, with certificates, even though they were not being bred by him. They were imported from Asia. It was false advertising, and IMO it's unethical to misrepresent something you're selling. Jack Wattley made a name for himself by being a discus pioneer and creating the bases of many of the most popular strains today, and all Gabe is doing is using that name to move fish. He's not putting in the same work and dedication that Jack did to maintain those lines.

It'd be like Stendker importing/reselling Asian fish and then touting their amazing German-bred quality.

Almost all of the US discus breeders who actually used to raise and sell their own stock eventually switched to importing and tried to pass the fish off as their own. There's no need to lie about that stuff. I have way more respect and trust in a business that is honest with me about the product they're selling.

Ryan, thanks for shedding some light on this. As far as I'm concerned it doesn't matter to me where the fish come from so long as they're quality and healthy. I'm extremely pleased with the eight I just received from him, but then the extent of my experience is my two previous orders from DiscusUSA and my LPS.

I'm not positive whether my fish were domestic bred or imported, but he did mention he was visiting another hatchery to fulfill my order. I didn't get any certificate with my order. Last night I inquired from him about getting two more Rafflesia (love these) and he said he would be going to his West Palm Beach hatchery to get these for me.

[smsimcik]

The issue is that Gabe used to sell the fish as Wattley fish, with certificates, even though they were not being bred by him. They were imported from Asia. It was false advertising, and IMO it's unethical to misrepresent something you're selling. Jack Wattley made a name for himself by being a discus pioneer and creating the bases of many of the most popular strains today, and all Gabe is doing is using that name to move fish. He's not putting in the same work and dedication that Jack did to maintain those lines.

It'd be like Stendker importing/reselling Asian fish and then touting their amazing German-bred quality.

Almost all of the US discus breeders who actually used to raise and sell their own stock eventually switched to importing and tried to pass the fish off as their own. There's no need to lie about that stuff. I have way more respect and trust in a business that is honest with me about the product they're selling.

Thanks Ryan for saying what I wanted to say but I didn't want to burst anyone's bubble about Gabe and his fish. Years ago I was one of those victims of Gabe's false advertising. This is first hand experience and not something I read on the almighty facebook.

In 1991 I bought some Wattley turquoise, coeruleas and pandas directly from Jack. They were great and Jack was great to talk to in those days.
A few years later, after Jack had sold out to Gabe, I called to order some more Wattley turks. I asked Gabe if they still sold Jack's turks and he said "Oh yeah, they're our bread and butter fish. We still have all of Jack's lines". When I got my order I was surprised to see that the fish Gabe was selling were not even remotely like Jack's lines and I now realize they were just asian imports. They were ok fish, just not what I was told they would be or what I wanted.

At least now it seems Gabe has backed off his claims of selling Wattley lines.

I'm glad there are folks these days who like Gabe and his fish. He does work hard and seems to give good customer service.

[DISCUS STU]

The issue is that Gabe used to sell the fish as Wattley fish, with certificates, even though they were not being bred by him. They were imported from Asia. It was false advertising, and IMO it's unethical to misrepresent something you're selling. Jack Wattley made a name for himself by being a discus pioneer and creating the bases of many of the most popular strains today, and all Gabe is doing is using that name to move fish. He's not putting in the same work and dedication that Jack did to maintain those lines.

It'd be like Stendker importing/reselling Asian fish and then touting their amazing German-bred quality.

Almost all of the US discus breeders who actually used to raise and sell their own stock eventually switched to importing and tried to pass the fish off as their own. There's no need to lie about that stuff. I have way more respect and trust in a business that is honest with me about the product they're selling.

My first hand experience with Gabe and what he sells has always been good. I don't know if the above post is addressing something that occurred recently but having someone breed a true strain, even if it's done in Asia, doesn't seem to be unethical.

This Forum always encourages support of its sponsors and rightfully so, but there's no reason to trash talk other sellers, including Wattley's, that sell a good product and I've seen it done here many times.

If people want to do that they should go after the real frauds out there; the ones that sell runted, c grade, sickly, inferior fish and at least one comes to mind because I've purchased what did turn out to be too good to be true and ended up with inferior, garbage fish as I've just described. These are the true rip off artists and they are artists at it because they've worked out all the angles in regard to the consumer not being able to successfully challenge them in regard to credit card payment.

There's a few resellers to be wary of out there but Wattley's is definitely NOT one of them.