Water softeners harmful for fish ?

[sanjay21]

Hey Guys,
So we are getting a water softener installed to our house, with all the drastic water changes to my tanks (7 tanks running). Should I be looking/watching out for any thing ? are water softeners safe for fish ? I do use prime on every water change, but with water softeners I'm little worried. Please guide me on how I should introduce my fish to the new water when I do water change. I currently do straight tap water changes on some of the tanks and 3 tanks I age them because of the flexibility I have for them.

Thank you,
Sanjay

[White Worm]

Water softeners use a process known as ionization to replace magnesium and calcium ions with sodium and I believe the sodium build up over time is not so good for fish. Water softener is not the same as RO. Reverse osmosis systems rely on a filter to physically remove contaminants and dissolved minerals from the water. Most water softeners have a bypass valve you can use for regular water changes.

[Neptune]

Been using softened water for years with no issues. Discus tanks get 50/50 softwater and RO-all other tanks get straight up soft water.

[sanjay21]

Water softeners use a process known as ionization to replace magnesium and calcium ions with sodium and I believe the sodium build up over time is not so good for fish. Water softener is not the same as RO. Reverse osmosis systems rely on a filter to physically remove contaminants and dissolved minerals from the water. Most water softeners have a bypass valve you can use for regular water changes.

I do have a bypass valve, but it doesn't connect to hot water, so I get cold water only. I have one 60 gallon tank in my office room which I'm worried about since I only have access to soft water. It has discus from discus hans.
My first floor has all Asian discus, I have 6 tanks on the second floor but I do one tap which produces soft water (hot) and regular water (cold) which is a mix that I can use with no problem.
I'm not ready to get my 60 gallon downstairs and my wife is not okay with me keeping a barrel to age and heat the cold water. So trying my options.

[sanjay21]

Been using softened water for years with no issues. Discus tanks get 50/50 softwater and RO-all other tanks get straight up soft water.

That's good to know Neptune ! do you use any minerals to the water to be safe ? I was told the sodium levels from the tap are very low and the guy who installed uses soft water for his Cichlid tank. I'm just scared to make a move I guess will need to slowly introduce my fish to the soft water.

[White Worm]

Some studies show that minerals such calcium and magnesium are essential for osmotic function in fish and that's why many add back minerals when they use RO. It may not be an immediate problem but could be a problem with long term health. All fish will adjust to their conditions such as tanks that are over-due for a WC that lack mineral and electrolyte replenishment necessary for optimum bio function of the fish. AND, we all know what happens over time when you don't do enough WC's....I've read that in freshwater, a higher electrolyte level will help pull fluids through the body which also stimulates the natural mucous coat on fish which helps with resistance to parasites, bacteria, and fungus. Also can help with bloat, swim bladder problems, and intestinal problems.

[sanjay21]

Some studies show that minerals such calcium and magnesium are essential for osmotic function in fish and that's why many add back minerals when they use RO. It may not be an immediate problem but could be a problem with long term health. All fish will adjust to their conditions such as tanks that are over-due for a WC that lack mineral and electrolyte replenishment necessary for optimum bio function of the fish. AND, we all know what happens over time when you don't do enough WC's....I've read that in freshwater, a higher electrolyte level will help pull fluids through the body which also stimulates the natural mucous coat on fish which helps with resistance to parasites, bacteria, and fungus. Also can help with bloat, swim bladder problems, and intestinal problems.

I agree Mike ! I'm not comfortable using straight soft water. So two things I have in my mind -
> 1 bucket of regular water and rest soft water + Prime
> Recommended dosage of minerals + soft water + Prime

I do daily water changes.
My first option is cheaper but will one bucket of regular water be enough ? Utah is known for hard water so that one bucket should have high mineral content.

[White Worm]

Hard to say what the ratio without testing the final product. I would guess a 70/30 mix. I used 75% RO / 25% TAP when breeding discus.

[Bizarro252]

If you have a large container, or ageing barrel you could take a few gallons of hot (softened) water, and mix that with the cold from your bypass to match the temp you desire, and water down the softened water :)

[Adam S]

To clarify, water softeners put more stuff in the water than they take out. That's not necessarily a problem, but it isn't "soft." My softened water is 80ppm higher than straight tap water.

Unless using RO, I would definitely not recommend adding anything other than dechlorinator. Your fish will get what they need from food.

If you decide to switch them over to softened water, the new water is not going to hurt them. I accidentally did water changes yesterday with softened water ranging from 50% to 80%. Forgot to switch the bypass valve. No signs of stress immediately after or today.

[sanjay21]

If you have a large container, or ageing barrel you could take a few gallons of hot (softened) water, and mix that with the cold from your bypass to match the temp you desire, and water down the softened water :)
Well I mentioned earlier that its not an option :) Since my wife said - NO

[sanjay21]

To clarify, water softeners put more stuff in the water than they take out. That's not necessarily a problem, but it isn't "soft." My softened water is 80ppm higher than straight tap water.

Unless using RO, I would definitely not recommend adding anything other than dechlorinator. Your fish will get what they need from food.

If you decide to switch them over to softened water, the new water is not going to hurt them. I accidentally did water changes yesterday with softened water ranging from 50% to 80%. Forgot to switch the bypass valve. No signs of stress immediately after or today.

That's good to know Adam ! I'm mainly worried because the tank in my office is housing young discus about 3" now 8 of them. I've read in many posts that you need minerals in your water when growing discus. I wouldn't be worrying if it was adults.

Its good to know that your discus are doing fine with soft water, but as Mike mentioned in his posts overtime Sodium can build up so might be good I mix some regular tap water along.

[Ryan925]

I do have a bypass valve, but it doesn't connect to hot water, so I get cold water only. I have one 60 gallon tank in my office room which I'm worried about since I only have access to soft water. It has discus from discus hans.
My first floor has all Asian discus, I have 6 tanks on the second floor but I do one tap which produces soft water (hot) and regular water (cold) which is a mix that I can use with no problem.
I'm not ready to get my 60 gallon downstairs and my wife is not okay with me keeping a barrel to age and heat the cold water. So trying my options.

The softener should be on the main supply coming into the house. If you open the bypass then it will be sending unsoftened water to your water heater...although your tank would already be full of the softened water

[White Worm]

Yep, just have the family take their showers while you have the water softener in bypass. The water heater will be depleted or at least mixed with fresh water and then you could do water change from tap. The family is clean and the fish are clean. After showers and water change, switch bypass off. Would suck to do that daily though....:(

[Neptune]

So just one more thought on the bypass valve...what a PIA to keep throwing that valve every day AND....ask me how I know... They are usually cheap brittle plastic and are not intended to be used on a daily basis.

The more you use it the more the seals start to leak and then one day.....SNAP...you have no idea how much water will come out before you get the whole house valve shut off.:blushing:

I went down this exact road about a year ago....now I just use half tap(softened) and half RO.

My philosophy...any little PIA thing you have to do is just an excuse to delay a WC.
I said screw it, if the fish can't take my water, I can't have them...they are doing great so far! They regularly spawn in the tank...

Don't over think this...if you have reasonably good water use the softened stuff.

Now of course breeding and raising fry is totally different. But for a display tank no issues.

[Adam S]

That's good to know Adam ! I'm mainly worried because the tank in my office is housing young discus about 3" now 8 of them. I've read in many posts that you need minerals in your water when growing discus. I wouldn't be worrying if it was adults.

Its good to know that your discus are doing fine with soft water, but as Mike mentioned in his posts overtime Sodium can build up so might be good I mix some regular tap water along.
I use plain tap, the softened water was an accident. It uses too much softener salt. That being said, I would not hesitate to use softened water for growing out fish if that was all that was available.

Not sure I follow the sodium build up thing. Do you mean in the fish or in the water?

[sanjay21]

I use plain tap, the softened water was an accident. It uses too much softener salt. That being said, I would not hesitate to use softened water for growing out fish if that was all that was available.

Not sure I follow the sodium build up thing. Do you mean in the fish or in the water?

Sodium being build up in the aquarium I mean.

[sanjay21]

So just one more thought on the bypass valve...what a PIA to keep throwing that valve every day AND....ask me how I know... They are usually cheap brittle plastic and are not intended to be used on a daily basis.

The more you use it the more the seals start to leak and then one day.....SNAP...you have no idea how much water will come out before you get the whole house valve shut off.:blushing:

I went down this exact road about a year ago....now I just use half tap(softened) and half RO.

My philosophy...any little PIA thing you have to do is just an excuse to delay a WC.
I said screw it, if the fish can't take my water, I can't have them...they are doing great so far! They regularly spawn in the tank...

Don't over think this...if you have reasonably good water use the softened stuff.

Now of course breeding and raising fry is totally different. But for a display tank no issues.


Yep, just have the family take their showers while you have the water softener in bypass. The water heater will be depleted or at least mixed with fresh water and then you could do water change from tap. The family is clean and the fish are clean. After showers and water change, switch bypass off. Would suck to do that daily though....:(


The softener should be on the main supply coming into the house. If you open the bypass then it will be sending unsoftened water to your water heater...although your tank would already be full of the softened water

I agree that using Bypass will resolve the issue, but yes repeated usage of bypass valve might damage it causing leak. I think I will take the extra effort by adding some regular water (aged and heated) from the garden hose unit. Since its first floor will be using a couple buckets and rest will be tap water(soft). Will occasionally add some minerals as well probably once a week! Thanks everyone.

[Ryan925]

I agree that using Bypass will resolve the issue, but yes repeated usage of bypass valve might damage it causing leak. I think I will take the extra effort by adding some regular water (aged and heated) from the garden hose unit. Since its first floor will be using a couple buckets and rest will be tap water(soft). Will occasionally add some minerals as well probably once a week! Thanks everyone.

Could you tap into your cold water supply, before the softener, and have a connection for your aquarium water?

[sanjay21]

Could you tap into your cold water supply, before the softener, and have a connection for your aquarium water?

For the tank on the second floor ? its possible, but maybe extra money hiring a plumber. I did decide to move the tanks from my office on the second floor (sucks!) but I guess giving the babies water they need is what I need to watch out. First floor I have access to cold water which I will be aging it and heating the water. So I guess its good !

[Ryan925]

For the tank on the second floor ? its possible, but maybe extra money hiring a plumber. I did decide to move the tanks from my office on the second floor (sucks!) but I guess giving the babies water they need is what I need to watch out. First floor I have access to cold water which I will be aging it and heating the water. So I guess its good !

Ah got ya. So you do already have access on the first floor.

[Darb]

I have a softener and occasionally i leave the bypass and fill a couple gallons of softened water to my tank and havent noticed any ill effects. The other thing you can use which i have read doesnt hurt the fish is switching from sodium chloride, the regular salt, to potassium chloride. Your fish and plants can use the extra potassium and depending on how hard your water is may or may not be super high.