Pleco breeding project

[Swedgin]

Since I now have a few fry off the Loricaria, I consider myself an expert pleco breeder. Not really, but there’s a german saying which translates to “luck is with the dumb”, so I decided to make it a bit of a side earner. Hopefully.

I already have a breeding group of 9 L333 and one of 6 L263. They’re currently in with the discus, but will soon get their own tanks.

I don’t have space in the house, so I will do this project at work. Stole a room today, which already has Dexion shelving in. I will reinforce the shelves a little bit and install the breeding tanks there and some on their cabinets.. They will be between 125 and 240 liters, 10 or 11 tanks as it stands now.

I have a group of 10 L046 coming with the discus shipment to add to my 2 recently acquired ones, as well as 9 L305, 10 L066 and 10 L134. So far. I’m trying to get my hands on some more L239, of which I have 3 right now.

I’m quite tempted to try the L128 in one of the bigger tanks, I currently have 4 of them, but no clue on the sex.

My friend who is shipping the fish is checking what else he can get. I’ve learned today that apparently the demand for L236 is quite high here, so might pick up a breeding group of those, as well as some more L270, of which I have 2 right now.
Basically any pretty, smallish Hypancistrus, Panaquolus etc.

This will be fun.. stay tuned

[Swedgin]

This is one of the 305:
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046:
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134:
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[Pices]

Well here comes another fish you will get me hooked on! Ha ha
Patty

[Second Hand Pat]

Sounds like you have nice breeding project going there Tobi :) Looking forward to seeing how all this works out.
Pat

[FischAutoTechGarten]

Awesome, That sounds like allot of fun.
Never mind my original question.... I looked at stripe orientation... I understand the difference between L046 and L236 now.. LOL

[Filip]

Nice project Tobi . It seems like you are all set and done and fully equipped for some serious breeding in your office . Those are some really nice looking fish and I know that they are popular and very pricey too , so your new project may come as rewarding in the end .
I wonder if they are more delicate in their needs for breeding and raising than just a regular Ancistrus fish , or they just look like they are :) ?

And I always wondered why they di not come with some super fancy names like discus does , but are numbered instead , like machines ?

Regardless of my dillemas I'll be following this project for sure .

[FischAutoTechGarten]

Nice project Tobi .
And I always wondered why they di not come with some super fancy names like discus does , but are numbered instead , like machines ?


I wondered the same and searched a while back and found a satisfactory answer. The same issue is present with armored catfish (e.g. corydoras) and apistogramas.
Read this article for a brief description of the purpose of L-names.

https://www.aquariumdomain.com/adSocial/index.php/adblog/12/understanding-pleco-l-numbers-and-complete-l-number-reference-list-part-1-l/

[Swedgin]

Well here comes another fish you will get me hooked on! Ha ha
Patty

I sure hope so, Patty. They are beautiful


Sounds like you have nice breeding project going there Tobi :) Looking forward to seeing how all this works out.
Pat

Thanks Pat, me, too. Going to get the tanks etc this week


Awesome, That sounds like allot of fun.
Never mind my original question.... I looked at stripe orientation... I understand the difference between L046 and L236 now.. LOL

Yeah, the hype around these 2 species is unreal. But I got a good deal on the zebras and the market is there. Not holding my breath on the 236, they are asking crazy prices even for the “basics”.


Nice project Tobi . It seems like you are all set and done and fully equipped for some serious breeding in your office . Those are some really nice looking fish and I know that they are popular and very pricey too , so your new project may come as rewarding in the end .
I wonder if they are more delicate in their needs for breeding and raising than just a regular Ancistrus fish , or they just look like they are :) ?

And I always wondered why they di not come with some super fancy names like discus does , but are numbered instead , like machines ?

Regardless of my dillemas I'll be following this project for sure .

Filip, So far I have been lucky with my plecos in terms of ease of keeping and mortality. As long as the water is on point they should be alright. Breeding and rearing I don’t know tbh, will have to wait and find out. I’ve got tumblers and rearing boxes on order, but the first batches, if there ever are any, will probably stay with the parents, just to see how it pans out.

As for the names, the numbers make identification easier I guess, but some of them do have fancy names, king tiger, leopard frog and whatnot. But the main difference to discus names is that the discus strains are man made and anyone can name anything as they wish. Some of the names really make me chuckle...


I wondered the same and searched a while back and found a satisfactory answer. The same issue is present with armored catfish (e.g. corydoras) and apistogramas.
Read this article for a brief description of the purpose of L-names.

https://www.aquariumdomain.com/adSocial/index.php/adblog/12/understanding-pleco-l-numbers-and-complete-l-number-reference-list-part-1-l/

Cool link, thanks Peter

[FischAutoTechGarten]

But the main difference to discus names is that the discus strains are man made and anyone can name anything as they wish. Some of the names really make me chuckle...

My favorite ambiguous name was Cary Strong's "Dreamcicle". I think they were just an F1 cross of something orangy/yellowy and something albino/white? I always imagined it was supposed to have coloration like a cream cicle, but I never saw any photos of them as adults, so I don't know what they looked like really. My personal favorite, and you can search on the entire term here in Simply and it will come up, is "German Red Candy Apple Scribble". However, I will admit that you get a sense for what you will be getting just by the name, rather unambiguous actually.



Yeah, the hype around these 2 species is unreal. But I got a good deal on the zebras and the market is there. Not holding my breath on the 236, they are asking crazy prices even for the “basics”.

Was speaking to the owner of Arizona Nature Aquatics (a very nice upscale independent fresh water fish only LFS in Tucson AZ). He enjoys purchasing some stock from a few accomplished hobbyist. He mentioned Pleco breeders are tough... They will hold immense inventories to keep the prices up.

I remember getting two L046, the true blue eyed Zebra Pleco, about 15 years ago for about $75 a piece. I'm told that is a bargain by today's standards, despite the relative success in captive breeding now.

Back to your breeding. Have you found any Gold Spotted (L001) like alternatives that don't grow quite so large (< 4" SL) and aren't so aggressive towards each other?

[Adam S]

Your collection is off to a great start, Tobi! Looking forward to seeing what else you snag and setup.


Have you found any Gold Spotted (L001) like alternatives that don't grow quite so large (< 4" SL) and aren't so aggressive towards each other?

Check out Ancistrus sp. 'Rio Paraguay' and 'L393.' Paraguay gets a bit larger, but both species are under 5".

https://www.planetcatfish.com/common/species.php?species_id=600
https://www.planetcatfish.com/common/species.php?species_id=1452

[Swedgin]

My favorite ambiguous name was Cary Strong's "Dreamcicle". I think they were just an F1 cross of something orangy/yellowy and something albino/white? I always imagined it was supposed to have coloration like a cream cicle, but I never saw any photos of them as adults, so I don't know what they looked like really. My personal favorite, and you can search on the entire term here in Simply and it will come up, is "German Red Candy Apple Scribble". However, I will admit that you get a sense for what you will be getting just by the name, rather unambiguous actually.



Was speaking to the owner of Arizona Nature Aquatics (a very nice upscale independent fresh water fish only LFS in Tucson AZ). He enjoys purchasing some stock from a few accomplished hobbyist. He mentioned Pleco breeders are tough... They will hold immense inventories to keep the prices up.

I remember getting two L046, the true blue eyed Zebra Pleco, about 15 years ago for about $75 a piece. I'm told that is a bargain by today's standards, despite the relative success in captive breeding now.

Back to your breeding. Have you found any Gold Spotted (L001) like alternatives that don't grow quite so large (< 4" SL) and aren't so aggressive towards each other?

Yes the prices are nuts, but that’s part of the appeal for me to breed them. You simply can’t get them here unless you get really lucky. A lot of people want them, but if ever one ends up in a shop here , they go for 300-400$. But I agree, even in the US and Europe they are incredibly overpriced given their availability these days. I got a good deal on a group of ten wild caught, so worst case if the breeding doesn’t pan out I can still sell them without losing any money on them. Same goes for the other species, which is in part why I picked them. But I have to admit, they are really cool in person, never cared for them much when I saw pictures only.

As far as I know L001 and others from the same genus dig their breeding holes, not sure about the gold spotted, never heard of them tbh.


Your collection is off to a great start, Tobi! Looking forward to seeing what else you snag and setup.



Check out Ancistrus sp. 'Rio Paraguay' and 'L393.' Paraguay gets a bit larger, but both species are under 5".

https://www.planetcatfish.com/common/species.php?species_id=600
https://www.planetcatfish.com/common/species.php?species_id=1452

Thanks Adam. I might have to pick your brain every once in a while or look at some of your threads for guidance. There is only room for one or 2 more species. Thanks for the links. Haven’t seen these on the exporter’s list. I might go for something more obvious in terms of public appeal, probably H. contradens, L201 or something in that ilk.

[FischAutoTechGarten]

Check out 'L393'.

https://www.planetcatfish.com/common/species.php?species_id=1452

Wow, Thanks Adam. 3.9" SL is a good size. Might take a while to get to that size in a 20L

[Swedgin]

Most likely will go for L106. No breeding record as of yet, worth a shot. They’re stunning in my opinion

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[Adam S]

Happy to yap about catfish anytime. L106 are very pretty when young but get duller with age (like most plecos, even L46).

There's a good picture of an older L106 here about 2/3 down: http://www.l-welse.com/reviewpost/showproduct.php/product/118

[Swedgin]

Happy to yap about catfish anytime. L106 are very pretty when young but get duller with age (like most plecos, even L46).

There's a good picture of an older L106 here about 2/3 down: http://www.l-welse.com/reviewpost/showproduct.php/product/118

Still beautiful. The orange seam is what sells me on these

[Swedgin]

Added a group of breeding size 204’s aswell. There’s just too many to choose from.

[Swedgin]

I’ve finalized the order and this is what will end up in the “pleco room” (had to change the room to a bigger one):

L046 x10
L052 x10
L066 x10
L128 x4
L134 x10
L135 x10
L201 x10
L204 x10
L205 x10
L239 x13
L263 x6
L305 x9
L333 x9
L387 x10
LDA067 x10
Parancistrus aurantiacus x6

CW028 x18
CW045 x18

L. Atabapo x6
S. caquetae x4

[Pices]

“(...had to change the room to a bigger one )”. Of course you did! Lol you crack me up!
Patty

[Swedgin]

“(...had to change the room to a bigger one )”. Of course you did! Lol you crack me up!
Patty

Happy to entertain. Told my wife today how much is coming and showed her the tanks I bought, I’ve seen her happier....

This is how I plan to distribute the groups, still preliminary, so any pointers and improvements welcome. Tank size in liters, as it should be ;) (divide by 3.8 for gallons)

125
L046 x11 Hypancistrus

125
L134 x10 Peckoltia

200
CW028 x18
L135 x10 Peckoltia

200
CW045 x18
L305 x9 Peckoltia

240
Nanay Discus grow out
L270 x2 Hypancistrus

240
L052 x20 Zonancistrus
LDA067 x20 Panaqolus

240
L239 x13 Baryancistrus
L066 x10 Hypancistrus

240
L201 x10 Hypancistrus
L204 x10 Panaqolus

240
L205 x10 Peckoltia
L333 x9 Hypancistrus

400
Parancistrus aurantiacus x6
L263 x6 Leporacanthicus
L128 x4 Hemiancinstrus
L124 x2 Peckoltia

[Filip]

You got all this tanks at home Tobi ?
I thought they were meant to be in your office.
You are starting Big here :)

[Adam S]

Told my wife today how much is coming and showed her the tanks I bought, I’ve seen her happier....
I was told keeping lots of catfish makes you MORE attractive. Maybe you don't have enough tanks yet?

[Swedgin]

You got all this tanks at home Tobi ?
I thought they were meant to be in your office.
You are starting Big here :)

My house is on the company compound, so just short walk away.


I was told keeping lots of catfish makes you MORE attractive. Maybe you don't have enough tanks yet?

I like to think so. Both points. I’ll let you know about the feedback/backlash...

[Adam S]

I like to think so. Both points. I’ll let you know about the feedback/backlash...
Good luck!

On a more serious note, the the stocking plan seems pretty dense. It's not always an issue but sometimes they need more privacy to spawn. I'd highly recommend not using closed end caves until the fish settle in, especially in the mixed species tanks.

[Swedgin]

Good luck!

On a more serious note, the the stocking plan seems pretty dense. It's not always an issue but sometimes they need more privacy to spawn. I'd highly recommend not using closed end caves until the fish settle in, especially in the mixed species tanks.
Ok thank you, I’ll keep that in mind. Chances are, there will be more tanks added. I’ve separated species from the same genus on purpose to avoid too much stress and even possible hybridization.

[Filip]

I'd highly recommend not using closed end caves until the fish settle in, especially in the mixed species tanks.

I'm curious about the theory behind this Adam . What's the difference if the caves are open or half closed and what's that got to do with fish settling in ?

[Second Hand Pat]

I'm curious about the theory behind this Adam . What's the difference if the caves are open or half closed and what's that got to do with fish settling in ?

My guess is if there is any fighting the losing fish has an exit on both ends vs being caught in the back of the cave and getting beat up on.
Pat

[Adam S]

My guess is if there is any fighting the losing fish has an exit on both ends vs being caught in the back of the cave and getting beat up on.
Pat
This.

[Filip]

Great guess Pat .
Thanks Adam .

[Swedgin]

Updated order, 7 more species, 4 more tanks

1x 400L
6x 240L
2x 200L
3x 125L
2x 80L

L046 x11 Hypancistrus
L066 x10 Hypancistrus
L136a x10 Hypancistrus
L201 x10 Hypancistrus
L270 x2 Hypancistrus
L333 x9 Hypancistrus
L006 x10 Peckoltia
L124 x2 Peckoltia
L127 x10 Peckoltia
L134 x10 Peckoltia
L135 x10 Peckoltia
L202 x10 Peckoltia
L205 x10 Peckoltia
L305 x9 Peckoltia
L387 x10 Peckoltia
L204 x10 Panaqolus
LDA067 x20 Panaqolus
L239 x13 Baryancistrus
L052 x20 Zonancistrus
Parancistrus aurantiacus x6
L263 x6 Leporacanthicus
L106 x10 Hemiancistrus
L128 x4 Hemiancinstrus
L354 x10 Oligancistrus
L034 x10 Ancistrus
CW028 x18
CW045 x18
Loricaria sp Atabapo x6
Spatuloricaria caquetae x4
Pseudohemiodon laticeps x2
Pterosturisoma microps x2
Planoloricaria cryptodon x2
Nanay Diskus x35

Some of these are not breeding size yet, so they can/will/have to share a few tanks

[Pices]

I shouldn’t be surprised, but you never cease to surprise me! I’m really looking forward to seeing this fish room come together!
Patty

[Swedgin]

State today, the other 5 tanks should be delivered tomorrow


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[Swedgin]

One tank was out of stock. Buying all of them at purchase prices through the company, further discounted as they’re the old models without led and the most appealing s**t brown rims. They come with internal filters installed and I’ll be adding a Ziss moving bed media filter to each of these.

The sabaji are bothering the discus a lot, so time to set up the first tank to move them out asap

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[Swedgin]

First tank running, just for fun to keep me motivated. 45gal bow front

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[fljones3]

Pleco Hotel. Love it!

[Filip]

Congrats on your start Tobi .It really looks nice and cozy place for plecos :) .

[Adam S]

:thumbsup:

[Swedgin]

Progress on 2 more. Waiting for some drift wood to top them off

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