Artificial rearing (trying my hand need help please )

[blueeyes]

Hi guys I have a pair of Red Scarlet S/S unfortunately they keep eating the wrigglers right before they go free swimming , I have pulled the eggs the last time and got about 50 fry to about 3 days but they were dying day by day looked as if they were feeding but just faded away , I put it down to a couple of labels that were on the raising tub that the glue might have got into the water and poisoned them , pulled a second batch but was a bit late and only about 20 hatched i have 5 left free swimming now at 4 days and trying them with BBS but would like to get it right for a good batch , the pair have a small amount of wrigglers just now which are due to go free swimming tomorrow so will see, anyway have been feeding them bakers egg yoke with a little spirulina mixed through every 4 hours , I have a mature sponge filter running and a small power head suppling water to a small reservoir which supplies the water to the top tray containing the fry in a mesh colander , I have coffee filters but the bottom is black so thought they wouldnt go to the black pipe , any input most welcome as would like to get this right many thanks for taking the time to read this stay safe thanks Ps tried everything with pic upload and just no go and file size is below max thanks

[danotaylor]

Cliff just posted this link yesterday. He has done this successfully for ages. Proven & effective. Thanks Cliff!!
https://www.mondodiscus.com/2007/11/feeding-discus-artificial-rearing-discus-by-cliff-young/

[blueeyes]

Thanks for the reply and link I have read Cliffs excellent article a few times , and thank you Cliff for that article , just looking for some other tips and things i might be missing , I am using a kitchen sieve to hold the fry so they are getting a constant flow of fresh water , just wondering if the flow was to strong but they had no trouble swimming around and no sign of any current thanks.

[pablos]

I’m following Cliff’s approach. below fry having a lunch
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[blueeyes]

thanks I have tried everything to upload pics , done it before but for some reason just wont plat ball lol

[CliffsDiscus]

Cliff just posted this link yesterday. He has done this successfully for ages. Proven & effective. Thanks Cliff!!
https://www.mondodiscus.com/2007/11/feeding-discus-artificial-rearing-discus-by-cliff-young/

Dan, Thanks for your kind words.

Cliff

[CliffsDiscus]

I’m following Cliff’s approach. below fry having a lunch
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Try to stick the yolk on the side, eating from the bottom may cause deformation at the mouth.

Cliff

[CliffsDiscus]

Hi guys I have a pair of Red Scarlet S/S unfortunately they keep eating the wrigglers right before they go free swimming , I have pulled the eggs the last time and got about 50 fry to about 3 days but they were dying day by day looked as if they were feeding but just faded away , I put it down to a couple of labels that were on the raising tub that the glue might have got into the water and poisoned them , pulled a second batch but was a bit late and only about 20 hatched i have 5 left free swimming now at 4 days and trying them with BBS but would like to get it right for a good batch , the pair have a small amount of wrigglers just now which are due to go free swimming tomorrow so will see, anyway have been feeding them bakers egg yoke with a little spirulina mixed through every 4 hours , I have a mature sponge filter running and a small power head suppling water to a small reservoir which supplies the water to the top tray containing the fry in a mesh colander , I have coffee filters but the bottom is black so thought they wouldnt go to the black pipe , any input most welcome as would like to get this right many thanks for taking the time to read this stay safe thanks Ps tried everything with pic upload and just no go and file size is below max thanks

Free swimming and dying on the 4th day usually means either they were feeding off their own egg sack or a bacteria problem. The egg yolk forms
bacteria quickly with the high temperature. So more water changes are required.

Cheers!
Cliff

[blueeyes]

Many thanks for both your input and your article Cliff, I had them in a large plastic tub with another tub suspended at an angle and in a mesh colander, (big tucks method) however I had a flow of water coming from one of the outputs and just wondering if that could have exhausted then , I did see them eating and they were starting on brine shrimp but slowly they started to fade and die, I was rinsing the shrimp in cold water to take away any salt content https://photos.app.goo.gl/eZSeUXnkmZYc3qYTA https://photos.app.goo.gl/zLaFgg6iKTUGYBkg6 https://photos.app.goo.gl/aR3k9mwhTLyfe2fH9

[CliffsDiscus]

I rinse the BBS in fresh dechlorine water but I have seen another breeder that didn't rinse without any problems.

Cliff

[blueeyes]

I have always rinsed my BBS , for my fry , but dont thing that was the problem , noticed today heater was at 82 , that would not help matters would it thanks .

[CliffsDiscus]

I have always rinsed my BBS , for my fry , but dont thing that was the problem , noticed today heater was at 82 , that would not help matters would it thanks .

Temperature at 82 is fine, but how often do you change the water in the tub?

Cliff

[blueeyes]

Hi Cliff I have raised the temp to 28c , they are in a tub which has a continuous flow from the larger tub below, which has a mature sponge filter in it , see my pics in previous post ,so never done any water changes, but can do if you think it will help , I have just pulled more eggs today so see what happens, have noticed egg yield is getting less any tips in getting more yield from the female , thanks for the replies.

[CliffsDiscus]

Hi Cliff I have raised the temp to 28c , they are in a tub which has a continuous flow from the larger tub below, which has a mature sponge filter in it , see my pics in previous post ,so never done any water changes, but can do if you think it will help , I have just pulled more eggs today so see what happens, have noticed egg yield is getting less any tips in getting more yield from the female , thanks for the replies.

I think you might get better percentage if there were more freshwater. I have seen a breeder using a 100 gallon tank dripping water down to a
small tiny bowl probably quart size. The small bowl with the fry would have a hole with smash, so water would drop down to another tank, but
freshwater was refill daily.

As far as more eggs with each spawn its difficult to say some breeders say feed live worms, then there are the small sperm count males.

Cliff

[blueeyes]

thanks again for your reply Cliff , once they are free swimming I will do a daily water change in the larger tub , see how that goes , will let you know how it goes this time.

[pablos]

I think mine are not developing as should. They have 20days, they lost interest in egg yolk and prefer bbs. However they are not growing. There are more less the same size as 10days ago. Around 25 fries are leaving in 5 gallons with 3 times per day water change.

[blueeyes]

thanks for the input Pablos, think my tub will hold about 10gal , makes you wonder if you had over 100 what size they would be , I moved my fry when on the parents between 10 and 20 days into an 18" cube (20gal) so think I will move them if they survive this time about the 20 day mark , are yours discus shape thanks any pics of your set up and fry appreciated

[pablos]

There are tiny, maybe 6mm and I don’t see them growing much last week or so. Good think is that I haven’t lost one during that time.

What warns me is that comparing to some online photos there are too small for their age.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=Brm9xzg9_qw

[CliffsDiscus]

There are tiny, maybe 6mm and I don’t see them growing much last week or so. Good think is that I haven’t lost one during that time.

What warns me is that comparing to some online photos there are too small for their age.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=Brm9xzg9_qw

Interesting some are much smaller than just others, are they somehow mix strains?

[pablos]

All are the same size, it’s camera perspective. Those ‘smaller’ are the bottom of a container, since bigger are swimming closer to the surface.

Aren’t they too small for their age?


Yes, they do look on the small size. Also some hybrid are slow growing, I end up
making more water changes just to get the size up.

Cliff

[blueeyes]

Well I have managed to get 18 from a small batch of eggs, they are now 20 days old from free swimming , they have their discus shape now, my question is I have them in a small tub with a continuous flow of filtered water makes it easier to clean and them to find their food without using too much energy , I am doing app 1/3 of the large water container every day , think I will give them another week and then step them up to a larger container
https://photos.app.goo.gl/iHnnKGwTaazgkAj19

[CliffsDiscus]

Well I have managed to get 18 from a small batch of eggs, they are now 20 days old from free swimming , they have their discus shape now, my question is I have them in a small tub with a continuous flow of filtered water makes it easier to clean and them to find their food without using too much energy , I am doing app 1/3 of the large water container every day , think I will give them another week and then step them up to a larger container
https://photos.app.goo.gl/iHnnKGwTaazgkAj19

They look great, please post future updates.

Cliff

[blueeyes]

Well they are app 5 weeks old now and seem to be doing well , starting to wean them onto BH/granules/flake/, they are taking micro worms as well , still in a tub within a tub with circulating water all the time and app 50% wc daily, have a tank ready for them which I have divided with a sponge so they dont have to look far for food, so once completely of the BBS will move them here is a link https://photos.app.goo.gl/bWnY7TfoxuTEyx9P9

[danotaylor]

Looking good mate. Do you have any pics of the parents?

[blueeyes]

Will see if I can get them to load lol they are Scarlet S/Skins , but always get the fry till free swimming then eat them thanks for your comments, well try as I might cant get pics to upload at all on this forum despite doing it numerous times in the past , and thats after resizing etc etc so here is a couple of links https://photos.app.goo.gl/rgCWNhzxLTyj5jUn9 https://photos.app.goo.gl/BgE4WKUcpZxVmW956

[pablos]

Mine are two weeks older than yours, but I have also raised them
artificially. Thanks Cliff!!
They have been moved to the own aquarium yesterday.

I’m feeding them with BH and changing water twice a day, and they might eat all the day :)

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[blueeyes]

Looking good Pablos , I just get get the pics to upload at all tried everything lol

[AquaticNerd]

Your pair looks great!

As far as image uploads are concerned, I prefer using a file-sharing site such as imgur (https://imgur.com) where I can post all my images. From there, you can get share links for BBCode forums which will allow you to share the image(s).

Before uploading to imgur, I like to resize them to something more suitable for sharing. If you open the image in a program such as Paint.NET, there is a resize option in the menu. I like to keep it around 600x800.

[CliffsDiscus]

Mine are two weeks older than yours, but I have also raised them
artificially. Thanks Cliff!!
They have been moved to the own aquarium yesterday.

I’m feeding them with BH and changing water twice a day, and they might eat all the day :)

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Pablos,
Congrats, well done they look nice and fat.

Cliff

[blueeyes]

try this for pics https://i.postimg.cc/5tmhMyqS/20201218-132304.jpg (https://postimages.org/) https://i.postimg.cc/5yGm8VrW/20201218-132300.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[blueeyes]

Well moved the fry yesterday to a 20gal tank they are 61/2 weeks now and all app 1 inch body size, eating everything I throw at them lol well pleased with them https://i.postimg.cc/44Ljk64Y/20201228-140343.jpg (https://postimages.org/)https://i.postimg.cc/kGzjVyDw/20201228-140335.jpg (https://postimages.org/) https://i.postimg.cc/mgxXBVvg/20201228-140330.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[danotaylor]

They look fantastic mate, nicely done! :thumbsup:

[CliffsDiscus]

They look great, nice job, good growthrate. Who said that artificially growthrate was slower? Are these snakeskin or snakeskin crosses?

Cliff

[blueeyes]

They look fantastic mate, nicely done! :thumbsup:

thanks for the compliments Dan

[blueeyes]

They look great, nice job, good growthrate. Who said that artificially growthrate was slower? Are these snakeskin or snakeskin crosses?

Cliff

thanks for the compliments Cliff yes the parents are both red S/S (Scarlet S/Skins) but are still eating the fry just before they go free swimming I would like to get another decent batch from them and then leave them to their own devices but they seem to be laying less eggs, I got them as a recently formed pair and have no reason to doubt it

[Shan_Evolved]

Wow incredible. Now that's discuskeeping.

[CliffsDiscus]

thanks for the compliments Cliff yes the parents are both red S/S (Scarlet S/Skins) but are still eating the fry just before they go free swimming I would like to get another decent batch from them and then leave them to their own devices but they seem to be laying less eggs, I got them as a recently formed pair and have no reason to doubt it

It's going to be interesting to see what type of color the 8 and 9 stress bar Discus are going to be because these are growing faster and coloring up sooner.

Cliff

[pablos]

Well moved the fry yesterday to a 20gal tank they are 61/2 weeks now and all app 1 inch body size, eating everything I throw at them lol well pleased with them

Wow! Yours are growing much faster then mine, even if mine are two weeks older

https://youtu.be/BqRQO855I-c

[blueeyes]

Wow! Yours are growing much faster then mine, even if mine are two weeks older

https://youtu.be/BqRQO855I-c

Pablos yous look great , and shape is good so I would not be concerned, as long as they keep eating and growing thats the main thing.

[pablos]

I’m not worried .. maybe a little bit jealous about yours ;)

Anyway I see a difference with artificial and natural breeding as the same pair have 3 weeks old fry.
In my small experience I see artificial growing slower. Natural 3 weeks old fry are more less the same size when artificial was 4-5 weeks old.

But for sure it’s much much harder with Cliffs method. Food, water etc. since with partners is super easy.

[blueeyes]

Great stuff I wish my pair would do the same , I am hoping for a decent batch to pull then I will leave them to it

[CliffsDiscus]

The growthrate are different for each strain. I normally try to grow them out at the same rate as naturally, but if I want to accelerate the growth it can be done but its simply more work and lack of tank spaces already. The fastest artificially growthrate I have seen was quarter body size in 4 weeks.

Cliff

[blueeyes]

I agree fast growth is beneficial if you are reselling them , but I am just want to get some to grow on for my larger tank , so as long as the keep their shape and get to a decent size I am not fussed , its been a learning curve for me, and I have noticed the pair are getting more and more protective of the clutch, so hopefully a learning curve for them to lol, I dont have any other ones to put next to them to stir them up so this has been next best thing, as I said if I can get a decent batch from them that will do me and they can take as long as they like to get it right .

[blueeyes]

Just a wee update on the fry still growing and the 14 bars seem to be growing fast , bit surprised thought the 9 bar would have took over any way here they are
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mO8zmy9OUS8ZF7Mkr0MpZBWug9GUhvjK/view?usp=sharing

[CliffsDiscus]

They look very healthy and active. Are they high body?

Cliff

[danotaylor]

They look like to be in great health, really nice shape mate. Well done! The sponge looks like it could use a squeeze out though ;)

[blueeyes]

Dan done that last night I have a small power head on it hence pulls everything in , that is not the main filter
Cliff I have no idea they are off Asian Scarlet Snake skins thanks