8 day old fry! Some questions.

[Iminit]

http://youtu.be/zo4JCiVTmfY?si=vih0uhgeJc7yjRyr. Ok all looks good except I can’t tell if the fry are eating the bbs. I’m putting them right next to the parents but no clue if these guys are eating. Next how often should I feed? In the video the male’s fins seem to be getting frayed. Is this normal? What should be the next food I offer? Something else.I’m not rinsing the bbs. Should I be? Changing 50% water daily and it seems most of the bbs is on the bottom. 136344136345136346

[brewmaster15]

Tom,
How often are you feeding the BBS? I don't think you are feeding them enough BBS. If the parents are showing signs over grazing and theres that small a number of fry try feeding more BBS or more often. Its possible the male is more aggressive at attracting the fry or not making as much slime as the female. The females color looks good , like its making alot of slime. Its not uncommon for some minor wear and tear during feeding..but be sure to feed enough BBS. They are eating it, as you can some pink in them. Other than that, they look nice and uniform.

Do they fight over the fry?

al

[Iminit]

How often should I feed.

[CliffsDiscus]

The most of the fry are eating just that some are eating more then other, notice that some fry have more orange or pink at their belly. May try feeding more BBS so that all fry have a full stomach. The amount of times feeding the BBS depends how long their stomach stays full, once their stomachs starts to look half full then give it another feeding but not to over feed. The male seem to be producing slime first by turning dark, so he is taking beating.

[Iminit]

Both parents are eating great so is there something else to feed them? I’m feeding fdbw with vita-min added.

[brewmaster15]

Both parents are eating great so is there something else to feed them? I’m feeding fdbw with vita-min added.

Tom the parents are fine, you can feed them whatever you normally feed. At this point the fry really only need the parents slime coat and the BBS. They can stay on that alone for weeks from now.

al

[CliffsDiscus]

You can change the after removing the fry. I use Centrum Silver vitamin for human.

[Discus Fever]

And the answer to your other question is yes you should be rinsing the brine shrimp off before feeding.

[Iminit]

Ok still growing and now clearly moving off parents to eat bbs. I’m tying to feed almost every hour (retired :)). I fed the parents a lot to almost the same and they eat everything. Doing 50% water change daily. Will set up a 20g today to get it ready for the fry (too early ?). Should get the net to rinse the bbs today. Why the rinsing? They do seem fine as of now?136370

[brewmaster15]

Once they are Eating Baby brine like that you can move them on their own but as long as they arent over grazing on the parents or the parents dont spawn again they can be left much longer together. Its a personal preference at this point..

136371




Rinsing removes bacteria that grows in the bbs hatching container. Its a good idea to do it just in case. Rinsing through a net can remove bbs cyst shells which your fry can ingest and die from in some cases.

[Charlyc11]

Your TDS will shoot up and plus the BB also poop better to rinse with a fine net. I use the cheap ones from Amazon. Are you making batches every day or refrigerating in some brine?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0899RPF27/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_image?ie=UTF8&psc=1

For the general removal from the hatchery I use these.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09FL6L9WR/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Retired but full time fish keeper.

[Willie]

Great to see the spawn, Tom. Feeding them every time you pass the tank is just fine. I don't know though what you mean by hand feeding. I usually squirt bbs right near them so they see it. If you're dropping it from the tank top, they may not see it. Still, just overfeed and keep up the water changes. It should be noted that millions of discus fry grow and thrive in the Amazon without bbs. I have yet to see actual data that bbs increases fry development - or does it just make aquarists feel a lot better.

My rule of thumb is to wean them onto solid food before moving. They'll feed on minced beef heart as early as 11 days free swimming. I like to keep them with the parents for at least 3 weeks, if not 4 weeks, to make sure they always have multiple sources of food. As they get bigger, they may actually start to bite the parents. If there's any damage, the parents will recur miraculously fast. (It's a clear evolutionary adaptation.) As Brew noted, there's really no advantage to moving the spawn early - unless the parents start to clean the cone again. In which case, move them out fast!

[Iminit]

Lol cone is gone!! Not giving them any ideas lol. Ok not a fan of beef heart. Will freeze dried black worms work? If not what else or should I buy frozen beef heart. If so what brand?

Charly I just got that bbs net set in the mail today. Started rinsing:). Ok what do you mean refrigerate? How do I do that. I’m feeding everything bbs now lol. I’ve got way to much!!
Will the tds go up even though I’m doing the water changes?

Al the hatcheries are just insane. I’ve been doing the bbs in 6x6” Tupperware floating in tanks with a bubbler in them. Getting tons of shrimp and removing with a dropper. Now rinsing:). Seems to be working. Just way too much shrimp in the hatchery. They seem to live longer in the Tupperware too.

[seanyuki]

Tom since you are in Long Island, Check with Miranda @ Chicago discus if she's is still selling her homemade beef heart to customers.

[Charlyc11]

Tom
I use my home made hatchery and you can make your own with other size bottles. They hatch in about 18 to 24 hrs and I precipitate the shells with the light and pour all to my second bottle and do it again with the light so I get most of the shells

136373

I pour the contents of the hatchery after separating the shells to these nets to rinse with barely warm water.

136374

I make a bran new brine about 150 mils mixing 15 gram of aquarium salt and right from the net to the brine. Now I put it in the fridge so they go dormant. You should get 3 maybe 4 days but the faster you use the better.

I pour what I need in this small net. and as you rinse again suck up the BB's with a pipet to be able to squeeze right at them and they should come to life as they hit the warm water.

136375

I use one or max 2 scoops of BB's with this small scoop.

136376

[Charlyc11]

For small amount you can start with this from Brine Shrimp Direct. Must warn you get small amount at a time and not the best solution.

136377

[Iminit]

Guess many different ways to do this. I’m hatching in this.136378. They hatch in around 24hrs and seem to live for about 3 days. Right now I’ve got 2 of those hatched. Tomorrow I will try to refrigerate some. The shrimp go to where I aim the light. The shells seem to float to the top shrimp under.

[Iminit]

How do you store the brine in the fridge? Do you put it in some fresh water? Just leave it in the net?

[Charlyc11]

I make a bran new brine about 150 mils mixing 15 gram of aquarium salt and right from the net to the brine. Now I put it in the fridge so they go dormant. You should get 3 maybe 4 days but the faster you use the better.


Read above I make new Brine (Salt and water) after rising the BB's.

[brewmaster15]

Lol cone is gone!! Not giving them any ideas lol. Ok not a fan of beef heart. Will freeze dried black worms work? If not what else or should I buy frozen beef heart. If so what brand?

Charly I just got that bbs net set in the mail today. Started rinsing:). Ok what do you mean refrigerate? How do I do that. I’m feeding everything bbs now lol. I’ve got way to much!!
Will the tds go up even though I’m doing the water changes?

Al the hatcheries are just insane. I’ve been doing the bbs in 6x6” Tupperware floating in tanks with a bubbler in them. Getting tons of shrimp and removing with a dropper. Now rinsing:). Seems to be working. Just way too much shrimp in the hatchery. They seem to live longer in the Tupperware too.


Tom,
Read this thread...

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?139810-My-first-fry-tank-in-a-Long-time

You can grind your fdbw in a coffee grinder. Then soak a few minutes and use a turkey baster to feed just like when feeding bbs. .. grind to the size the fry can eat.

My .8mm discus chow fry starter, discus chow 1mm, and Diskus Gold 1mm are fine for raising fry to adult. Its what I do here.
Al

[Iminit]

Lol Chuck! Salt and water! Yep I’ve got to think these thing through :). I thought we were rinsing off the salt not bad bacteria. Couldn’t figure why we’d want to put them in salt again. Found a video last night and did it. Thanks!!

Al yes I’d read about the coffee grinder set up. Just making sure. And I will order some baby food. Thanks!!

[Charlyc11]

I been giving you answers that I can wile I am in pain. Tuesday nights thunder storm one of my dogs bit the tip off my right hand index finger. Ouch that hurt, hopefully the pain killers did not cloud my thoughts. I would post a pic's but to bloody.

[brewmaster15]

I been giving you answers that I can wile I am in pain. Tuesday nights thunder storm one of my dogs bit the tip off my right hand index finger. Ouch that hurt, hopefully the pain killers did not cloud my thoughts. I would post a pic's but to bloody.

Ouch! So much for not biting the hand that feeds you! Poor dog must have been really scared by the storm. Hope it heals quickly Chuck.


Al

[Discus Fever]

[QUOTE=Iminit;1376768]Lol cone is gone!! Not giving them any ideas lol. Ok not a fan of beef heart. Will freeze dried black worms work? If not what else or should I buy frozen beef heart. If so what brand?


Freeze dried blood worms will work but I would leave them with the parents for 3 weeks before you remove them and feed them black worms or anything else.

[Iminit]

OMG! Sorry about your hand! Was it the dog that was here? And thanks for all the info!!
No plan of moving them. Just getting things ready :). Will introduce the black worms with the bbs in hopes that they eat both.

[Charlyc11]

OMG! Sorry about your hand! Was it the dog that was here? And thanks for all the info!!
No plan of moving them. Just getting things ready :). Will introduce the black worms with the bbs in hopes that they eat both.

No we always keep him home he is known bite, but got to love him. This is not the first time he bit me he is a little nuts and he is on prozac. This is the worst bite so far no more petting the beast.

136382

[Iminit]

Some more pics of the babies! These are from day 14 136447136448. Looking good so far.

[brewmaster15]

Tom, they look like they are doing great. Keep up the good work.

Al

[Charlyc11]

The are growing so fast;)

[fljones3]

Good job, Tom! Nice looking.

[Iminit]

Thanks all! Here’s todays pic 136452

[seanyuki]

courtesy of Jackie Tran 2 TAT discus, discus baby growth timeline.

136458

[brewmaster15]

courtesy of Jackie Tran 2 TAT discus, discus baby growth timeline.

136458

That is an awesome poster! really well done!

[Iminit]

Nice poster! But he pulled the parents at day 15? Next what is the word on doing pp treatments? I’m not a fan of pp but I’ve read it a lot that it needs to be done on or by the 4th week. This true? And if it needs to be done can anyone explain to me the way it’s done. I have pp just never used it.

[brewmaster15]

Nice poster! But he pulled the parents at day 15? Next what is the word on doing pp treatments? I’m not a fan of pp but I’ve read it a lot that it needs to be done on or by the 4th week. This true? And if it needs to be done can anyone explain to me the way it’s done. I have pp just never used it.

Two comments..

1. There is no hard fast rule on when to pull them.. see post 10 and 12 this thread.

2. PP?.. Trying to bait me ? :) Seriously, I will bite...pp is absolutely not necessary as a prophylactic and can damage developing gill tissues.

Al

[Adamski77]

This is such a lovely picture! Congratulations!

[seanyuki]

30 day death syndrome
Poor water quality
Overcrowding
High bio load of organic waste
Poor filtration
Poor aeration/ low oxygen levels
Lingering diseases without a proper QT
Parents infested with flukes
Wrong size tank Overfeeding
Poor husbandry
High temps
Poor Filtration
Poor Filtration Flow
Not enough water changes.
These are all the things that can lead up to bacteria, Gill disease also know as BGD or some like to call it 30 day syndrome.

[Iminit]

;) morning Al :). Well I read it on Facebook :). Truth! They’re claiming every 3 weeks:eek:!

Wait a minute Francis!! Those things all sound like things a keeper could be doing wrong!! Got to be another reason;)!!

[CliffsDiscus]

I wouldn't PP but remove the fry as some starts to eat from the tank floor they are going to pick up the cysts left from the flukes.

[Iminit]

Ok remove thosd 136462eating off the floor. These guys are starting to adventure around the tank. I’ve got a 30g set up waiting for the babies.

[Iminit]

Ok I think I’ve got a problem one. Been noticing it’s been swimming kind of off. Guessing this one should be culled. Center of frame
http://youtu.be/3jbmU0wfqlI?si=zaeuSzxid3R9IgzR

[CliffsDiscus]

Looks like a bladder problem(slider).

[brewmaster15]

Tom,
That one definitely has issues and should be culled.. it has very short gill plates as well as its swimming poorly.
Al

[Iminit]

Thanks! I did pull it and another after this evenings water change. Just to see if they would live I put them in the 20g.

[Iminit]

20 days old! Still looking good to me! 136469136470136471. Feeding a mixture of fdbw discus chow sera and flakes all mashed to a powder and bbs. Seem to now be eating everything. If you guys could tell me what you think of these fry. Thanks

[brewmaster15]

Tom how much water are you changing?

Are you making a fresh batch of bbs 1 time a day or 2?

[brewmaster15]

136472


Tom, Don't panic over this but in the above image a few look like they have short gill plates.. B = bad, short Gill plates.. G = good ..good gill plates. This could just be the image not the fish.. sometime the gills flare out after they eat as they excrete ammonia and take in Oxygen..catch it wrong in the camera and a good fish looks not so good. The trick is to look at them when the gill is closed..The Gill plate should cover the gill region. Insufficient water changes, less than optimal food can lead to short gill plates. Other than that the size looks good and the shape looks good.
:)
I would also like to comment that your photography is improving in leaps and bounds! :)

[Iminit]

Lol Al thank you!!! But it’s still just the iPhone :). The fish are getting bigger:) ok I’m changing water twice a day at the 9s. Changing 70%. I’m feeding bbs a hatch + a day. Also feeding a mix of fdbw discus chow sera crumbles and flakes I’ve mashed to dust. I add water to it and with eye dropper spray it about the fish. They are eating it. Anything else I should be feeding. And yes I tell them to exhale before every picture;). Got to say I always liked the BG’s and I’m just hoping to keep them Staying Alive!!

[CliffsDiscus]

Tom, I notice some of the fry have a dip at the dorsal fin, may want to keep an eye to see how they grow out. Not sure if the dips are genetic, didn't notice this on the parents.

[Iminit]

All good here but have a question. Does anyone add salt to their young discus? If so how much per 10g? 136504136505

[brewmaster15]

Tom theres no need to add salt to discus tanks as a matter of routine including fry tanks. Just add clean water daily.:)

[Iminit]

Ok day 25. Came down this morn and one had died. No clue why? 3 days ago because I have a 20g set up for them and because my wife refused to let me cull the 2 sliders. They’ve been in the 20 by themselves. So I added 2 more from the main tank. Been adding more daily and now up to 10 with sliders. Main has 15 with parents. Ones with parents are growing bigger. Even though I never see them they must still be eating off the parents. Parents are still dark. Thought they would have lighting up by now. The parents do fight a lot. Male seems to be chasing his reflection off the bottom. I feed them every time a feed the fry. 136537136538136539.136540

Any thing else I should be feeding?

[Charlyc11]

Got to love them they look nice. How many did you end up with? I won't give mine another try until I come back from my Scottsdale try next month.

[Iminit]

As of now 25. 2 sliders.

Here’s a video of the parents going at it.
http://youtu.be/6tdLDS6seuE?si=3Y0rbGOpiQNoeiLr

[brewmaster15]

Tom the fry are looking great....now about those sliders. You probably should try and get your better half there to let them go. Sliding along the bottom now as small light fry may not be too hard on them but the bigger they get .. the more prone for abrasions and infections. Sliding is not something they can recover from. Culling is really the most compassionate thing to do for these fry.:(
Al

[Iminit]

Yes I know and will remove soon. She’ll never notice. They don’t really slide. They swim around the tank but with their heads up. At night they do lay on the bottom and sleep. Reminds me of clown loaches. Just strange.

[Iminit]

Ok todays dilemma! Parents are fighting and they’ve got all the fry trapped under the heater. Saw this and I checked the temp. First though the parents want them warm (silly me). So I through some food in. One comes out and both parents go after it like it’s food. It gets back under the heater and like a horror flick the parents are now possessed and trying to kill them. So I remove all the fry and all now in 20g without parents. All looks good now. Did water changes and added salt to the parents tank. They do look beat up from the fry. Thinking they may want to mate again i but the cone in. Hoping thats not it!!.

[brewmaster15]

Tom,
Removing the fry was the right call and they will be fine on their own.. just feed aa you were. Odds are the parents are getting ready to spawn again.. Im guessing probably in the next few days.

Al

[CliffsDiscus]

Watch out if there is too much fighting you might have to separate the pair.

[Iminit]

No the fighting has stoped and they are getting some color back.136559136560. Ang the fry are doing well without them :).
http://youtu.be/iLjJS2rU_C0?si=zrdK7KrMKlHAp9Sv

[Charlyc11]

My two pairs are having a battle in the 120 and at the moment I don't have a tank cycled to separate. They might need a new distraction. Maybe adding my big Marlboro to the mix might get their attention.

[Iminit]

I say no! That Marlboro is a Hans fish? Stendker? If so I would not put it with the Asians. Stenkers are great fish but don’t do well with others. I had 14 and lost all but one and it’s alive but in terrible shape.

[Charlyc11]

I say no! That Marlboro is a Hans fish? Stendker? If so I would not put it with the Asians. Stenkers are great fish but don’t do well with others. I had 14 and lost all but one and it’s alive but in terrible shape.

Who beat up who. I can try If it doesn't work their always room for change. Al mentioned that he was successful in the past and as long as it doesn't create cross contamination I am willing to try. You think they would kill my Asians?
I don't know what I will do I got to think about it I certainly don't want to make it worst.

[brewmaster15]

My two pairs are having a battle in the 120 and at the moment I don't have a tank cycled to separate. They might need a new distraction. Maybe adding my big Marlboro to the mix might get their attention.
Chuck unless the discus are actually hurting each other, sparring and chasing is fine. They are just setting up territories. Often just adding some additional
Structure is alls it takes to settle the tank.

As for mixing the stendker, you have had all the fish longbenough now where I doubt there will be a problem with one or the group getting sick. But adding most likely will cause more issues than fix,imo

[Charlyc11]

Chuck unless the discus are actually hurting each other, sparring and chasing is fine. They are just setting up territories. Often just adding some additional
Structure is alls it takes to settle the tank.

As for mixing the stendker, you have had all the fish longbenough now where I doubt there will be a problem with one or the group getting sick. But adding most likely will cause more issues than fix,imo

Yeah I am going to hold of for now anyway hopefully they will calm down. When I first got them they were paired up differently so that might the issue. plus they all hang out where the food ends up. I will make some structure changes to see if it helps. Thanks Al

[CliffsDiscus]

My two pairs are having a battle in the 120 and at the moment I don't have a tank cycled to separate. They might need a new distraction. Maybe adding my big Marlboro to the mix might get their attention.

Chuck, can you put in an egg crate divider? You won't have to add the Marlboro, and avoid any mix diseases.

[Charlyc11]

Thanks to all the Marlboros stay where they are. I moved some things around and it's a bit better.

[Charlyc11]

So now they decided to use the UV unit to lay some eggs. Tom sorry for the hijack.

136581

136582

[Iminit]

No problem at all!!

Some I think ;) better pics from today. They are now readily eating the discus chow and fdbw. Thinking I will ween them off of the bbs. 136585136586136587136588136589136590 so do they look good?they look great to me :).

[brewmaster15]

Tom they are looking fine. Seems like only a few weeks ago I was egging you on to not give up on trying breeding.. You are welcome.:) congratulations!
Al

[Iminit]

Like!!!

[Charlyc11]

Like. Lol

Yes they look great. wow

[CliffsDiscus]

Tom, nice going, congrats.

Cliff

[fljones3]

Good job, Tom! Congratulations!

[Iminit]

Does anyone add prime to water with fry. With all the rain I’m worried the water company may have added something

[fljones3]

Tom, I have —

[Iminit]

Thanks! I was changing water when I thought of that. Went without and all is good :).

[CliffsDiscus]

Does anyone add prime to water with fry. With all the rain I’m worried the water company may have added something

Yes , add prime, I usually add double dose when it rains the water companies sometimes add more chemicals when it rains.

[Adamski77]

No problem at all!!

Some I think ;) better pics from today. They are now readily eating the discus chow and fdbw. Thinking I will ween them off of the bbs. 136585136586136587136588136589136590 so do they look good?they look great to me :).

I’m no expert but they look great and I wish one day to get to this stage. Well done!

[Iminit]

Thanks Adam!
These guys are at the quarter size now. Eating fdbw. Still feeding bbs but they like the worms better. So I’m dome making bbs for now! Parents look great again and laid eggs a few days ago. And happily ate them :).136665 fry are looking good and need a bigger tank.136666136667136668. Will be setting up this 40 tomorrow.136669. Think I may need a bigger tank!!

[Charlyc11]

You sure do.

[AquaticNerd]

Looking good Tom - your committment to them is definitely showing in their quality. :)

[brewmaster15]

Great Job Tom..next up.. Shipping 101. :)

Al

[Charlyc11]

Great Job Tom..next up.. Shipping 101. :)

Al

I will just go and pick them up. No need to ship to me I will gladly go visit Tom.

[brewmaster15]

I will just go and pick them up. No need to ship to me I will gladly go visit Tom.Now Chuck, thats just enabling him to not ship... whats going to happen when he is over run with fry and your tank is full.:evilgrin:

Al

Besides..I hate driving into New York from CT. Traffic is a royal PITA. ;)

[Charlyc11]

Al
That's what the Ferry is for from Bridgeport to Port Jefferson. I use to live in Stony Brook LI about 5 min from Port Jeff and the Ferry was very convenient to avoid NYC (probably expensive). Now from Maryland I come in through the South Shore and the only issues are Staten Island and some traffic at the bridges.
Plus I am due to visit the other fish keeper in the family my daughter, haven't seen her since I visited Tom the last time.

[Iminit]

Like!!!

[Charlyc11]

your tank is full.:evilgrin:

Al
Besides when does a fish keeper run out of tank space? When we run out of room for more tanks.

Then we stack.... :eek:


Like!!!:guitarist:

[Iminit]

All still good here. They are now in the 40g and eating fine. Changing 70% once a day now. No problems136791136792136793136794136795. Funny the 2 sliders I moved into a 5g by themselves. They are eating great and now swimming fine. Smaller than the others by half but growing. The parents are on eggs again136796. So everything is happening here!!!

[brewmaster15]

Lmao.. Tom you are about to understand why raising discus fry is so challenging. Easy to run out of tank space.
Probably a good time to replace the sofa with a rack of tanks:)

[Charlyc11]

That's what happens, you need a bigger basement or modify the garage into a fish room.

[Iminit]

Nope! Not doing it. Just what’s going on now is taking up way to much time! Plus the black rams laid eggs last week but fungused. Now yesterday a pair of golds laid eggs and I took about half. Got them in a Tupperware to see if they hatch.

[brewmaster15]

Nope! Not doing it. Just what’s going on now is taking up way to much time! Plus the black rams laid eggs last week but fungused. Now yesterday a pair of golds laid eggs and I took about half. Got them in a Tupperware to see if they hatch.

But Tom, Isn't this how you wanted to spend your retirement?:evilgrin: Nothing more fulfilling than being the wet nurse to a bunch baby fishies..lol

al

[Iminit]

Truthfully it does take up a lot of time during the day when I’d be doing nothing. For that I like it. The sick fish I have now is just discouraging. Hate to see it like it is. Want it to get better :). Just me. It’s funny I didn’t cull those 2 sliders. This is them now.136816136817. To me they look fine just smaller.

[brewmaster15]

Tom,I'm surprised they recovered from "sliding"..most don't. I think as they get older though you will notice they have issues. Odds are the shape will be very bad and they may have short gill plates and they will be runts. Its a good learning tool as to what to watch for in fry development. I hope they turn out well for you but Its not really likely.

Al

[Iminit]

Yes I figure something will be wrong with them. But that doesn’t matter to me :). I was expecting them to just die off. Since I started I’ve had 3 just die off. One I think got stuck behind a filter but the other 2 one stopped eating. I moved it in with the runts but it died in a week. The last just died last night. No real clue why. Looked fine. Going to add the uv today just for something extra in there. Also gave Chris 6 yesterday. Now I can see how they grow for others. Will be giveing 6 also to Chuck when he comes up. :) keeping away from shipping! The parents ate the eggs again. Is this normal? I thought once they worked it out they just kept on going. Of course it could be my wife! She keeps telling them to eat the eggs!!

[brewmaster15]

Lol.. yes it can happen normally. Sometimes its because they get spooked...too much traffic around them.. others its because they fight over them.. sometimes they just feel.like caviar:)

[Iminit]

Well it almost 7 weeks. Gave Chris 6 and they are doing good. I have one now that looks bloated. Thinking of giving an epson salt bath or moving into 5g and adding a tablespoon of epson salt.136890. The one on the right. The other was hanging with it put is now back with the rest. If bath how much epson salt or should I just use salt? Rest are looking good and about the size of a fifty cent peice.136891136892

[Charlyc11]

Epson salt is the laxative I use 2 teaspoons per 10 gallons. Others might use more.

[Iminit]

Yes just not sure if you can use it with fry? That one died already.

[Charlyc11]

Yes just not sure if you can use it with fry? That one died already.

I don't think it should be an issue it get used to add GH on RO. But somebody else might have the answer.

[Iminit]

Lost another. That’s 2 today. Both seem to be bloated. I’m going to cut down on the feedings. Down to 12 now. 10 look good 2 may also be bloated. They are hiding. Always a bad sign!

[brewmaster15]

Tom you can use epsom salt with them at a rate of 1 tablespoon per 10 gals .. treat the whole tank..it will not harm them...they will not even notice.

Now as to the bloating. If they are passing white feces its a sign that they picked up an infection. .. if not they probably have been eating. Too fast too much. I would switch feed to just the discus chow for a few days.. if feeding the blackworms... be sure to not over feed..better to feed less and more often.

If theres any white feces.. its likely they picked up an infection.. metronidazole can often treat it.. or kanamycin.
This happens when feeding a lot and not all.the food is eaten.. it can start to rot.. it can also happen when one weaker fish gets sick and starts passing feces.. the others eat it and you start losing fish. Its one reason why culling the weak benefits the other fry.

[Iminit]

Yeah I’ve do t know what’s up. No white poo. But the stomach’s do look bloated. Have been feeding fdbw. I cut them up so they ate small and soak them first. They were eating everything. Nothing on the bottom. Sometimes I’d throw the chow in and they wouldn’t eat it till I stoped feeding for an hour or so. Then they would eat the chow off the bottom. Temp is 83-84 and I’m changing 70% water daily.

[brewmaster15]

How often are you feeding Tom?

[brewmaster15]

I just had a close look at the last pics you posted Tom. I can see alot of pieces of blackworms in the water column and the fish are already looking pretty full. Im thinking you may be over feeding here. Problem with young fry is they will often pig out and eat and eat if you feed them too much and they really like the food fed.

[Iminit]

Too much I think. I’d say as much as they could eat in a min about 10x a day. Next I’d soak some black worms and feed them till the cup was empty. So that could have been 3+ hours of those soaked worms. I’m wondering if it could be the length of time I fed the soaked worms. But this is the way I feed all my discus. Even when I had 2” discus. I fed till their bellies looked full and then id wait till they were lean again and feed. 2” grew big.

[brewmaster15]

Tom how are the fry?

[Iminit]

Nothing bad today :). Yesterday 2 didn’t look good. So I went to move them and the first one became super fish. Took me about 5 min to catch it. Next the other guy became a model fish. Right there with all the others. So the one by itself is in a 5g with a teaspoon of salt and looks fine this morn. The other guy is still with all the other fish. Only fed them a few times yesterday and not much. Will only feed about 4 times today. Still changing 70% daily and added the uv light. Hoping things get better. The 6 I gave Chris’s are doing great. Been feeding the discus chow and they pick at it but don’t go after it. Not soaking the worms as long as I did. Just getting them wet to sink. There are 9 in the tank now if I went to cubes would a 1/4,1/2 or whole cube be good a feeding. Made bbs but they’re not eating it. Some pics136902this is the one that is now looking good in main tank. Stress bar are showing though.136903136904136905136906

[brewmaster15]

I'm pretty sure that the 10 times a day feeding was the issue..:) not that you can't do that, but you have to be sure that you aren't feeding too much at each time. Glad that its looking better there. .. You don't need to stuff them to the gills to get get good growth,IME.

hth,
al

[Iminit]

Yes Al thank you! All info and help is greatly appreciated! This breeding is a lot of work! Keeps me busy and interesting but not really into it. Was happy I was able to give Chris the 6. Moving them out made more room for the rest and they do seem to be doing good for him. Plus I get to see how they grow for him :). Hope these guys get back on track hoping to give Chuck some too. The parents have laid eggs again. This is their 4th time since I’ve moved out the fry. They stress all the rest. This time the laid in a new spot so maybe that’s a sign?

Sick female from the beginning is still sick. Gave her prazi the poly guard and erythromycin. But nothing has changed. Moved her back into the 30g with the bosemani.

Ram fry were a bust only 1 fry still alive but have a new batch of eggs and will take a different approach this time. Still want to get it right but no plans to continue. These are gold rams I’m stealing the eggs from my main discus tank. Still waiting for the blacks to lay eggs again.

So I’ve got tons going on! These tanks and my hillstream tank and shrimp tanks and community tanks…..:).

[brewmaster15]

Lol.. yes you do! :) but thats what makes it fun.

[Charlyc11]

When I get back I will separate my pairs and see what happens. Still in Arizona 100F at day time. Be home Monday night. My fish sitter is doing great but I had a scare since the power went out for a few minutes and WI-FI did not reset, I was very nervous but got her to reset my router so now I can monitor remotely again. Jut get the fry better don’t worry about me.

[Iminit]

Well a good day! Nothing died! And again I’m cleaning out my hillstream loach tank and what do you know? I’ve got about 30 bosemani fry in this tank. No bosemani parents. I moved some plants a week or so ago and there were eggs in them. Such a difference. One doesn’t need parents and discus can’t survive without parents. Most fish fry don’t need their parents. You’d almost say they’re strong. While discus need the parents slime to survive. Kind of weak. No? Without the parents they ain’t going anywhere. :).

[LizStreithorst]

No, it's not a weakness. It's how God intended them to be.

Congrats on the fry. I've moved plants and ended up wth Rainbow fry. Mine have always been mutts, though.

[Iminit]

Thanks Liz! Just messing with Al there :).

[brewmaster15]

Well a good day! Nothing died! And again I’m cleaning out my hillstream loach tank and what do you know? I’ve got about 30 bosemani fry in this tank. No bosemani parents. I moved some plants a week or so ago and there were eggs in them. Such a difference. One doesn’t need parents and discus can’t survive without parents. Most fish fry don’t need their parents. You’d almost say they’re strong. While discus need the parents slime to survive. Kind of weak. No? Without the parents they ain’t going anywhere. :).


Thanks Liz! Just messing with Al there :).

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?140276-Some-Folks-have-it-in-their-heads-Discus-are-weak


Right back at you Tom:)

[Iminit]

Ok had a death last night. Had removed it and put in a separate tank. Treated with prazi. Some Epsom salt and it did release something. Looked thinner. Thought it was improving. Last night it looked bloated again and dead this morn. Should I treat what’s left of them? 8. With absolute wormer or prazi or something else. I’ve greatly decreased the amount of feedings. They are now at 8 weeks.

[brewmaster15]

Ok had a death last night. Had removed it and put in a separate tank. Treated with prazi. Some Epsom salt and it did release something. Looked thinner. Thought it was improving. Last night it looked bloated again and dead this morn. Should I treat what’s left of them? 8. With absolute wormer or prazi or something else. I’ve greatly decreased the amount of feedings. They are now at 8 weeks.

Tom unless the other fry look like they are ill I wouldn't treat them. I don't think its a worm issue. The fry probably had a bacterial infection its been fighting and the epsom salt caused all that junk to be expelled. It could have just been blocked up.

al

[Iminit]

Ok but the thing is this at least the 6th one to do this. The fish moves away from the group bloats up and dies. One died last night and it seems like another has taken its spot. Very strange. Here’s some pics and later I’ll put up a vid of the new one137134137135137136

[Iminit]

Ok this is a vid of the newest victim. Does anyone see the problem?
http://youtu.be/P8-SejoYu9k?si=op6reowy2kWYNnc6 any idea on a treatment?

[Iminit]

Well 10 weeks in and still have 7 and the 2 runts. The runts seem very resilient. I’ve moved them 4 times. Today they went into a 30g. Maybe will get some growth now. Other 7 seem to be growing.137482137483 and the runts137484 the 2 new ones still with the parents are now just 1. Somebody snacked last night!:(

[Charlyc11]

They are looking good Tom.

[AquaticNerd]

Looking good so far Tom. How's the bloating issue been coming along? Have you figured out what was causing it? Did you end up treating? If so, how?

[Iminit]

Sorry Jake I’ve got no clue as to why. Lost one a few days ago. Down to 7 and the 2 runts. The parents laid eggs again today so I pulled the last fry and added it to an assorted fry tank. 2 rams 1 bosemani and now one discus. Oh and a few baby plecos too! A 5g. Will see how this goes.

[Iminit]

So they’re 11 weeks old now. Getting big so pics are a little better.137560137561137562137563137564137565

[AquaticNerd]

Also looks like some are starting to show some patterns! Looking good! :D

[Iminit]

Been awhile but still doing good.
http://youtu.be/j-eoLTBfcgE?si=EeEseMG6sHlTaEaJ

[brewmaster15]

Been awhile but still doing good.
http://youtu.be/j-eoLTBfcgE?si=EeEseMG6sHlTaEaJ

Most are snakeskins but looks like a leopard in the mix.. good job Tom.

al

[Iminit]

Some pics137917137918137919137920137921137922137923

[Charlyc11]

That's some beautiful kids very nice.

[Iminit]

And some pics of the parents.137934137935137936137937

[brewmaster15]

Tom keep a close eye on the male.. he looks stressed.

[Adamski77]

Al… your observation is based on transpiring stress bars? Just would like to understand…

[Iminit]

Thanks Al. He’s looked like that for months now. No idea why? But does seem fine. Here’s a pic from sept just after the fry were swimming137942. Been keeping an eye on both because of how the third one died. Both eating and not losing weight.

[brewmaster15]

Al… your observation is based on transpiring stress bars? Just would like to understand…
Its the stress bars,dark fins and most of all washed out color. Usually the color pops in fish that are paired.. just gave me the impression it was not feeling well. Older fish can get that look too.

But from Toms sept pic it doesnt look to have changed much. ..which is a good sign.

Al

[Iminit]

Yes it’s a strange fish. Batik eruption. Here’s the day I got it137944 he’s up front. This pic is 10 days later137945 far left. The other 2 are females and have both been laying eggs together on a regular basis. Neither wanted the male in the tank. So I removed a female and he looked like this137946. Guess fry don’t agree with him. They only raised fry once. Been eating them regularly since. Now debating adding them to main tank.

[Iminit]

Well the parents are inthe main tank. Been a few weeks now. Hard to say how they’re doing. Female already laid eggs with a different male (no loyalty :)). The babies are growing. Showing pattern’s and some color. 138374138375138376. Lots of food and water changes!!

[danotaylor]

“Lots of food and water changes”
It shows Tom. Your juvies look bloody awesome. Very nice body shape for their size and some stellar patterns starting to show. Very well done mate!! :D

[Charlyc11]

Nice looking wow.

[For100]

Looking great. How old are they?

[Iminit]

Thanks guys. Been changing water daily. Yes happy with how they’re coming out. They are just over 4 months.

[brewmaster15]

They are doing great Tom. Looks like some nice spotting is developing.

Al

[Iminit]

Pics of parents in main tank.138632138633 male is acting fine and eating. But still looking kind of gray and showing bars.

[jwcarlson]

I think I started going gray while acting fine and eating (too much) when I first had kids too. Also still doing that now.

[Iminit]

Lol!! We need that like button!

[Iminit]

All has been going well here. All 7 still living139299 139300. The 2 biggest I moved into the 180 first week of March 2 weeks later I added 2 more and a few days later added the last 3 to the 125. All are doing well.139301 125 the 3 on the left. And in the 180 they are the smallest of the group.139302

[brewmaster15]

Tom you did a great Job with them! They have some really nice spotting developing.

al

[Iminit]

Thanks!! I’m happy with the way they turned out and now just hoping they grow more in the bigger tanks. The female parent has been laying eggs with a pigeon blood since I moved her into the 180. So I’m going to put them into the 50 and see how it goes.139303139304

[danotaylor]

Nice work Tom!!