Best products for lowering ph

[turbobuickgn]

The ph in my tap water is a bit higher than i would like it to be and when i do my water changes it brings the ph up in my tank more than i would like.  After letting the water sit out for 48 hours what product should i use to lower the ph i would like it in the 6.8 range before adding it to the tank and it is currently between 7.8 and 8.0.

Also i plan on going with an RO unit in the future which one do you recommend i only need 20 gallons every 48 hours. Can i please get some links.  Do you need to let the 25% of tap water that you add to the ro fitered water sit out for 48 hours before mixing.

Thanks in advance for  all advice
Scott

[JacKWattleyDiscus]

If you are using a holding tank. You can use Muriatic Acid. Place a cap full in for at least 30 gallons of water.
After a 24 hour rest take a PH reading and see if the PH is around where you want it to be.
This is the cheapest and most affective way of lowering the PH. This is the method used in our hatchery.
Gabe

[DISCUSDADDYSLC]

Gabe my goodness glad to see you helping out  :) Do you use the acid with the breeding pairs to?

[turbobuickgn]

where can i find muriatic acid at my lfs ? at home supply store?

Are you also adding a ph stabilizer to the water or just the muriatic acid

Hi 'turbobuickgn
Try your locall spa store or a builders supply!
HTH
Cary Gld!

[daninthesand]

turbobuickgn


Muriatic acid is often used for swimming pools. Try a swimming pool supply store.

Dan

Dan,
I thought You said You were going to Sleep :o LOL!
Cary Gld!

[JacKWattleyDiscus]

DISCUSDADDYSLC
WE use very little muriatic in the already soft breeder tanks.  5.5 PH is the lowest we want to be at. But we use it everywhere else in the hatchery. Have been now for the last 7 years. We use about 12 galons a month.
Gabe

[taybelZ]

you could also use Hydrochloric acid.
(HCL- ACID)
its pretty dangerous stuff... definately something you open outside... trust me!!!!
it make my head spin, and nose burn for a whole day!
also.. you got to let it aerate for at least 24 hrs.. so you get stable PH.
but seems like Muriatic acid is the way to go... haven't tried. since i only have some baby discus.. just use tap ph. 7.8ish.

[JacKWattleyDiscus]

taybelZ
Muriatic is 37% HCL.
Gabe

[keno]

I have soft water, i used to use peat then i switched to muratic acid, they sell it at my local home depot in the swimmming pool section. I mix it in a gallon container with 3 parts water to one part acid, i do this so i dont have to work with the straight acid. Then i add a few ml's of this to my holding tank. has been working great for me for the last 6 months.

Ken

[discusmith]

I'm finding all this info on water chemistry very interesting.  I used to think that keeping discus successfully meant getting there water hardness and PH just right.  I not so sure now.  I just had a visit yesterday with Daryl Szyska in Chicago.  He's a very experienced and knowledgable breeder-keeper.  I arrived while he was doing water changes.  He basically went from tank to tank sucking out half the water then refilling from the tap.  I saw no carbon prefilter on the hose so I assume he isn't concerned about any chlorine problem.  As he put it he doesn't baby his fish.  Grow outs and adults all the same.  I know he treats his breeders differently.  My point is if we are doing regular water changes and cleaning is the chemistry we have available important for keeping these fish happy and healthy??  Should we only be mucking with the water for the pairs we have set up for breeding?  I left there thinking I am working way too hard and making this much more difficult than it needs to be.

You should see this guys fish!  I've never seen discus attack food the way his fish do!  He had just fed them they all still had swollen bellies.  He said "you want to see them eat?"  He threw more food in the water and they pummeled it like they hadn't had a good meal in a week!  I mean it was all gone in seconds.  I have pics I can post if I ever figure out what the heck I'm doing wrong.

[discusmith]

Well that pic posted just fine.  It is a turquoise pair with young Daryl had because he was out of room at his dads place.  I you can see he doesn't  go out of his way.

[Kagan]

Hi there,

I have a question:
Doesn't muriatic acid or HCl increase the conductivity?? I have read it somewhere. Am I wrong? If it does; how does it?? It gives Cl- and H+ ions. Doesn't Cl form a gaseous molecule?? Please correct me. Thanks in advance. Take care

Kagan

[taybelZ]

Gabe, just wondering why not use HCL then... wouldn't it be more concentrated then muriatic acid.
or did you mean muriatic is 37% concetrated..
where as HCL is only 33%..
make sense??
perhaps not LOL

[JacKWattleyDiscus]

Muriatic is made up of 37% HCL. HCL on it's own is extremely, I mean lethal strong. It is quite difficult to obtain, and after 9/11 you can kiss the idea of even coming close to getting it good by. It would have to be diluted any way so Muriatic at 37% is strong enough.
Gabe

[taybelZ]

Ok thanks for that Gabe,
trust me i know how strong HCL acid is... i opened a 5 Litre bottle in my room, and all the fumes fully spun me out!!
gave me a sore head for the rest of the day and couldn't think straight... never touch it any more.

[ozone]

What about using Citric acid which is available from most supermarkets?? 8)

[Smokey]

!!! - has everybody forgotten about the real source .

Not only does it lower the pH - it lowers the gh and the KH. MOST IMPORTANT OF ALL. It has a natural anti-bacterial agent --- bonus!!
AND it does not stress discus. OR the need to play around with abnorminal chemistry.

Smokey

[Wolf]

I've been using m. acid succesfully for around a 8 months now . I use the same method as keno and I have had several spawns from my pair. I use it to lower my ph from 10.8 to 6.5.. I get it at home depot for $7 for 2 gallons. I've only gone through half a gallon in the last 8 months and I change at least 55g of water a day.

[ReeferKimberly]

Scott! r u back into discus?????
ur fish have been pairing...have two eggs laying (and eating) pairs so far....
good to see you back!
kimberly :-*

[April]

Kim. check the dates out. that post was last june. it was brought back up to be revisited.

[ReeferKimberly]

aww shucks :( lol should check next time....
and i wanted to see him back :( i have most of his old fish..
kimberly

[Shari]

So for those of us who still need to bucket, what is best way to use Muriatic Acid? Eye dropper, drop at a time?
With some experimentation, if you get the bucket to the ph you want, any reason you can't pour directly into tank? Or does it need to sit for hours first?
I've had the Discus tanks up to the tap PH 7.6-7.8 for a number of weeks since learing on this site most folks haven't worried about the ph so long as it's consistant, but besides more bacteria problems I didn't used to have, the Discus aren't quite the same personalities they were in lower ph.

[Willie]

In Chemistry lab, we used to teach freshman to always add acid to water, never add water to acid. Its still a good rule.

Willie ;)

Hi all.

Quote: "any reason you can't pour directly into tank? Or does it need to sit for hours first?"

It is my understanding that you must age it for 24 hrs.
Depending on the buffer ability of your water the Acid can bounce either way and you need to let it react.
I had made tests where the water after 1 hrs. had much different parameter then after 24 hrs.

My Water has a very low kH to beginn with, so I don't know how the reaction time is with hard water (high KH)

Ronald

[Smokey]

Good advice, Ron.

Is the acid neturalizing the GH salts; or the KH salts ?

Smokey, I am not sure.
I am by no means a water guru.
In my tests with the low KH and gH it had a impact on both.
It also has increased my conductance.
My KH was around 1 dKH to begin with so after adding Acid and ageing for 24hrs I ended up with a continuous drop of pH. It is for sure a total other story if the KH and gH is high to begin with.
I think Roger had done some tests with his water which was as he said "Liquid Rock"

Ronald

[SoloDiscus]

I know a lot of people are not too keen on it but ive had great success with proper ph 6.5 Definately easy to use.

[Shari]

Solo -
Does the ProperPH 6.5 or 7.0 stay consistant?
I have only used Seachem Regulator and Buffer which did work and hold the ph I would set it at. But with water changes sure gets expensive.
Let me know - do you do daily wcs or if not how often?
At least I could buy that at the local store.

[SoloDiscus]

Mine stays very consistant. I usually mail order it. I do my water changes once a week.