DIY water storage [Archive]

limige

05-31-2003, 01:08 PM

anybody make their own water storage tanks?

post pics here!!! explain if needed.
oh please dont post garbage cans and 55 gallon food storage barrels, i'm looking for inventive, large capasity ideas here!

as for me i've pondered fiberglassing one.
but first i'm going to try one with a 2x4 frame lined with a plastic sheet.

the one i'm building has rough dimensions of 5'x3'x3', i bought a roll of 4 mil plastic sheeting 15'x25' to line it. so far i think i've used 8 2x4x10's and a handful of screws. i want to line the frame with 1/2 plywood to support the plastic.

so what are your ideas?!

stilllearnin

05-31-2003, 02:22 PM

since your useing plywood ,wouldn't paint last longer then plastic lineing? just a thought

dred

06-12-2003, 03:35 AM

limige,

Just a thought, but aren't you building a plywood tank w/o the viewing window? There are several instruction sets linked from this seciton.

tedd47

06-13-2003, 04:51 PM

You might want to rethink things, 4 mill is pretty thin no matter how many layers it also gets brittle over a pretty short time. If 1 layer gets a puncture the water will just go from layer to layer until it works it's way out (leaK)

Find a roofing contractor supply house and get rolled rubber roofing. It's the same thing as outdoor pond liner except it is half as expensive. All you have to do to it is unroll it and scrub it with a coarse brush and rinse it off with a hose. It has talc powder on it to keep it from sticking together (pond liner does not). Before anyone talks about the toxic stuff in it, it is made by the same company as all the pond liners I've talked to sales reps about it and have built 20 or so ponds using it.

Or you could build it out of plywood and fiberglass and resin the whole thing. 1 layer of glass and 3-4 layers of resin would hold it together and waterproof it. and if you get tired of it you could use it for a boat. :)

If I had the room (no basement) I would use the largest truck water tank that I could fit in the door, they are made from poly so they never crack or rot, and they make some that are only about 30" wide and still hold 3-4hundred gallons. Just my thoughts (a few) on it. Hope this helps. Ted

limige

06-14-2003, 01:26 AM

well, the thing about glass is i wanted it to be collaspable. i cant' fit a 5x3x3' container up my stairs, lol plus it would be dangerous working with resin near my furnace/water heater.

i guess i didn't think about the plastic becoming brittle. epoxy paint isn't cheap either and really stinks, but i guess you could do each panel seperate and silicone the joints...

rolled roofing, i'll have to look into that further. thanks for the tip, any brands material specific to look for?

tedd47

06-16-2003, 09:47 AM

Yeah, you're right about glass not being collapsable. Also now that I think about it I don't think that it would be a viable solution for water storage over a long period of time. It will seap, I have built canoes and kayaks and they are water proof but if there is a spot with less resin it will seap and warp your plywood. Also, if you try to seal the seams with sillicone only they will split out, it isn't a very strong adhesive. You would probably have to use something else under it.

I don't know the trade name of rolled roofing, there are two different types, one has gravel or sand glued to one side, you want the all rubber type, I think what I use is 60 mil which is pretty darn thick. You might have to talk the distributer through it to make sure they have what you want. It is used to cover flat buildings then they put gravel over it.
Using it you could build any kind of structure you would like, get enough rolled roofing to overlap about 6 inches and staple the overlap to the outside of the structure. Just make sure the structure will support the water. Hope this helps, Ted

Rod Coleman

06-19-2003, 07:39 PM

Hi limige

I bought a 200 gallon poly tank built for rainwater storage and got it about half price as a second from the manufacturer. Some of the tanks have walls that aren't uniform thickness but still plenty strong enough. Mine is cylindrical but there are flat tanks intended for wall mounting and one (or two) of these could do the job for you.

I installed a thermostat and heating element through the side, put a float valve on the top inlet and a little boomer of a pump on the bottom outlet. The whole thing is in an insulated box outside the house with a hinged roof so I can get a look in and wash out if needed. Heats on cheap rate at night. Works great. ;D

Regards
Rod

limige

06-22-2003, 05:19 AM

hehe, outdoors in michigan would not work! lol

thanks for the thought,
anyway, i should be finishing it this week, yesterday i went to meijer and got a pool liner on clearance!!

get this $15! so tomorrow i will buy the plywood and see about setting this up, i'm gonna buy two more 2x4's and some styro for insulation.

in the end cost should be around $40-50 for 300 gallons of water storage ;D

tony1313

06-22-2003, 10:22 AM

Hey limige, It's good to see a fellow MI/eastsider posting at simply. I'm in SCS(just down the road). It sounds like you'll have quite the water storage(300gal) system, that's gonna be pretty heavy. Hope you make the frame heavy duty! Please post pics when available.
Tony

limige

06-24-2003, 01:25 PM

ok, it's finally done, costed alittle more than anticipated but i'm happy with it. here's an estimate what i have in it.

(8) 2x4x10's $2.50each
(2) 4x8x3/4"CDX plywood $15 each
(1) 4x8x 1/2"CDX plywood $10
1 bottle of gorilla wood glue $8
(2) sheets of 1/2" pink styrofoam $8 each
lots of 3 1/2" deck screws $5
100% virgin vinyl pool liner $15

frame is constructed with the 2x4's, wood glue and screws.
the bottom is the 1/2" CDX that lays directly on the ground and is screwed to the frame, the 3/4"CDX is used on the inside for sides, also screwed to the frame and the whole
inside is lined with styro then the pool liner is laid inside.

finished inside dimensions are 27x33x60" i haven't calculated the actual gallons yet.

limige

06-24-2003, 01:28 PM

here's a shot of the framework

limige

06-24-2003, 01:28 PM

and one of how everything is layered

limige

06-24-2003, 01:29 PM

and one shot of the bottom

ronrca

06-24-2003, 02:31 PM

Sweeeett! Looks good! I like it! I plan on doing something similar in a closet someday. Line the walls with 3/4" plywood, styrofoam and liner. Thanks for the pics. Keep us posted how it holds up. ;)

You have around 231.4386G US!

daninthesand

06-24-2003, 02:45 PM

very cool.

It would be great as a growout tank!

Daniel

Rick_May

06-24-2003, 03:29 PM

i see your piggies!

great job, I'm thinking of doing the same but line it with fiberglass. Anyone know if the pink insolation will melt if in contact with fiberglass resin? I'm guessing it will.

limige

06-25-2003, 01:29 AM

rick i'm pretty certain that the styro would melt. but you can line the styro with alum. foil first then layer the fiberglass, that will work, just lay your first layer of cloth and soak it with resign then continue, you may want to consider uses some fleece instead of all cloth, cloth can get expensive, alternate between cloth and fleece. make sure to get it quite thick. like 3/8-1/2".

Rick_May

06-25-2003, 10:35 AM

What weight of cloth do you think? Do you really think it needs more than one or two layers? I’m asking because I just finished a sailboat built like a tank inside-out and the plans only called for one layer of 4 oz cloth and three layers of resin and a final layer of gel coat. We put and extra layer on the seams using fiberglass tape strips, but that wasn’t even called for. I’m wondering if people that put multiple layers aren’t over killing the situation.

When I was building the sailboat I didn’t find fiberglass that expensive. The cloth was only $4.30 per yard for 50” width and the resin was $18.50 a gallon so to do a tank 48”X 24” X 24” you would need about 6 yards of cloth, and a gallon or two of resin. That’s only 25.00 in cloth and 20.00-40.00 in resin.

tedd47

06-25-2003, 05:01 PM

Were you using Bondo type resin or watercraft resin? they are two different things, the watercraft resin is much more expensive, and usually has one bottle of resin and one of hardener instead of a big bottle of resin with a small tube of hardener (Bondo). The watercraft resin is also the most durable, I have made 3 flat bottom canoes, the first with Bondo and the other two with the good stuff, it's worth the money for the increased durability and waterproofing abilities. The bondo brand is made for automotive applications and isn't meant to be submerged for long periods of time. After two seasons of only occasional wetting I had to sand the paint off of my Bondo resin canoe and refinish it with watercraft resin because the plywood was starting to lift.

The glass cloth has no waterproofing abilities on it's own, the cloth increases the strength and durability of a craft (boat) that's why you use multiple layers of cloth at stress points. Paint the vessel with the resin and let it semi dry, then wet your cloth and place it on the wood, work out the air bubbles and wrinkles with a paint stir stick. When this dries put at least 2 layers of resin over the glass cloth, that should be all you need. Also only work a small section at a time, I would usually work 3 feet or less at a time on the canoes, let this semi dry and start the next 3 feet. In hotter temps fiberglass resin gives off really bad fumes, gets super hot and drys very quickly. If you put multiple layers of cloth all you are doing is adding weight to it. Hope this helps, Ted

Rick_May

06-25-2003, 06:28 PM

Well, now your going beyond what I know but here’s a link for the stuff I was using. http://www.shopmaninc.com/polyesters.html its called Polyester Resins, when we bought the stuff this is what the salesman said he used for watercraft. Theirs also a epoxy resin that is mixed at 2:1, 3:1, 4:1 depending on the time you want to work it. But the one I used came in two bottles one small like 6oz one gallon size. We applied it like you said. I thought it was pretty easy to do.

Here’s a picture of a boat like the one I built. I really need to take some pictures of mine.

limige

06-26-2003, 12:41 AM

well i do have a limited experience with it. mostly i'm into car audio, we built boxes using fiberglass. most audo installs use fleece instead, i believe it's somewhat cheaper, holds more resin and is smoother thus less sanding. people building sub enclosers layer it to 3/4-1" thick.

now i have seen some commercial 500 gallon water storage units made from glass that were about 3/8 thick i think. i prefer some overkill myself, i guess it all depends, how many gallons you plan to hold, and if you want to make a wood frame to glass around. if your only making a liner supported by a frame you could probably due with 2 layers. but if you want a freestanding all fiberglass unit i would go 3/8" or so.

but again, i have limited experience with it.

tedd47

06-26-2003, 09:50 AM

That's a great sail boat, I put a mast and outriggers on one of my canoes, it will absolutely fly, just make sure you have a life jacket for those tight turns. Poly resin is the weaker of the two it also gives of the worst fumes and heat. Epoxy resin is more expensive and what I would recommend for something that is meant to hold water full time. With a boat, it is out of the water more than it is in. Good luck, Ted

limige

07-17-2003, 06:34 PM

thanks i figured that, alittle less than i wanted, i should have bought more wood, i was trying to use as much as possible and reduce scrap.

it's working awesome though, doing lots of wc's now and have 3 females laying eggs. one, my cobalt has finally paired with my BD, i've been waiting for this every since last fall when i got the bd.

so i'm a happy camper, i need to add a water spout for tank cause it takes forever filling with a garden hose. lol.

ronrca

11-12-2003, 11:05 AM

I know, I know! This is an old thread however I very good diy water storage thread! Ever since I read this thread, I knew that I would be constructing my own storage container like this one! I also wanted to sticky it for a long time! ;) ;D

limige

11-14-2003, 02:19 AM

wow, cool, i got stickied! lol

i've been very happy with my storage tank. i'm now using it for a flushing system on my breeder tanks, a rack of 14 29 gallon tanks, i'm going to fill it half way and let the R/o filter fill the other half. bought some muratic acid to adjust ph slightly and the r/o waste is going to be used as a drip system on my growout tanks!!

;D ;D

also works as temporary aquarium in case of power outage or if you need to tear down tanks!

lauris

11-21-2003, 01:28 PM

Just came across this thread and its just the kind of thing I was thinking of cobbling together myself. My dimensions would be taller, as in 5' tall by 3'X3'. Does anyone see any structural issues that would be different than those encountered by limige? Would a well-built 2X4 frame work for the above dimensions?

Smokey

11-25-2003, 05:09 AM

Good Question - lauris.[?]

This vessel could hold ~233.7 u.s. gallons of water. At 7.8 pounds per gallon - the weght may be as heigh as 1,823.375 pounds. definately not for the second floor! lol... Almost a full ton.

The pressure on the lower 2x4's could be extreme. The fasterners used, have to hold every thing together.

Heck, build it and let us know how it works out. If nothing esles it will be a great grow-out vessel.

Smokey
P.S. - remember - a common house-hold door has only 24'' clearance. Check it out with a tape measure.

Denny

11-25-2003, 11:06 PM

Hi Lauris,

Yes you can make one that size out of 2x4's. I would use 3/4" h.d particleboard that was glued and screwed together and then reinforce with the 2x4's like in the pictures.

limige

11-26-2003, 11:46 PM

i would suggest running several 2x4 rings around the bottom, all the pressure runs outward at the bottom half. make your side frames, your end frames and run several rings of 2x4's around the outside. glue and screw the rings, sides and ends seperately and assemble. using plywood distributes the stress more evenly and makes everything more rigid, as smokey said, definitely a lot of wieght, must be on a cement floor, not a second floor.

lauris

11-27-2003, 12:02 AM

I appreciate the commentary. I have a weird little alcove area where i could build this type of storage "tank" and I may need to as I get more fish and start filling up the empty tanks that are now my aging vessels.

Limige, if you know, should the 2X4 "rings" at the bottom of this thing be constructed with narrow or wide side against the side panels. This would be in the basement, right over a drain (not that there wouldn't be a heck of a splash/surf should it let go).

Finally, I would have fairly easy access through a nearby scrap steel yard to lengths of steel bar, say 1/4" thick and an inch or two wide. If i ran these as 'rings' with the ends bolted to each other at each corner, would they provide more support than a 2X4? I realize strength would have some to do with the composition of the metal, but is there any general rule regarding equivalent strengths, as in steel of x dimension provides the same or better support than a 2X4?

Ardan

11-27-2003, 12:17 AM

I believe the 2 X 4's would not have as much flex as the 1/4 X 2 steel bars.(if in a rectangle, however if it is made in a circle, the metal will be stronger) the 2X4's are stronger if you put the board sideways, however It looks pretty strong the way it is.
I work with metal for a job every day. :) ;)
However the metal would never split or break, the 2 X 4 over time ( if it gets wet and dry etc) might. (but it would take a long time.)

Ever since I saw this thread I have regretted the day I threw out the liner from the kids old swimming pool. I hate to throw stuff out, but in my recent years (after I moved and saw all the stuff I had accumulated ;D) I have started to keep the inventory a bit smaller, I think ;D

JeffreyRichard

12-15-2003, 06:06 PM

I built two large reservoirs (250 gallons and 1000 gallons) that worked pretty well. I used POND LINER to hold the water, and framed them with 2x4s/6s and plywood. I had these built into my racks under my tanks.

The only problem I had was the big Reservoir leaked because I used bulkheads to run a pipe to my external pump. I couldn't seal the bulkhead well ... In retrospect I'd use a submersible pump next time to minimize complications.

IMO Pond Liners are ideal ... flexible yet strong.

ronrca

12-15-2003, 07:05 PM

Cool! Thanks Jeff! Do you have any pics? ;)

MonkeeFish

12-15-2003, 10:20 PM

If this thread is still alive and not dead yet
Using 2x4's u can build as much as 1700 gallon tank if u like
If u would like to see it i have a link
Of someone building this to keep sharks.

also the base is very important
Leaving it barebottom might be a problem someday
or maybe not i wonder ???

ronrca

12-16-2003, 11:17 AM

Now, now Monkeefish! First you tell us about the this incredible sized tank and then leave us hanging!

Of course we want the link! LOL! ;D ;)

MonkeeFish

12-16-2003, 07:58 PM

sorry Ronra i will post it rite now

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/diy_1700g_tank_1.php

that's the link enjoy
I am not sure how to put links in here
So juss bear with me and copy and past if it does not work

thanks
Johnny

limige

12-16-2003, 11:31 PM

truly awesome :o

thank you very much for the link, it's a work of art! too bad it's not on display for the public, at least he's got some pics up of it!

thanks again!

MonkeeFish

12-17-2003, 02:29 AM

It's no problem just hope everyone enjoy it

to us it's a work of art but if it was on display to the public
I think they'll juss say it's some crappy stuff
but i truly like it.

If anyone ever attempt to do this
By all mean please document it
better yet invite me over and ill help
: )

Bet everyone would love to be apart of a project like
that right??

ALSO DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW TO BUILD A BASE LIKE THAT
WITH THE CROSS OVER LIKE THAT AND ALL BECAUSE
I CANT REALLY FIGURE OUT HOW HE DID THAT

ronrca

12-17-2003, 12:03 PM

Wow! Thank you for the link! Its a wealth of info! ;)

Limige,
Just curious if the sides are bowing or not and it so, how much? Im planning on building something similar in a month or two but it will be located inside a closest! ;) Any tips or suggestions?

Im considering if I need to use 2x4s at all since it is inside a closest. Would using 3/4" plywood and 3/4" styrofoam be good enough for 3 sides, not including the front? Where the opening is, I would use 2x4s though! I can increase the volume by 30G by leaving out the 2x4s on the sides that are against the walls. ??? The dimensions Im looking at is 45"Lx17"Wx60"H (200G) with 2x4s around the whole thing. Without 2x4s on 3 sides, 48"x18.5"x60" (230G)!

Thanks!

JeffreyRichard

12-17-2003, 05:43 PM

Cool! Thanks Jeff! Do you have any pics? ;)

I don't have any pics ... I'm in the process of taking it down and redoing my room. I don't have it hooked up ... but it is pretty simple. The difficult part was designing the system to accomodate the flow methodology I was trying to create.

Originally I wanted a big resevoir to hold water for emergency purposes ... I have a tap water drip system, but in case I needed to treat/age the water, I wanted this resevoir. Keep in mind, I had 150 tanks/3500 gallons in my hatchery (mostly angelfish). I was running drip continously.

I never used the resevoir for 3 years. Finally, when I had fatalities from too much dissolved gas in the tap water during the winter, I used the resevoir as a place to age/degass. Basically, I fill the resevoir with tap water (hot and cold mixed to about 80 degrees). The input into the resevoir had a toilet plunger float valve that shut of the water flow once the water reached close to the top of the resevoir. Then, I had a Iwaki Water Pump that pumped the water out of the resevoir (opposite end) into my drip system plumbing and this dripped into my tanks. I solved the potential sync problem between the water flowing into the res and water being pumped out by using an electric float valve tied to the pump that shut the pump off once the water level dropped below a certain height (adjustable). The two flow valves made sure I never overflowed the res or pumped dry.

The resevoir turned out to be an ideal facility to degass the water ... the Toilet Float Valves actually spray the water int othe resevoir, and by the time the water was pumped out almost all the dissolved gas was removed.

I intend to build a smaller version under my exsiting tanks in a space 6 x 2.5 feet ... big enough to degass.

I used the other resevoir to peat filter water from my discus breeders ... I filled the resevoir with either tap or RO water, and circulated this through a 5 gallon bucket fillled with peat for a day or so. I could then pump the soft acid water directly into my discus tanks.

MonkeeFish

12-17-2003, 11:39 PM

Ronrca

Im just wondering but where is this "closet" located.
What i mean is it is on the 2nd floor of your house
If it's a two story house.

If your gonna build this on the 2nd floor
Good lucky buddy hope it wont fall down : )

They should build houses with basement again !!!!
Prefect place to keep fishes

Smokey

12-18-2003, 04:27 AM

Good advice.

Smokey
[??] - we all have to do everything at least once!!!

ronrca

12-18-2003, 11:32 AM

Im just wondering but where is this "closet" located. LOL! Its going to be in the basement! ;D

Another question limige! What kind of pool liner did you use? 100% virgin vinyl but what thickness? I have been looking around for some but its going to cost me like $300! :yikes: If that is the case, Im just going to buy a water storage tank!

shorthair

12-18-2003, 06:58 PM

Hey Ron, if you are interested I can order you a storage tank that is oval in design to fit through doorways. The measurements are 28"x35" around x 80" tall and holds approx. 200 gallons.

Devin

ronrca

12-18-2003, 07:47 PM

:yikes: :-*

Really? That would be just too cool! How much though? ;)
My closet I believe is 60"L x 25"W (I'll have to measure it once our tenant moves out). Not too certained about the height!

Thanks Devin! ;)

shorthair

12-18-2003, 07:51 PM

I beleive my cost is $205.66 and about 1 week to make

MonkeeFish

12-19-2003, 12:24 AM

Ronrca use roof lining??
Half the price but u gotta do a little work
to clean it first before using it

limige

12-19-2003, 01:39 AM

i'm not sure on thickness, i can check. originally this liner was priced at $160. but it was way more than i needed as well.

until i found the pool liner i was going to buy a roll of plastic sheeting, they make some that are pretty large like 10'x25' i think and it's pretty cheap but if memory serves me right those come in like a 3 mil thickness.

others have suggested rubber roofing and such, just find what suits your needs. i posted this to help bring ideas into peoples minds, someone could build it for next to nothing if they could find scrap lumber and an old pool liner. but if you buy the stuff new and a pool liner at full price you could pay quite alot.

so do your shopping around, try to find one for a small pool, like a kiddie pool or something, it doesn't have to be real thick, just something to seal the water in. you could also use two part epoxy paint as well like mentioned in the post for a plywood tank.

good luck.
mike

ronrca

12-19-2003, 11:28 AM

Thanks guys! ;)

Wow Devin! Thats a good price! I'll let you know next month though! I'll see if I can build one for cheaper using a liner. What about shipping just so I can compare the two prices, building or buying? Thanks Devin!

Mike,
3mm plastic would work too? Cool! Can I use the plastic that is used when insulating walls (just before adding drywall)? Or is it different? I just bought some yesterday. Comes in 500ft rolls!