Confessions of OverCrowding: Confess Here

[Bruce]

Okay - I can't be the only member of the board who understands the unusually high bio-loads discus place on an aquarium, and the unusually strict water quality requirements, and still insists on overcrowding the tank simply because discus look so much better in dense schools. And we all maintain discus for their looks right? Certainly its not because of their personality, intelligence, or ability to bond with their owners.

The 10g to 1 rule sounds like a nice, conservative # for beginners who don't know what they are doing. I'm a discuss beginner who doesn't know what he's doing either; but I'm now up to 20 discus, spread evenly from 3-5", in a custom 60g (proportions of a 10g).

I run an Emperor 400 and HydroSponge III, and an additional airstone for 90% surface agitation. I think none of this matters too much. I've become a water-change nut. Every 8 hours I change out 75% with stabilized/treated/heated/agitated water. I've increased the water storage size, doubled the outflow & refill capacities of my pumps, and enhanced the waste water plumbing to hit both the garden terrace and the sewage cleanout plug. I've adjusted my work, workout, family, social, and personal schedule in order to change water ("thanks for the promotion, Boss, but my fish comes first.")

So far, the test kits available to me as a hobbyist show virtually undetectable levels of ammonia, nitrite, nitrates, and chlorine just before a water change. I do the sniff test w/nose touching the water surface & can't perceive any odors at all. I might sound sick but I actually drank some of it to prove a point to my wife, and it was pretty much like bottled water, no taste, yet better tasting than tap-water (probably because of the chlorine in tap).

I intend to keep all the fish to adulthood, but if the water quality drops due to the increased bio-load as they grow larger, or if it visually looks crowded, I will be selling off the fish one at a time. Same solution would apply if my hours away from home become significantly longer. I even took an 8 day vacation w/ nobody looking after the fish, only an autofeeder set to one small feeding per day. Upon return the Am, NI, NA all stayed within the 2nd color swatches - for just 3-4 days I think its okay.

How are they doing?
Growing fast, fat, very active, a voracious appetite, good fin spread and coloring up nicely as they go through adolescence. Better than any I've seen at any LFS, and as good or better looking than some specimens I've seen at the two hatcheries I've visited. I feed them just as much as they'll eat every 2-3 hours when I'm home (exclusively CBW), and an autofeeder does the same w/ flakes/granuels for when I'm out of the house. I siphon poop 3 times/day with each water change. (lotsa food = lotsa poop!)

Come-on everyone, 'FESS-UP ! Describe your load & how you deal with it. I'm not condoning overloading, just want to know what people's experiences are so I don't feel so alone.

[Notice that I didn't post this in the Beginners Forum?]

"Hi, my name is Bruce, and I'm a Developing Discus Addict . . . and I'm glad this group is here to help me through this time in my life . . ."

[dred]

ROTFLMAO,

Laughing because you sound just as novice as me. I think I'm laughing with the old Discus folks that are laughing at us both. Well, enthusiasm is fun, so ...

Yeah, my water changes every 8 hours. I think the discus in my more densly stocked tanks are happier, and look better.

Mine doesn't sound quite as aggressive; 24 Discus spread across 190 gallons. That is until you realize that 40 gallons are unoccupied (set up recently as a quarantine/ hospital to replace the quarantine that houses a pair); 30 gallons are dedicated to a single pair; 14 in a 65, and 8 in a 55. Till recently it was 17 in the 55 and they were very happy that way.

But, Bruce, I think you are as sick as I am. But it's fun.

One thing you might face soon. At that density, if you get mating behavior, you tank might explode in your face. Watch for it and be prepared to move out Discus two at a time. That's sorta how my pair claimed my former QT - they beat the snot out of everyone else till I could no long watch.

[discusnovice]

I must admit that I have an overcrowded 29G with (5) five 7/8 month old discus that I received on 02/14/2003. I have a Whisper 30/60 as well as two reverse Under Gravel Filters and a Magnum 350 as well. I also have a 12" air stone with a good supply of air. I only change 10% to 15% of the water daily and everything seems to be going fine.

The largest 2 are now 5" or so and have paired off and were giving their tankmates hell so I installed a divider two weeks ago and a little over a week ago the two spawned. I am told that at that age that the male is not fertile but they went through the motions of fanning & caring for the eggs, etc. but of course they did not hatch.

I feed Live CBW along with MYSIS shrimp and some Hakari pellets. I have no inclination to raise any fry and also realize that I have them in an overcrowded situation. As long as they are healthy I have no resason to change. From Day 1, Feb 14th I have only done the 10%-15% WC daily except for vacations and then they get no food and a dark room with lots of filtration. I have never found any indication of raised ammonia levels or nitrites or nitrates.

I know there are some on this site that think that we do is criminal in over crowding discus but I believe that good filtration is very important. I have been told on this site that you can get small discus to grow in a gravel bottom tank but my 5" pair would disprove that.

Everyone else needs to describe their overcrowded conditions and HOW they deal with it.

[angel12]

Im guitly of overcrowding I have 40 Gall planted Tank so allowing for displacment I have about 30 Gallons I have 2 filters inside the tank both providing large bilogical filteration my water change routine is 40% everyother day and on the 7th day a 10% water change in this tank I have 4 adults 5-6" and 14 tetras and 3 corries .. now before anyone goes beating me up I asked for 3 adults from the breeder and he told me that if I was going to get 3 I might as well get 4 he would Give me another for less than half the normal price .... he had a lot more than the 10 Gall rule to a tank
at the moment things seem to be going Ok But if I had my choice again I would stick to the 10 Gall rule it is there for a purpose and I can see why .. my fish beat the crap out of each other and luckily for me there are enough hiding places behind the plants for one or two of them to hide ....

im trying to convince er indoors that I need the extra tank to spread them out but im not doing very well so far :'( as going forward these adults have a few months left to grow on them and at the rate the most dominant is growing shes gonna be a monster everytime I look at her she looks bigger and bigger ..

So yeah im Guilty as charged but im not going to Gloat over it as for me its early days and I think I may be just waiting for a major power struggle and then im realy up against it

I personaly should have stuck to my Guns as im very very new at this and ive got the feeling im gona learn the hard way :-\

[RAWesolowski]

Guilty!

5 discus in a 30 gallon planted aquarium with three bristlenose using an Aquaclear. Fish are 5", happy and healthy.

5 discus in a 36 gallon bow planted aquarium with 6 gold tetras, 4 bristlenose and an otocinclus using an Aquaclear and an Eheim Pro II. Fish are 5"+, happy and healthy.

Water change is 50% Thursday through Monday with CBW feedings 4x a day. Water changes are directly from the tap with Seachem prime. No CO2 but I use Seachem product for plants weekly.

Only fatalities have been three suicides. Two jumpers and one that fried himself behind a heater.

[Zeb]

It never seizes to amaze me the varied results people get from different situations.....

just goes to show that sometimes the rules can be broken.

( My discus tank is very understocked....in fact, it's non-existent! ) Discus the cheap way!

[Carol_Roberts]

The secret to overstocking is the strict attention to water quality. How many people are willing to do three water changes on a tank every single day?

I've done twice daily 75% water changes growing out babies, but did not like it - it's worse than a milk cow, lol. Now I cull down to a reasonable amount for a 55 gallon early and change water once a day.

Maybe when I retire I can fit in more water changes . . .

[ReeferKimberly]

alright alright, seven full grown (7-8) inch huge discus in a 46 gallon bow, it's like 6am and i havn't slept yet or i would explain the whole thing. but there is my confession ;)
kimberly :-*

[dred]

Carol ... <LOL>.

Yeah, I think I know what you mean. Mine get three for a very, very strange reason. I decided once a day would be my minimum. So, I started practicing on some poor goldfish. I skipped my first day in the second week.

I still wanted discus, but failed my own test. So, I did like Captain Kirk at Starfleet and changed the game. Rigged me up an automatic change system that is timer operated <big smile>.

Now all I gotta do is pay the utilities every month. Hey, I know your not breeding till the fall, but if you send me some fry, I'll send half back all grown out <smiles>.

[chinoz]

alright alright im guilty too, i got 18 discus in a 75 gal tank right now. As for now im doing 1 50% W/C only at night before i go to sleep. But i know i have to do at least 2 50% W/C a day. I feed them every chance i get, Tetra bits, Hikary frozen bloodworms and of ofcourse CBW.


Will 1 50% W/C work everyone?

[RAWesolowski]

TnT,

The question are... What are the size of your fish? Planted or bare tank? Filtration?

Of course you have way too many in that tank. E-mail me so I can send you shipping instructions!

[Nightowl]

Hello all, I like to crowd some tanks of fish. With fish under 1 yr. old I find they eat insanely fast, and one tough guy doesn't control the food. Examples: 12 3-4.5" fish in a 38 gal., 6 adults in one 40 breeder, 9 in another, 11 in another, all 5"+ fish. If a tank starts to spin out of control I move everyone to a bigger tank, or if another pair forms in the 125g. then 2 or 3 other fish get moved in there after the pair is removed. As far as water changes go, I just always do whatever tank needs a w/c the most and ususally do 40%. Right now I have 22 fish in a 30 breeder! (36x18x12).... I missed a few w/c's recently but I generally do 10-12 gals. daily. All but two have grown nicely( I got them at about 2 cm., not counting tail) and started 17 of them in a 10g. tank, changing 2-4 gals. twice a day. This was = to two 35% w/c's roughly. A month later I purchased 7 Lep. SS and all the fish (the others are Green SS) got combined into the 30 breeder. I run this tank w/ two # 3 hydro-sponges & a millennium 2000 filter, which I just added 4 wks. ago as fish have grown and I needed a little help. Any food I put in tank is gone in about 2 minutes!!! Or less! Have to go out on a limb, but I personally rate nutrition as the most important aspect of discus keeping. I will definitely post some pics. of these fish when I can. Good luck to all........... Nightowl :vanish:

[chinoz]

RAWesolowski,

My discus are from 2"-3" now and its bare bottom. i started doing 50% of W/C when i get home and then another 20% when i go to sleep. hope this helps