Blue Manacapuru

[ChloroPhil]

Does anyone have pics of Blue Manacapuru discus?

We ordered some for my store from Tony Orso, but don't have any decent pics of them. I seem to remember them looking a lot like Royal Blues.....

Thanks,
Phil

[Tad]

Phil,
this is the best that I can come up with;

http://www.amazon-exotic-import.de/Gallerie/Diskuswildf%E4nge/Seiten/Manacapuru.htm

http://ww2.hemsida.net/discus/picture.aspx (see number 7)

HTH,
Tad

[ChloroPhil]

Thanks!

[petedaniels]

Blue manacapuru

[ping]

OMG.... it's so beautiful..... :o :o :o

Thanks Petedaniels.
Thanks for the link Tad.

Regards,
Ronny

[limige]

biotypical, could you email me or pm me info on where you are ordering them from? i'd like some info, thanks.

mike

[keith_cny]

Pete!

Where did you find that picture? I started looking for that last night after reading the post. Couldn't find it again. Would like to find someone who actually has some that look like that. Anybody know a breeder/importer who has any??

Keith

[Tad]

Keith,
I do believe that Pete's picture of the Manacapuru is from his personal collection. Pete from what I have seen has an extensive collection of beautiful wilds...

HTH,
Tad

[keith_cny]

Thanks Tad,
He must have posted the picture somewhere else also then...say like on DAAH. I know I have seen that picture before. Even my wife and daughter were impressed with the fish when we ran across it a month ago or so. They want me to get some just like it. Looks like that one is on the other side of the big pond though...right?? I would like to hear where Pete acquired it from, if possible.

Thanks again,

Keith

[Tad]

Keith,
Heres an earlier post by Pete with many pics of his wilds...Very impressive collection....One to die for :o

HTH,
Tad

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=11;action=display;threadid=10711

[keith_cny]

Thanks alot Tad, Great response time.

Where are you from and what strains do you raise?

[Tad]

Keith,
Left Coast...Central California....Originally from the Monterey Bay Area.... ;D.....Currently into an array of domestics from Tangerines to Snakeskins...but I am making a conversion over to Wilds only ;)

Regards,
Tad

[April]

That fish is very nice indeed.
I have a manacapura x alencer that Rod Lewis made for me that looks very close.

[petedaniels]

Hello Keith
The manacapuru was one of my fish but i sold it a couple
of weeks ago. Most of my wilds come from a german source
and he only gets top quality wilds in so i am lucky i can
usually have the pick of them.
Thanks for the kind comments Tad, hope alls well with you
and your fish ( how are the curipera coming on )

pete

[Rod]

Hi,

This discus at the front is a manacaparu discus i bought from germany. It is not a wild fish. The wild royal blue variant of the manacaparu discus is a rare color mutant, most of the ones we are likely to buy will be more like that beautiful fish pictured above.

April, that discus of yours is stunning. Any time she needs some R and R in sunny queensland, she has a good home here ;D

[wildthing]

The Rio Manacapuru is very close to manaus & it's Discus are consequently amongst the cheapest.
It is also the dumping grounds for any fish that are 'overcaught' ie: more caught than could be sold must be returned to the river & that is the nearest place to do it cheaply.
The result of this is IMO that there is really no longer a true Manacapuru Discus as most of its population now originated in other rivers. The quality has also dropped because obviously it is the lesser quality fish that are unsold & so returned to the river. In the last few years literally tens of thousands of Discus have ben returned to it, this has been happening for a long time.
I have doubts that anything purchased by the box purportedly from there will be anywhere near as good as the fish in the photo ( which I would suggest is a color fed fish & a 'posterized'* photo) .
Please understand that a blue discus is a blue discus no matter where it comes from.
There are grades of blue discus ( in terms of markings) ...the highest being 'Royal' which denotes full 100% body striations...then there is 'Pearl' which has good striations & 'pearling' in the middle of the body' then there is 'Gypsy'. which has striations running the length of the body but no colored scales in the middle of the body ...then there is 'common' which have a few striations on the forehead. If they are not 'Royals' then they are most probably ' common'.....& from a breeders perspective they are fairly useless. Most if these fish are what end up in the LFS.
Whether a fish is good or bad depends not only on the quality of the fish but also what it cost....what is a great fish for $50 is also a terrible fish for $200 ( I hope that makes sense ??? :)

* posterizing occurs when a higher rez photo is downsized to a lower rez in cheap imaging software.

David

[lkleung007]

Interesting post Dave and very informative!!! :)

Regards, Lester

[petedaniels]

David
I hope you are not reffering to the pic of my fish if you are
you are wrong, i do not colour feed my fish and they are the
true colours of the fish. It is an e-mail size pic of the fish i
do not use cheap imaging software so there is no posterizing as you would put it. Please do not comment
on my fish in that way as you know nothing of how i keep
and look after them.
an apology would be accepted

pete >:( >:( >:(

[oodi]

Pete,

If that is one of the pics that I helped you out with, I can vouch for the fact that NOTHING was done to edit the pic... it was only resized to be able to post on the forum.

Judi
:)

[Tad]

Pete,
good to hear from you ;).....My Curipera are doing great and coloring up each week more to my expectation ;D...
Do you have pics of your recent acquistion of Curipera?? Every time I look at your green backgrounds makes me want to consider doing at least one tank in that manner as it highlights a fish exceptionally well. Best of luck with your wild collection!

Respectfully,
Tad

[wildthing]

ahhh Pete,,,dont be so hypersensitive....no offence was intended......

I am a professional photographer in NYC & before that LA & London, Paris & Milan for nearly 20 years . I use professional digital cameras & photoshop as part of my trade. I ( have to) use color temperature meters all the time because percieved colors change dramatically throughout the day if out doors, morning noon & night are 3 different colors & for many uses color correctness is absolutely critical. the difference in color between sun in & sun-behind-cloud are huge. Indoor lighting has even more variables.
If you do not color correct your photo it is 100% inevitable the the colors will not be true. Merely resizing causes red shift & pixelation leading to posterization. Every brand of camera will represent colors slightly differently as they try to " cheat" t obtain better , more true colors. Every brand of film will do the same, there are noticable differences between different batches of the same type of film even from the same manufacturer. Different film processors ( labs) produce also differing results depending on their chemistry, how often they refresh it, what ratios & what temperatures they use. Scanning film to digital will also produce a color shift...usually towards red. the 'E6' process will produce different colors to the C41 process ( pos & neg film )
All digital cameras posterize colors to an extent this is simply the unavoidable nature of digital...the lower # of megapixels the more it happens...cheaper cameras have cheaper lenses, with cheaper coatings which do not accurately reflect colors. The digital system itself affects the colors a lot, each brand hasots own software that is different in results to other cameras. the differences between pro-end Nikon & Canon are remarkable....let alone the consumer end ones.
Exposures that are even slightly 'off' change the apparant colors, as does using 'display ' lighting on your tanks to photograph them. the background & the bottom of the tank all reflect light in the color of the surface of that background, also affecting the percieved color of the fish.
If your fish is truly that color in " critical daylight" ( 6000-6500 degress kelvin at noon on a clear day) then it would be originally graded as a red & not a blue.
Even using photoshop, the ultimate photo software..this happens, hence why it has all the curves & filters & balances to correct this.
The human eye & also film represent colors on an infinite scale of gradation. A good computer will see in millions of colors most of you have computers that only see 256 colors...jpegs are 256 colors & jpeg software always makes things more red.

If you re-read what I posted earlier I said I doubted any fish bought by the box would look like the one in the photo...I meant this because you have a very nice fish there......
Sadly these days more than ever & increasingly with wilds , sellers are using incorrect or plain invented names to sell fish, not that the name should matter at all, a good fish is a good fish no matter where it is purported to come from, but nor should a buyer be fooled.


The old expression about 'the camera never lies' is one of the biggest lies in itself.....The camera ONLY lies would be much more true.

I hope this helps your understanding of my opinion a little better.


David

[Tad]

Dave,
Great information on color replicated through a lens....

I also believe in what you say about "names" of wilds....In recent dialogue with Oliver he puts it as simple (maybe Im oversimplifying) as there are two types of Wilds...."Heckels" and "Non Heckels"

regards,
Tad

[brewmaster15]

Hi all,
Being an "Amateur hope to be Professional wildlife Photographer some day guy", and using Digital Imaging extensively in the Lab, I can attest to Davids explanation of the lighting and digital effects on Image color.


hth,
al

[April]

very interesting photo info. my camera for that fish was an slr. but i can say it does pick up red more than what youd see in rl. although that fish is very red. not as red as the outside pieces. i know if i take pics of baby alencers any red that is gonna show on them as they grow gets enhanced as babies. but kinda interesting as it shows their potential to turn red later on.
also interesting about manau being the dumping grounds and the different names of the blues and descriptions.
so my royal blue in my avatar by sounds of it sounds to me like a gypsy blue. her striations peter out in the center.

[petedaniels]

Yes david a very nice piece all about your knowledge in
photographic skills but you seem to have missed out on your extensive nowhow on how to spot a colour fed fish,
so if you could be a very nice chap and let me know in no
more than 50 words it would be appreciated ::)

pete

[petedaniels]

Hello Tad
Very pleased to here your curipera are doing well, mine are
now feeding very well it took about 3 weeks for them to settle in properly so i will take some more pics soon, just
as soon as i have given them plenty of colour enhanced
food ;D ;D

pete

[Tad]

Pete,
LOL....I know from my experience with a camera I never can do justice to the beauty of the fish with my photo taking skills ;)....seems like I wash out more color in my pictures ???....Im glad that your Curipera are settling in....from what I recall they were looking quite nice upon acquisition/arrival and should be awesome looking by now. Looking forward to seeing more of your wild collection...

Highest regards,
Tad

[wildthing]

If you re-read what I posted earlier I said I doubted any fish bought by the box would look like the one in the photo...I meant this because you have a very nice fish there......
I hope this helps your understanding of my opinion a little better.


David



Pete, I thought it was evident that I was being complimentary about your fish. Where's the beef?
If you look at the ingredients list of 90% of fish foods, especially discus specific ones ( hikari, Tetra etc) , you will see most of them contain ( natural) color enhancers. There is nothing wrong with this . I did NOT say you were using hormones for color. & if you re-read my earlier post you might notice I use the word " IF" ....

If you accept that with 20 yrs experience as a photographer I know what I am talking about on that subject then how about my 10+ years experience with wild discus?


David

http://wilddiscus.com

[brewmaster15]

I'm currently looking for a way to add face to face video conferencing to the site. For some strange reason I Think it might help minimize misunderstandings ;):)

-al

[petedaniels]

David
The only beef i have is the one in the freezer for the fish ;)
I know your web site well, its on my list of favourites.

pete

[brewmaster15]

Then again maybe I can forgo the vid conferencing for a while. :)

-al

[petedaniels]

Its a jolly good idea though 8)

pete

[ChloroPhil]

David,

Didn't I see the article on your site in a TFH? I must have read that one a dozen times...